Author Topic: New Dawn of Justice Trailer  (Read 23400 times)

Vee

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New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« on: December 03, 2015, 07:05:32 AM »
http://www.batmanvsupermandawnofjustice.com/index.php

looks like dc's trying to catch up with marvel by cramming the plots of several movies into one movie.

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2015, 07:13:22 AM »
Hate, hate, hate Lex.

Wonder Woman looks alright.

Okay, didn't expect Doomsday?
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Vee

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2015, 07:20:18 AM »
yeah affleck and eisenberg seem to be having a bad casting showdown. wish they'd have just cast clancy brown as lex.

Nos482

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2015, 09:02:58 AM »
a) Why is Batsy even holding a gun?
b) baaaad casting choice for Lex.
c) damn is Doomsday ugly...
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Arcana

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2015, 09:13:37 AM »
Okay, didn't expect Doomsday?

Its been speculated ever since Zod's body showed up in the teaser, but it was still surprising to see.  It does sort of make sense in retrospect, in that it now makes a lot more sense what Wonder Woman was supposed to be using the sword and shield against villain-wise.

Also, obligatlory:


Arcana

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2015, 09:19:32 AM »
a) Why is Batsy even holding a gun?

I think his no-guns rule doesn't apply to Doomsday.

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2015, 10:07:08 AM »
a) Why is Batsy even holding a gun?

Because it's really Crazy Steve.
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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2015, 04:54:32 PM »
I think his no-guns rule doesn't apply to Doomsday.

Agreed, that rule doesn't apply to inhuman monsters.
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AmberOfDzu

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2015, 12:42:56 AM »
Agreed, that rule doesn't apply to inhuman monsters.
Maybe it shoots something to incapacitate superman? I'm presuming he brought it along to fight superman, not super-whatever. But a traditional gun wouldn't help with either; and I assume batman's pretty competent, so it's almost certainly something else.

Arcana

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2015, 03:10:10 AM »
Maybe it shoots something to incapacitate superman? I'm presuming he brought it along to fight superman, not super-whatever. But a traditional gun wouldn't help with either; and I assume batman's pretty competent, so it's almost certainly something else.

A "normal" gun probably wouldn't help against Superman, but its important to calibrate expectations against the established power level of Superman in Man of Steel.  In Man of Steel, its seen that normal pistols and even normal rifles have almost no effect on Kryptonians, but conventional weaponry that would not harm most incarnations of Superman did have some small effect on Kryptonians in Man of Steel: things like Hellfire missiles could cause some harm, and even gatling guns could at least sting them.

My guess is that Batman being Batman tried to figure out some way to at least hurt Superman, and whatever that was will be what will make him not laughably worthless against Doomsday, be it special weaponry, tactics, or both.

eabrace

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2015, 03:27:21 AM »
Kryptonite bullet to even the odds?

Edit:  'Cause, you know, no Oliver Queen to deliver a kryptonite arrow and all that.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2015, 03:44:20 AM by eabrace »
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Arcana

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2015, 09:07:32 AM »
Kryptonite bullet to even the odds?

Edit:  'Cause, you know, no Oliver Queen to deliver a kryptonite arrow and all that.

It was not very well explained in Man of Steel, but certain environmental conditions were shown to weaken Superman in a manner analogous to Kryptonite.  They might call back to that in BvS, although I thought that was handled confusingly and poorly in MoS and would be difficult to build upon.

I'm not sure it works here, though.  The Superman of TDKR was very much similar to the very powerful Superman in the canon at the time.  Even with the Kryptonite stun arrow Batman still needed a massive powered suit of armor just to make it a close fight.  But in MoS, Superman was reduced to the strength of a normal human fairly quickly.  This Batman wouldn't need both the armor and Kryptonite.  Kryptonite alone, if it worked like the Kryptonian environment in MoS, would immediately place Superman at a huge disadvantage over Batman.

CG

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2015, 02:35:21 PM »
The Superman of TDKR was very much similar to the very powerful Superman in the canon at the time.  Even with the Kryptonite stun arrow Batman still needed a massive powered suit of armor just to make it a close fight.  But in MoS, Superman was reduced to the strength of a normal human fairly quickly.  This Batman wouldn't need both the armor and Kryptonite.  Kryptonite alone, if it worked like the Kryptonian environment in MoS, would immediately place Superman at a huge disadvantage over Batman.
I haven't seen MoS, so I can't comment on that. 

