Why COH will not get a server emulator.

[herostar]

SEGS is aiming at Issue #3, IIRC

This is awesome, especially if people from CoHTitan are involved. I found the SEGS thread on here, but that's about it, sounds like   they arenlt really promoting much info yet. Is there any other information out there?

[Aggelakis]

This is awesome, especially if people from CoHTitan are involved. I found the SEGS thread on here, but that's about it, sounds like   they arenlt really promoting much info yet. Is there any other information out there?

Titan has nothing to do with SEGS. SEGS is one dude AFAIK.

[Lightslinger]

A CoH private server has been my soap box since the announcement of the closure. To Codewalker, Leandro and anyone else working on the continuation of CoH, thank you in the most sincere way.

This is our best hope at getting CoH or anything like it back, I'm no coder but when the time comes ill be glad to help however I can.

[Black Gold]

I was just wondering how a "theoretical" compatible server for CoH might hypothetically coming along. I might certainly be interested in it....hypothetically speaking.   

[Victoria Victrix]

Check the SEGS thread on the Save Paragon boards.  I believe nemerle has gotten it as far as being able to create a character and load into Outbreak, though not to move or anything like that.

[Nebularian]

The Project Z people seem to have at least a reasonable plan forward and some good ideas on how to generate a successor game that would at least play reasonably close to CoH.  And if they do their job correctly and the software itself is released to the community, other players could reskin its data - i.e. if either Project Z generates a playable game at all and they've correctly separated engine and data, even if the game they make isn't close enough to City of Heroes for you, someone else could come along and in effect reimplement a close copy of City of Heroes within the Project Z framework.

Oh boy,

We just finished a long discussion on this very thing in a thread in the Plan Z threads. To condense it all down (as I perceived it), neither TPP nor HaV are interested in making a clone or even a near COH clone. They are interesting in creating what might amount to a COH2, leaving the original COH behind. (mainly, I believe, for legal reasons). The Plan Z Devs are convinced that created a "clone" of COH would take just as long as making a new game from scratch.   Devs from both TPP and HaV have convinced me that, while they are not recreating COH, they hope to create games that will have the "feel" of COH but will, in no way, BE COH.  I am waiting anxiously for what they can produce, but I would not be expecting to get the original COH or even a close facsimile from them.

[Absolute]

Oh boy,

We just finished a long discussion on this very thing in a thread in the Plan Z threads. To condense it all down (as I perceived it), neither TPP nor HaV are interested in making a clone or even a near COH clone. They are interesting in creating what might amount to a COH2, leaving the original COH behind. (mainly, I believe, for legal reasons). The Plan Z Devs are convinced that created a "clone" of COH would take just as long as making a new game from scratch.   Devs from both TPP and HaV have convinced me that, while they are not recreating COH, they hope to create games that will have the "feel" of COH but will, in no way, BE COH.  I am waiting anxiously for what they can produce, but I would not be expecting to get the original COH or even a close facsimile from them.

That's unfortunate. Those discussions summarized the "Fight for CoH back" nicely though. All those players who want the original CoH back, who were scattered between all the different options, will gather to the only option left - SEGS private server.

Plan Z = 'Similar feeling' game
SEGS = Original version of the game

I invite people to download the client and try it out. After seeing/hearing the title screen, creating a character and loading into outbreak, I'm sure a lot of people will be certain whether they want to play a similar game, or the actual game.

 

[Nebularian]

That's unfortunate. Those discussions summarized the "Fight for CoH back" nicely though. All those players who want the original CoH back, who were scattered between all the different options, will gather to the only option left - SEGS private server.

Plan Z = 'Similar feeling' game
SEGS = Original version of the game

I invite people to download the client and try it out. After seeing/hearing the title screen, creating a character and loading into outbreak, I'm sure a lot of people will be certain whether they want to play a similar game, or the actual game.

Still haven't figured out how to get that going.....think I am missing something in the instructions LOL

[Aggelakis]

That's unfortunate. Those discussions summarized the "Fight for CoH back" nicely though. All those players who want the original CoH back, who were scattered between all the different options, will gather to the only option left - SEGS private server.

Plan Z = 'Similar feeling' game
SEGS = Original version of the game

I invite people to download the client and try it out. After seeing/hearing the title screen, creating a character and loading into outbreak, I'm sure a lot of people will be certain whether they want to play a similar game, or the actual game.

Why is it one or the other? Are you not capable of playing two games?

