Avengers:Infinity War. GO SEE IT

Dev7on · May 08, 2018, 08:55:22 PM

Then, explain the missiles. Why was Tony using missiles against Bucky? That's lethal enough.

Arcana · May 08, 2018, 09:15:12 PM

Quote from: Dev7on on May 08, 2018, 08:55:22 PM
Then, explain the missiles. Why was Tony using missiles against Bucky? That's lethal enough.

Explain why he didn't use the kind of missiles that actually explode with enough force to kill everyone within a wide radius when they detonate, as opposed to the kind that I can dodge by jumping behind a car door. Explain why he didn't use the full force of the arc reactor at any other point in the fight, when it could have easily vaporized a hole right through Bucky.

The Avengers were using lethal weaponry in Civil War also, but it is also clear they are not using their full capabilities. That stuff is lethal in theory, but they all know it isn't likely to be lethal against each other due to their capabilities.

If you want to argue that Tony was using lethal weaponry against both Bucky and Cap, sure, that's literally true. But if you want to argue he was actually trying to kill them, you have to explain why he wasn't trying even 10% as hard as he could have, and using weaponry he has repeatedly demonstrated his Iron Man suits are packing for when he really wants to eliminate a threat.

doc7924 · May 08, 2018, 09:37:22 PM

Quote from: Arcana on May 08, 2018, 09:15:12 PM
Explain why he didn't use the kind of missiles that actually explode with enough force to kill everyone within a wide radius when they detonate, as opposed to the kind that I can dodge by jumping behind a car door. Explain why he didn't use the full force of the arc reactor at any other point in the fight, when it could have easily vaporized a hole right through Bucky.

The Avengers were using lethal weaponry in Civil War also, but it is also clear they are not using their full capabilities. That stuff is lethal in theory, but they all know it isn't likely to be lethal against each other due to their capabilities.

If you want to argue that Tony was using lethal weaponry against both Bucky and Cap, sure, that's literally true. But if you want to argue he was actually trying to kill them, you have to explain why he wasn't trying even 10% as hard as he could have, and using weaponry he has repeatedly demonstrated his Iron Man suits are packing for when he really wants to eliminate a threat.

What I always found funny in Civil War is guys like Tony and Rhoadie and Vision are all for keeping super heroes and their powers in check - yet the fight at the airport that they basically start destroyed a whole bunch of people's cars, quite a few airplanes - Vision heat visioned that tower to collapse trying to stop Cap and Bucky and almost killed Rhoadie.

Dev7on · May 08, 2018, 11:09:34 PM

Quote from: Arcana on May 08, 2018, 09:15:12 PM
If you want to argue that Tony was using lethal weaponry against both Bucky and Cap, sure, that's literally true. But if you want to argue he was actually trying to kill them, you have to explain why he wasn't trying even 10% as hard as he could have, and using weaponry he has repeatedly demonstrated his Iron Man suits are packing for when he really wants to eliminate a threat.

I didn't say Tony was trying to kill both Cap and Bucky. He specifically was after Bucky. Captain America was just in his way. He didn't really wanted to hurt Rogers. During the fight you saw Iron Man temporarily immobilized Captain America. Then, he tried blocking him and, on the last moment he said "Stand down. Final warning" to Steve. That's why he held back a little.

doc7924 · May 09, 2018, 12:13:40 AM

Quote from: Dev7on on May 08, 2018, 11:09:34 PM
I didn't say Tony was trying to kill both Cap and Bucky. He specifically was after Bucky. Captain America was just in his way. He didn't really wanted to hurt Rogers. During the fight you saw Iron Man temporarily immobilized Captain America. Then, he tried blocking him and, on the last moment he said "Stand down. Final warning" to Steve. That's why he held back a little.

Well you know - When Captain America throws his mighty shield. All those who chose to oppose his shield must yield.

Arcana · May 12, 2018, 03:53:48 AM

Quote from: doc7924 on May 08, 2018, 09:37:22 PM
What I always found funny in Civil War is guys like Tony and Rhoadie and Vision are all for keeping super heroes and their powers in check - yet the fight at the airport that they basically start destroyed a whole bunch of people's cars, quite a few airplanes - Vision heat visioned that tower to collapse trying to stop Cap and Bucky and almost killed Rhoadie.