However, in DKR, Superman's power level was reduced by literally being nuked and nearly dying due to lack of solar radiation.  The Suit made it something of a fight, though Batman was still outclassed.  Once the Kryptonite arrow exploded in Superman's face, the fight was over.  Batman could have killed Superman at will, but chose not to.

Kaos Arcanna

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2015, 03:02:00 PM »
I haven't seen MoS, so I can't comment on that. 

However, in DKR, Superman's power level was reduced by literally being nuked and nearly dying due to lack of solar radiation.  The Suit made it something of a fight, though Batman was still outclassed.  Once the Kryptonite arrow exploded in Superman's face, the fight was over.  Batman could have killed Superman at will, but chose not to.

Honestly, that fight was ridiculous.

Batman's suit has a flipping power cord attached to a street light!

If Superman had just pulled the dang cord out ... and even post nuke he still had enough super speed he could have just whizzed down and grabbed Batman and dropped his armored butt in jail.



CG

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2015, 04:30:00 PM »
Honestly, that fight was ridiculous.

Batman's suit has a flipping power cord attached to a street light!

If Superman had just pulled the dang cord out ... and even post nuke he still had enough super speed he could have just whizzed down and grabbed Batman and dropped his armored butt in jail.
Overconfidence is Superman's real weakness.  Occupational hazard of being a demigod, I guess.

In the DKR fight, Superman was trying to reason with Batman and talk him out of his current trajectory since Supes figured he wasn't in any real danger.  After Batman does some damage with sonics and acid, Superman starts to get pissed off.  Batman even recognizes he's in trouble and wonders where Oliver is.  I think if Oliver hadn't got there in time, Superman would have given up on talking and just disassembled the batsuit and turned Bruce over for arrest.

Arcana

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2015, 06:41:50 PM »
I haven't seen MoS, so I can't comment on that. 

However, in DKR, Superman's power level was reduced by literally being nuked and nearly dying due to lack of solar radiation.  The Suit made it something of a fight, though Batman was still outclassed.  Once the Kryptonite arrow exploded in Superman's face, the fight was over.  Batman could have killed Superman at will, but chose not to.

That's not how I recall interpreting that fight.  Its been a while, but I can recall that even when Batman was pummeling Superman after the Kryptonite arrow, Superman is still trying to convince Batman to stop fighting because he can hear Bruce's heart giving out from the stress.  I figured at the time that each for his own reasons was still holding back in that fight: Superman, even Kryptonite weakened, was still not fighting Batman all-out to kill him and, unknown to him at the time, Batman was holding back slightly at the end because he was trying to orchestrate the fight to look a very specific way.  Now I have to dig up my copy to reread it.

CG

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #16 on: December 04, 2015, 07:07:29 PM »
That's not how I recall interpreting that fight.  Its been a while, but I can recall that even when Batman was pummeling Superman after the Kryptonite arrow, Superman is still trying to convince Batman to stop fighting because he can hear Bruce's heart giving out from the stress.  I figured at the time that each for his own reasons was still holding back in that fight: Superman, even Kryptonite weakened, was still not fighting Batman all-out to kill him and, unknown to him at the time, Batman was holding back slightly at the end because he was trying to orchestrate the fight to look a very specific way.  Now I have to dig up my copy to reread it.
Here's the pages in question (from here, which has more: https://scans-daily.dreamwidth.org/5364139.html)
Spoiler for Hidden:

Spoiler for Hidden:

Spoiler for Hidden:

After which Bruce collapses from a heart attack. 

Superman is still concerned for Bruce's health, but doesn't put up much of a fight after the Kryptonite arrow. 

Arcana

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #17 on: December 04, 2015, 07:33:51 PM »
Superman is still concerned for Bruce's health, but doesn't put up much of a fight after the Kryptonite arrow.

True, but he's still alive.  If he were completely depowered, he'd be dead since Bruce is still fighting with his powered armor; armor that, as he put it earlier, caused Superman to "break a sweat." 