[houtex]

I can't multitask very well, so no, Aggelakis. 

Also, I find that the idea of two or more CoH like games I'd have to split my precious time with does NOT engender the good feels... I like the original.  Can't have it.  If three successors come out...

Well, as the words of the Highlander state, There Can Be Only One.  It'd be better to have a free trial so I can figure out which one I like though...

I'm also not downloading the 'semi-client' that is currently SEGS, as I just... well, it'd just hurt a lil' too much. 

Maybe later.  Maybe if they/he has more to do with it...

[MindBlender]

Not sure how close they could come to the original.  Sure, power pools could be very similar, but named to avoid infringement.  As long as the "play style" is like it was for almost 8 years of my life, I'm a happy camper.  I don't want to watch all my powers cooling down.  I want the easy communication.  I want super powers, whatever they may be.  I want a good looking environment (no cartoony CO).  Otherwise, I would consider BOTH plan Z offerings monthly.  Just a wait and see what comes out of the different ovens.

[Nebularian]

Okay, this is a bit...unusual    In the other thread, I was the one asking question after question and generally bugging the Plan Z people...now I find my self arguing THEIR case....go figure.

From what I gathered (and this was part was from GG), there was never any intention to clone COH for legal reasons.  Both Plan Z projects (TPP and HaV) have listened to what the DEVs of COH said over the years and are attempting to avoid some of the problems.  I do believe both are looking at the COH interface as a guideline for that portion.  AT's will have different names, and different power sets, but that is to be expected. One thing that got my attention was Downix's explanation of the differences in the COH powersets and the TPP proposed powersets.  Not from the users end, but from the other end.  It seems that AT's were not part of the original COH but were grafted on later (only you old timers would know that for sure, by the time I came along (about 2 1/2 years before the END) AT's were obviously already established). 
This caused some bandwidth problems because of how the powersets had to be handled. Both teams are, I believe, trying to avoid this.

In any case, neither will be the COH we knew and loved...but they will be games created by people that knew and loved COH just as much...

If SEGS does their thing (hoping they do...I wanna fly around Steel Canyon again LOL) or TF Hail Mary some how pulls a rabbit out of the hat and finds us a way to get COH back (fingers are still crossed - making it a bit difficult to type..but I manage somehow), we will be able to play the original....But when TPP and/or HaV get something out, we will have something to broaden our experiences without having to resort to CO (ugh) or DCUO (only slightly better than ugh).. and STILL have the original to play as well.

[Absolute]

Why is it one or the other? Are you not capable of playing two games?

I would definitely try both out to see which I prefer, but I don't have enough time or money to focus seriously on more than one MMORPG. That goes double for a lot of others.

[Arcana]

I am waiting anxiously for what they can produce, but I would not be expecting to get the original COH or even a close facsimile from them.

Consider how much City of Heroes has changed from launch to the end of 2012.  Had City of Heroes itself continued along until 2014 or 2015, say, plus or minus when I would expect to see playable code from either project, City of Heroes itself would not have been a close facsimile of City of Heroes.  So I think asking either project to recreate CoH exactly as it was on October 31st 2012 is asking way too much.  We didn't even hold the devs themselves to that standard.

Consider how different City of Heroes was at shutdown from when I first started playing it shortly after launch.

- Crafting (inventions)
- Auction Houses
- Villain content
- Side switching
- Bases
- Icon
- Respecification (planned, but did not exist at launch)
- Flashback
- Quick content (newspaper missions)
- Turnstile content (incarnate trials, special event trials, other trials)
- Zone events
- PvP
- post level-cap progression (Incarnate progression)
- Player generated content (Architect)
- microtransaction based content

And we know that additional major changes were coming to the game post I23.  LUA scripting of missions and events was being introduced which was going to create enormous opportunities to make more complex and interesting content.  LUA scripting had the potential to be a larger game-changer than inventions, auction houses, flashback, and incarnate content combined.

Some people really want to know if they will be able to play their Fire Blaster exactly as it was when the game shutdown in either Plan Z offering.  Probably not.  But that Fire Blaster also didn't play the same way as it did in I10, say, before the D2.0 changes.  It didn't play the same prior to I5 and the D1.0 changes.  It would not have played the same in Issue 24 due to the I24 blaster changes.  Most of us who played City of Heroes have gotten used to the fact that the technical elements change, but - for most of us if not all of us - the core feel of the game remained the same, and that's why we continued to play it.  I think its only fair to the Plan Z developers to reserve judgment on their efforts until we can actually play them.  Very few of us are really capable of accurately judging a game from a written description of it.


