Author Topic: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...  (Read 118180 times)

BigAngry

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #180 on: September 03, 2012, 07:59:30 AM »
I don't want to take the wind out of the movement's sails, but a former dev, Graham West, confirmed here: http://city-of-heroes.livejournal.com/3561849.html?thread=44812665#t44812665 -- that NCsoft paid Cryptic $10mil for 50% of the license for the IP and the engine, indefinitely. Ten million dollars is more than a little out of reach, even for crowdsourcing. I don't think that'll be a viable avenue, sadly.

Mister Bison

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #181 on: September 03, 2012, 08:46:54 AM »
This was the cost then, now is another time, and also, we could settle for a definite time license, to offer a proper retirement for the game instead of how it's going to be "put down".

We can also just pay a license to exploit the game for them, giving them all the money we can make, in order to appeal more.
Yeeessss....

DamianoV

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #182 on: September 03, 2012, 11:22:50 AM »
All depends on how the suits view it, I suppose.

The effective value of the engine is $0, after all, sitting on a shelf collecting dust, and it's fairly dated to begin with.  Any future value of the IP drops with each passing day... nostalgia only gets you so far.

And this method of closing it down, while not the worst I've ever seen in the MMO world, isn't exactly going to put a high-gloss shine on NCSoft's reputation.  They could gain a lot of goodwill along with a bottom-line bump by agreeing to more of a "salvage" price.  (Note: I have no doubt any number will still be 7 figures... they have no real reason to bother with less.)

As has been said various times, first step is to see if they'll even bother talking...

Questx

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #183 on: September 03, 2012, 01:57:17 PM »
If you can get this off the ground I am willing to work as a mission architect and the like, if need be. I am in full support of your movement and have been following along as this has unfolded. If you need anything, I will do my best to assist. I will chime in if I feel I can offer any advice worth while.

dwturducken

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #184 on: September 03, 2012, 02:09:42 PM »
Some one on the official forum, in Tony's thread about coordinating efforts, no less, mentioned hitting magazine site tip pages.  Places like Massively, IGN, and the like.  This might also be an opportunity for one of those folks who have writing skills to do some freelance journalism to get some quotes from Tony and others and put something together.  I haven't done something like that in years, but it seems like an experienced researcher could have a story in the inboxes of the submission editors of Game Informer, Wired, EGM, etc. by the time they come in for work in the morning, right?
I wouldn't use the word "replace," but there's no word for "take over for you and make everything better almost immediately," so we just say "replace."

Zmar

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #185 on: September 03, 2012, 02:11:17 PM »
I agree with everything you are doing.  I have not read all the posts but,  I would like to give you a couple of things to ponder.   Given the time frame,  I think you should have a two sided plan.  Part One would incorporate all efforts to gain info/monies/man power and purchase CoH by the Titan Team.   The second which would need to be implemented at the same time would be to have a team contact someone that holds this type of game / creativity close to their heart.  Someone that has contacts in the field and someone that might be able to find the investors to save CoH.   I am thinking that one person that fits this model is Stan Lee.   Although he has had his ties with Marvel,  I believe he might be able to look past Marvel to see the possibilities of owning CoH and I am sure his heart would be in it.   Your thoughts ???    Either way,  we need to gain as much info from the Paragon Devs to help us.   

I have been able to find some minimal contact info for Stan Lee:
Stan Lee c/o POW! Entertainment, Inc.
9440 Santa Monica Blvd.
Suite 620
Beverly Hills, Ca.  90210-4608

I am told he is using twitter but ,  that is probably a PR person that sends msgs. for the client.   
Please post any info you might have and I will take the time and spend the $$$$ to make the contact.   Thanks in advance for any help. 
                                                           
« Last Edit: September 03, 2012, 07:27:31 PM by Zmar »

Codewalker

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #186 on: September 03, 2012, 02:57:42 PM »
This was the cost then, now is another time, and also, we could settle for a definite time license, to offer a proper retirement for the game instead of how it's going to be "put down".

From an accounting perspective, however, it was put on the books for $10m, so it's a $10m tax write-off if they just drop it from their assets. At least in the US, tax law in Korea may be different.

They might agree to sell it for less if they're desperate for cash.

Mister Bison

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #187 on: September 03, 2012, 03:37:16 PM »
From an accounting perspective, however, it was put on the books for $10m, so it's a $10m tax write-off if they just drop it from their assets. At least in the US, tax law in Korea may be different.