I've worked in security for over twenty one years. I've lost count of the number of times I've broken the literal letter of the law to protect people from other people who are breaking the law. It just doesn't involve blowing up airports, so far. But I can't argue with the notion that a lot of my career has an element of hypocrisy to it. Nevertheless, there are many things I've done over the years that I would not allow anyone else to do if I had any say.

doc7924 · May 12, 2018, 11:27:02 AM

Quote from: Arcana on May 12, 2018, 03:53:48 AM
I've worked in security for over twenty one years. I've lost count of the number of times I've broken the literal letter of the law to protect people from other people who are breaking the law. It just doesn't involve blowing up airports, so far. But I can't argue with the notion that a lot of my career has an element of hypocrisy to it. Nevertheless, there are many things I've done over the years that I would not allow anyone else to do if I had any say.

That was kind of the point I was making. Even if they all signed and obeyed the accords they would probably still be causing mayhem and destruction stopping bad guys, except I guess they would be legally protected by the UN, if they sent them in.

saipaman · May 12, 2018, 08:07:18 PM

Quote from: doc7924 on May 12, 2018, 11:27:02 AM
That was kind of the point I was making. Even if they all signed and obeyed the accords they would probably still be causing mayhem and destruction stopping bad guys, except I guess they would be legally protected by the UN, if they sent them in.

That's the reality of it. Battles between super-humans would be massively destructive. In the very short run, it would make way more sense to just pay super-villains a 7, 8, or 9 figure salary just to save the expense of constant rebuilding.

hurple · May 16, 2018, 01:20:42 PM

Quote from: saipaman on May 12, 2018, 08:07:18 PM
That's the reality of it. Battles between super-humans would be massively destructive. In the very short run, it would make way more sense to just pay super-villains a 7, 8, or 9 figure salary just to save the expense of constant rebuilding.

WooHoo! Thanks for the new business model.

saipaman · May 16, 2018, 06:12:43 PM

You're welcome.

Marine X · June 10, 2018, 04:52:56 PM

Just put this in your head and think it thru, including which actors are under contract for future films......

What if the people who vanished at the end of Infinity War are the Survivors?
What if the people remaining at the end are in the Soul Gem ( Soul World )?
This would make sense and would track with the Russo Brothers " Dead is Dead " comment,
was a Feature of the comic storyline and seemed to be where Thanos was at the end of the film.

Plenty of time to speculate till Avengers 4.

doc7924 · June 10, 2018, 05:14:34 PM

Quote from: Marine X on June 10, 2018, 04:52:56 PM
Just put this in your head and think it thru, including which actors are under contract for future films......

What if the people who vanished at the end of Infinity War are the Survivors?
What if the people remaining at the end are in the Soul Gem ( Soul World )?
This would make sense and would track with the Russo Brothers " Dead is Dead " comment,
was a Feature of the comic storyline and seemed to be where Thanos was at the end of the film.

Plenty of time to speculate till Avengers 4.

Could be but

Why would the ones that are still alive be the ones that turn to dust?

'Dead is Dead' could also be true but in comics death is never permanent - and if I recall from various "what if" stories involving the gauntlet, hero deaths can be reversed by either turning back time or using the reality gem to just bring everyone back.

I think Tony is the key - and is fitting since he basically started the current MCU.

Strange saw one outcome out of 14 million that they win. He also willingly gave up the time gem to save Tony's life.

So the logical assumption here is that Tony being alive is the key to reversing everything or at least bringing back the people that Thanos wished to the cornfield.

And since Strange saw the future he knew Tony wouldn't be one of the people that disappears.

So he was playing the 'lose the battle to win the war' strategy.

Arcana · July 08, 2018, 08:28:08 PM

Huge spoiler for Infinity War AND Ant Man and the Wasp. If you haven't seen either movie: recommend skipping until you do.

Spoiler for Hidden:

doc7924 · July 09, 2018, 02:02:26 PM

Quote from: Arcana on July 08, 2018, 08:28:08 PM
Huge spoiler for Infinity War AND Ant Man and the Wasp. If you haven't seen either movie: recommend skipping until you do.