Plus, I think its interesting that some players are reluctant to play a "spiritual successor" that isn't identical to City of Heroes, but more willing to play a clone that replicates Issue 3 (SEGS).  Nothing against SEGS, but Issue 3 is probably more different from the game we were playing at shutdown than either Plan Z offering is likely to be.

[Mister Bison]

Have to agree here. Was my line in this very thread I think.

But...

And we know that additional major changes were coming to the game post I23.  LUA scripting of missions and events was being introduced which was going to create enormous opportunities to make more complex and interesting content.  LUA scripting had the potential to be a larger game-changer than inventions, auction houses, flashback, and incarnate content combined.

I just had an Architegasm. What would have it been if we had that scripting power for MA arcs.

Must. Happen.

[Absolute]

Nothing against SEGS, but Issue 3 is probably more different from the game we were playing at shutdown than either Plan Z offering is likely to be.

While that could be true, Issue 3 has already proved it's popularity, as it held every 6+ year vet from CoH (A lot of them).

The CoH population was settling to a point where it was mostly made up of veteran players and people who had played the game that existed in the first couple years after launch. It's hard to argue that Issue 3 was that much different from Issue +2/-2; it will undoubtedly be closer than either Plan Z.

To anyone who only joined in the past couple of years (2009-2010) and stayed with the game because of what the game had become, they may enjoy the other options more. To those who chose CoH over other MMOs even in one of it's original states (2004-2007), I think SEGS will be the preference.

And to anyone who loved City of Heroes, it's nice to not only 'read' about it's history, but actually relive it (The real phantom armies. Couldn't attack with Elude? OP Instant healing). That's something no other game can give people. As I said earlier, the choice really is between a similar game and the original version.

[Nebularian]

While that could be true, Issue 3 has already proved it's popularity, as it held every 6+ year vet from CoH (A lot of them).

And Arcana makes a good point.  I finally got the SEGS thing working...and was really disappointed. Why?  Well, I didn't realize the changes.  I could barely recognize it as something I played. (recall, I came into COH about 2 1/2 years before the shut down.  That was....what?  I19 or so?  The character creator changed after I started...but obviously it had already changed before...because if that was the creator from I3, it looked nothing like the Creator we had before the last version (unless my memory is faulty...which, at my advanced age, is not that far fetched LOL)

if SEGS decides to advance it up to closer to what it was at closing time, I might give it another shot...otherwise, it doesn't do a thing for me.

And so....with SEGS out of the picture...I guess my only hope lies squarely on TF Hail Mary......

[Nyx Nought Nothing]

While i played CoH from Issue 0 to shutdown i have no desire to go back and play Issue 3 again, even if it meant i could have 4-5 Fluffies running around again. The only "emulator" i would have any significant interest in would be one circa the live or beta servers at shutdown. (Preferably the beta servers; there was so much in there, including LUA and forcemove, that i wanted to see go live.)

i've been following TPP, and so far i have the impression that by the time the game goes live (fingers crossed) it will be analogous to what CoH probably would have been if it had continued. This is a good thing in my opinion. While i enjoyed playing CoH through every iteration there really aren't any versions i'd want to go back to instead of moving forward.

[Arcana]

Everybody remembers having fifteen imps and twelve phantom army running around, and few people remember that they couldn't enter or leave missions or even pass through elevators.    There's a reason controller superteams only ran outdoor maps back in the day: pets couldn't zone.  They also didn't snap to you, which made pets plus teleport sometimes an interesting affair, particularly if you had those indestructible pets like the PA or nearly so like Singularities.

For that matter I'm pretty sure Dark Armor players do not want to go back to the days when their armors didn't stack, and defense sets don't want to go back to the days when bosses had 75% base tohit (and AVs had 90% and inventions didn't exist).  And I think a lot of players would miss body sliders in Icon, and power customization.  Difficulty sliders.  Paper and scanner missions. 

Some of those things you could add in theory to an I3 backend, but some of those things you really can't add because the I3 client wouldn't support them (like all the advances to the costume editor which require client support for all of them).

[Ice Trix]

At this stage, it feels to me, that I3 would be a lot closer to the game I love than any of the spiritual successors.

I also thought a major reason SEGS was at i3? (actually I thought it was i7) had a lot to do with getting tired of making changes for every issue's updates. Which is no longer a problem :/