They might agree to sell it for less if they're desperate for cash.
And if they sell it, it's only worth the price.

I still can't believe they pay 10m taxes though. Depends on which subsidiary/mother holds this precise license. They can't play ball like that for any amount.
Yeeessss....

Naruchico

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #188 on: September 03, 2012, 03:42:56 PM »
Heyo everybody I know somebody already mentioned it but S.E.G.S is definitely still alive and making progress, I've been talking to the guys down there and they are working on movement and map server stuff and making progress, what they really need is more coders seems they only have a few if they got a boost in coders they could get alot done faster.

So if you think about it they already have a strong start they just need the backup and it wouldn't take anywhere near as much effort than starting from scratch.

Head to their forum and let them know if you want to help, or head to their IRC I'll post links to both!

Forum: http://segs.nemerle.eu/forumz/index.php
IRC: http://segs.nemerle.eu/forumz/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3&p=955&hilit=IRC#p955

Please help these guys out, they are definitely our future in COX!

dwturducken

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #189 on: September 03, 2012, 03:49:10 PM »
The "Angel" is an idea, though I highly doubt anyone from DC would want to be seen as disloyal to their brand, namely DCUO. I can't think of anyone with the kind of name recognition The Man carries, but Marvel may have a sour view of this brand as well.  It all depends on how they would want to look in this.  It may be better for them to stay out of it altogether.

Pie-in-the-sky, they buy it, but it's more of a DC-style world, what with the city that doesn't really exist and all. Marvel Studios has a lot of creative freedom under Disney, so far, though.

One other person who might have contacts would be Abraham Benrubi.  He used to play, according to things he said back during the first few issues, but I have no idea if he still does.
I wouldn't use the word "replace," but there's no word for "take over for you and make everything better almost immediately," so we just say "replace."

LowlyOne

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #190 on: September 03, 2012, 03:51:32 PM »
That is unfortunate. Is it C proper? C# or C++? If it's C, or C++ we might be able to recompile for CentOS. However, if it's C#, we're definitely stuck with windows machines.

As DamianoV said it is old school C which I prefer over C++ or C#. I have been programming for a long time.

Manga

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #191 on: September 03, 2012, 04:02:08 PM »
I don't want to take the wind out of the movement's sails, but a former dev, Graham West, confirmed here: http://city-of-heroes.livejournal.com/3561849.html?thread=44812665#t44812665 -- that NCsoft paid Cryptic $10mil for 50% of the license for the IP and the engine, indefinitely. Ten million dollars is more than a little out of reach, even for crowdsourcing. I don't think that'll be a viable avenue, sadly.

City of Heroes was at the peak if its success back then, and could demand a huge price.  While it's profitable and a steady performer right now, it's not worth nearly as much.

Vak

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #192 on: September 03, 2012, 05:00:44 PM »
I agree with everything you are doing.  I have not read all the posts but,  I would like to give you a couple of things to ponder.   Given the time frame,  I think you should have a two sided plan.  Part One would incorporate all efforts to gain info/monies/man power and purchase CoH by the Titan Team.   The second which would need to be implemented at the same time would be to have a team contact someone that holds this type of game / creativity close to their heart.  Someone that has contacts in the field and someone that might be able to find the investors to save CoH.   I am thinking that one person that fits this model is Stan Lee.   Although he has had his ties with Marvel,  I believe he might be able to look past Marvel to see the possibilities of owning CoH and I am sure his heart would be in it.   Your thoughts ???    Either way,  we need to gain as much info from the Paragon Devs to help us.

This is an interesting idea - not monetary, legal or programming firepower, but name recognition firepower. That's the sort of thing that gets you noticed by industry trade publications and the gaming community (that comments on 8,000 other boards we've never heard of). Stan the Man is an obvious choice. To that, I'd like to throw in well-known comics nerds like Kevin Smith and Joss Whedon. If you guys get a viable gameplan together, and just need it pushed, approaching this sort of audience with it would snowball the effort, and those two in particular have a history of listening to "guy on the street" voices. At the end of the day, Vak is a vigilante - it's all well and good to play the hero, but if we can get mileage out of shaming the archvillain into buckling, the objective is still met.

In the same vein, what other famous/infamous people do y'all know who've mentioned this game before?