You're correct that its pretty clear from reading the panels now that Batman wanted Superman to know that he could have beaten him, and the armor and the Kryptonite would have almost certainly allowed him to do it.  But as I said, in MoS Superman was reduced to basically human levels of strength and resilience fairly quickly, in TDKR he's not, at least it appears not.  That could, of course, be because the Kryptonite was synthetic, or didn't have enough time to take full effect.  But it seems while he's weak enough to be able to be pummeled by Batman, he's not so weak that he isn't still extremely resistant to damage.

CG

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #18 on: December 04, 2015, 07:46:35 PM »
I didn't watch MoS, so I can't comment on any de-powering that went on there.

My initial response was to your assertion that it was close fight after the K-Arrow.
Even with the Kryptonite stun arrow Batman still needed a massive powered suit of armor just to make it a close fight.
My assertion was that it wasn't a close fight after the Kryptonite. 

Arcana

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Re: New Dawn of Justice Trailer
« Reply #19 on: December 04, 2015, 10:27:27 PM »
I didn't watch MoS, so I can't comment on any de-powering that went on there.

My initial response was to your assertion that it was close fight after the K-Arrow. My assertion was that it wasn't a close fight after the Kryptonite.

I see what you mean, but I would still content that even though it appears Superman would have lost if not for the Batman gambit, its still a pretty close fight in relative terms.

As to Man of Steel, in that movie it was shown that Superman's powers come not only from exposure to yellow sunlight, but overall from Earth's (lower) gravity, its abundant sunshine, and its atmosphere.  In an environment that replicates that on Krypton such as within the Kryptonian ship that Zod has, Superman's powers quickly disappear entirely.  And when Zod tries to terraform Earth into Krypton at the climax of the movie, Superman was shown to be negatively affected by among other things the stuff the world engine was spewing into the atmosphere.

An interesting question is what that stuff was.  Perhaps in the Man of Steel universe, the stuff that the world engine puts into Earth's atmosphere to replicate the atmosphere of Krypton is, in fact, that universe's Kryptonite.  Maybe there's something beneficial about it for Kryptonians, but it interacts badly with them when Kryptonians live for extended periods of time on a planet like Earth.

Incidentally, the introduction of Doomsday opens the door to a theory of mine I've tossed around regarding an otherwise weird plot hole in Man of Steel.  If exposure to Earth gives Kryptonians superpowers, why would Zod want to terraform Earth into Krypton?  Wouldn't it be better if they kept Earth earth-like, and even if there was a period of suffering the net result would have obviously been great for Kryptonians.  It seems like Zod is pursuing a strange goal; the goal of depowering his own people.

It might actually make sense when seen from the perspective of Zod and Kryptonian culture as portrayed in MoS.  As Jor-El seems to imply when he describes Kryptonian history to Clark and Zod also seems to imply through his actions, Kryptonians were very conservative in their beliefs about everyone having a specific pre-ordained place in society that was dictated by genetic programming.  In their own way, they believed in a genetic purity of their species.  If so, what if the mechanism that grants Kryptonians their powers on Earth is not simple adaptation, but something that happens at the genetic level.  Their actual genes adapt to the new conditions and cause them to in effect mutate into something that can thrive in their new environment.  Superpowers would be a kind of genetic mutation.  If so, then that might be the reason Zod isn't swayed by superpowers.  In his opinion, Kryptonians should live the way they were meant to live, which is in a Kryptonian environment and a genetic adaptation to that environment only.  He might also feel that a world full of superpowered Kryptonians would be disruptive to order, but the notion that he would also have a racist reaction to anything that "changes" Kryptonians in any way actually makes sense in the story.

There's no basis for the hypothesis that superpowers come from a genetic adaptation anywhere in MoS, but Doomsday might provide that.  In the original canon, Doomsday was the product of strange, Lamarckian experiments with Kryptonians, suggesting that Kryptonian biology isn't like most: their genetic structure can adapt to harsh conditions in unconventional ways.  If Doomsday establishes a similar fact in BvS, that Kryptonian biology is adaptive at the genetic level and can produce a being like Doomsday through experimentation, then that would connect to the theory that Zod didn't see superpowers overall as a good thing, and would be motivated to terraform Earth into a planet that wouldn't grant Kryptonians superpowers (or at least as much superpowers - the Sun would still be stronger) because it was far more important to Zod to return Kryptonians to their predestined state.