Spoiler for Hidden:
Just saw Ant Man and the Wasp yesterday. I now know what Dr. Strange saw in the future. Everyone has been speculating about why Strange gave up the stone and the most popular running guess is that it was obviously to save Tony, who was being killed by Thanos. Tony is important to the future, so Tony had to be saved. I've never bought that idea, because its nonsensical. There are literally hundreds of ways for Strange to save Tony from being killed, starting with the most obvious way which was to simply teleport him away from the fight.

I think the reason why Strange saw only one future in which they win, out of the millions of other futures in which they lose, is because to eventually beat Thanos they have to fight him AND lose AND lose at EXACTLY THE RIGHT MOMENT. Strange knew that the only way they win is if they lose and he gives up the stone at exactly the moment he does. If he gives up the stone earlier, or if they fight Thanos and even beat him and Thanos eventually gets the stone later, they ultimately lose. But if events unfold in exactly the way we saw, Thanos arrives on Earth at exactly the right moment for him to face Thor, almost get killed by Thor, and create the snapture at the precise moment when Scott Lang is in the quantum realm. If the fight on Titan was any shorter Thanos would arrive on Earth earlier and the snapture would happen before Scott entered the quantum realm, and any later and he would have exited the realm. But this is the only future in which he is trapped there, and that was the critical thing that was required for Strange's winning vision to come to pass.

It seems obvious to me, but it didn't seem obvious to my friends when I mentioned the idea, so here it is.

I thought it was rather obvious. Strange must have seen the only way to win the war was to lose the battle.

He didn't react to anything until Thanos was going to kill Tony. He probably also foresaw who would still be around after they lost.

ryuplaneswalker · August 23, 2018, 07:02:48 AM

So watching the DVD with subtitles, the muffled distress call gave out the name of Thor's Ship.

Statesman.

MyriVerse · August 24, 2018, 05:56:50 PM

Nice coincidence, but don't get any ideas.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statesman_(automobile)

Other ships from Ragnarok were named after other Holden cars, like Torana.

ryuplaneswalker · August 28, 2018, 07:18:23 AM

Aww that is real sad.

Dev7on · September 02, 2018, 06:38:41 AM

Quote from: Arcana on July 08, 2018, 08:28:08 PM
Huge spoiler for Infinity War AND Ant Man and the Wasp. If you haven't seen either movie: recommend skipping until you do.

Spoiler for Hidden:
Just saw Ant Man and the Wasp yesterday. I now know what Dr. Strange saw in the future. Everyone has been speculating about why Strange gave up the stone and the most popular running guess is that it was obviously to save Tony, who was being killed by Thanos. Tony is important to the future, so Tony had to be saved. I've never bought that idea, because its nonsensical. There are literally hundreds of ways for Strange to save Tony from being killed, starting with the most obvious way which was to simply teleport him away from the fight.

I think the reason why Strange saw only one future in which they win, out of the millions of other futures in which they lose, is because to eventually beat Thanos they have to fight him AND lose AND lose at EXACTLY THE RIGHT MOMENT. Strange knew that the only way they win is if they lose and he gives up the stone at exactly the moment he does. If he gives up the stone earlier, or if they fight Thanos and even beat him and Thanos eventually gets the stone later, they ultimately lose. But if events unfold in exactly the way we saw, Thanos arrives on Earth at exactly the right moment for him to face Thor, almost get killed by Thor, and create the snapture at the precise moment when Scott Lang is in the quantum realm. If the fight on Titan was any shorter Thanos would arrive on Earth earlier and the snapture would happen before Scott entered the quantum realm, and any later and he would have exited the realm. But this is the only future in which he is trapped there, and that was the critical thing that was required for Strange's winning vision to come to pass.

It seems obvious to me, but it didn't seem obvious to my friends when I mentioned the idea, so here it is.

Another theory I have is even if Dr. Strange teleport Tony away from Thanos. Thanos will eventually kill Tony if he doesn't gets what he wants. After watching the movie 3 more times the battle on Titan reminds of the Magisterium Trial when we fight Tyrant at the last phase. When Thanos threw the moon it got me thinking when Tyrant does his Zeus Lightning Bolt "Air Crackles" and the leader of the league yells RUN!!!!!!