On other notes - not a programmer; but if/when we get to the point of monetary contributions I will do what I can. I have been an active subscriber to the game for 97 months (oddly, I never moved off month-to-month) and have bought extra Paragon Points whenever a nifty item was up for sale. For around a year I had two active accounts going. I have dropped around $2K on NCSoft. It would pinch but I would exceed that in one check if it could help to keep this dream alive. When I think of the dreams, friends and history, the expense is worth it.

Starkzilla

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #193 on: September 03, 2012, 05:35:01 PM »
This is an interesting idea - not monetary, legal or programming firepower, but name recognition firepower. That's the sort of thing that gets you noticed by industry trade publications and the gaming community (that comments on 8,000 other boards we've never heard of). Stan the Man is an obvious choice. To that, I'd like to throw in well-known comics nerds like Kevin Smith and Joss Whedon. If you guys get a viable gameplan together, and just need it pushed, approaching this sort of audience with it would snowball the effort, and those two in particular have a history of listening to "guy on the street" voices. At the end of the day, Vak is a vigilante - it's all well and good to play the hero, but if we can get mileage out of shaming the archvillain into buckling, the objective is still met.

In the same vein, what other famous/infamous people do y'all know who've mentioned this game before?

On other notes - not a programmer; but if/when we get to the point of monetary contributions I will do what I can. I have been an active subscriber to the game for 97 months (oddly, I never moved off month-to-month) and have bought extra Paragon Points whenever a nifty item was up for sale. For around a year I had two active accounts going. I have dropped around $2K on NCSoft. It would pinch but I would exceed that in one check if it could help to keep this dream alive. When I think of the dreams, friends and history, the expense is worth it.

Has anyone thought a bout contacting the guys behind Penny Arcade? They love stuff like this and might even give a shout out to help save CoH at their gaming convention, PAX, and on their website.

Ampithere

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #194 on: September 03, 2012, 06:30:20 PM »
In this sort of a time sensitive situation, I say when you think of someone to contact just do that yourself first then tell us you did. It's not really possible to make it worse. I would love to see the game saved but I suggest someone from Titan get in touch directly with the S.E.G.S. guys to see if there's any sort of data collection or anything us regular non coding types can do for them. Give me a tool to collect data and I'll run around the city gathering info until I drop dead at my keyboard if I have to.
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Codewalker

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #195 on: September 03, 2012, 06:37:00 PM »
I'm exchanging emails with Nemerle at this moment, trying to figure out the best way we can coordinate our efforts. :)

The goals are a bit different, as the RE project is aiming to reproduce the Issue 24 server, but I think there is definitely the possibility of collaboration.

Also, don't worry too much about time. Obviously, sooner is better, but at this point we know enough about the client that a server could be written, even if the NCsoft servers shut down today.

RavenRock

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #196 on: September 03, 2012, 06:55:26 PM »
I can't believe that this is even happening. I get back from a small break, and it's the worst news ever!

But if you need a 3D artist, I've had classes for it for a total of 5 years, I know Autodesk Maya pretty well, and have taken classes on Video Game Asset Design. If you need me to learn other programs, that's fine, just let me know so that I can get a headstart on it. I've also been taking illustration classes, and while I'm not great at it, I'll volunteer some work to keep such an amazing game alive!

nemerle

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #197 on: September 03, 2012, 07:22:35 PM »
Hi Guys

As Codewalker said, I certainly see possibility of combining our efforts
The extent of our collaboration depends very much on the actual outcome of the other, less developer-time intensive CoX saving approaches.




marquandDance

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #198 on: September 03, 2012, 08:21:03 PM »
I'd like to help in any way possible.
Should we be running packet sniffers or any other tools to gather info?

Codewalker

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Re: Meanwhile, in the Halls of Titan...
« Reply #199 on: September 03, 2012, 08:26:43 PM »
We probably have enough for the basics at this point.

However, if you can run a packet sniffer like Wireshark or tcpdump and are doing anything off the beaten patch, that could potentially be useful. Things like running Incarnate trials, using the LFG tool to start a Task Force, Ouroboros arcs, missions with cutscenes, claiming items from email / character rewards, base editing, all that stuff that you only do once in a blue moon...

I'm putting together a tool that will process the captures and decrypt the data for analysis. Just save the file in pcap format and it will be able to read it once it's ready.