New efforts!

[Fanta]

I have another question. How many will be racing to 50? I know I want to get back to incarnates ASAP, that's the part of the game I crave. Only then did I feel really super!

[LaughingAlex]

I have another question. How many will be racing to 50? I know I want to get back to incarnates ASAP, that's the part of the game I crave. Only then did I feel really super!

Depends on the server.  I do want to get back to incarnates asap myself.  I however have another obligation.  I figure there will be alot of newbies trying cox out when it comes back, I'm kind of obliged to make some guides on how to play the game well and not fall into the trap of the holy trinity(also known as, dying the instant you fight anything other than council or the instant you get ambushed).

[AlienOne]

I have another question. How many will be racing to 50? I know I want to get back to incarnates ASAP, that's the part of the game I crave. Only then did I feel really super!

Me! My fav thing to do was create min/max builds in Mid's (some of my first posts on these boards ever were about being excited for the next iteration of Mid's!) and try them out in-game. Should this deal happen, I'm definitely going to be excited to do that sort of stuff again. That, and I'll be power leveling my first character quickly enough to play my beloved Warshade once more.

I'll also most likely refresh/update my Warshade guide from the old forums and post it for those who need it... :)

[Fanta]

Depends on the server.  I do want to get back to incarnates asap myself.  I however have another obligation.  I figure there will be alot of newbies trying cox out when it comes back, I'm kind of obliged to make some guides on how to play the game well and not fall into the trap of the holy trinity(also known as, dying the instant you fight anything other than council or the instant you get ambushed).

I'd say that's part of the fun :) Besides, most of those will be in AE.

[Thirty-Seven]

Yeah, I totally won't be racing to 50.  For me, the best part of the game was creating and exploring the new character and his powers.  Although, I will be anxious to roll a Kheldian... so... Yeah.

[Angel Phoenix77]

Yeah, I totally won't be racing to 50.  For me, the best part of the game was creating and exploring the new character and his powers.  Although, I will be anxious to roll a Kheldian... so... Yeah.

this is how I feel, I want to savor the thrill of getting to 50, and hopefully do a full level 1-50 walkthroughs once I figure out how to run fraps on my laptop and how slow it runs.
follow up question can you save to a flash drive and not to the hard drive because I am thinking of making my recordings 45 min or higher.

[Remaugen]

Are we there yet?  ;D

[HEATSTROKE]

 This is another reason I hope we get our accounts. Every character on that account was already 50 and with IO'd builds.. If the game were to return and accounts were not available I would first seek to put those creations back in the same state as the game closing.

That means I would be PL'ing toons a lot.. and probably in AE to get them to the level where they were before. Once that was complete... then I would create new toons and enjoy the ride..

I have done the journey a lot over 8 years.. The Incarnate stuff and maximizing builds to me satisfaction (not necessarily the optimal) was what was very enjoyable to me. That and playing with my friends.. who usually found me in the base crafting.. or in Wentworths.. or talking to me over Ventrillo waiting for me to finish my latest respec....

[Noyjitat]

AlienOne, you don't really expect people to be familiar with everything you have ever posted on this board do you?

People only respond to the immediate things you or anyone posts. They probably won't even see everything you posted in this thread.

To me, you seemed more cynical than skeptical, the whole bit with "I'm from Missouri" makes it seem like you take nothing on faith or in this case, the good faith of the people posting here. But lacking so many contextual clues it is very possible that you aren't. I'll take you at your word that you aren't and just assume that I misunderstood.

My true feeling is that you don't want to get your hope up because it hurts when they are dashed. It is easier and safer to be skeptical, but it is a short step to cynicism when nothing but absolute proof, certified by accountants or personal experience are necessary for you to have any hope that what might happen, could happen. It's tough to to face emotions, especially for men, and that makes us loathe to discuss it or even admit that we have an emotional reaction.

Like I said, you deal with it however you like. Your way is probably less painful. But in my view it is better to be hurt once in a while then to feel nothing at all.

I gotta say I Was beginning to be skeptical as well simply because of how I first learned about "score" was from random posts of people I don't know. I made a rather blunt thread recently inquiring about score; I really wanted an answer from someone official with facts and not more rumor posts. It ended up being deleted by an unknown mod (I wasn't sent a private message)

Let's face it, we've been trolled so much by so many people it's hard to trust what you read. But after seeing this post from Tony on the subject (I don't recall seeing anything from him before) I'm no longer concerned and believe it is indeed a reality and not someones joke.

I do however disagree with the secrecy since we're all working on getting the game back. I'm thinking we have untapped potential within the community that could help with the progress of restoration. But that's just my opinion and nobody working on the game owes me anything. I'm just another one of the many players with totally shot morale that wants to play again: To see old friends, make alts, street sweep, farm, raids,incarnate trials, tfs and the rest of the experience that only City of Heroes had.

[Lucretia MacEvil]

This is another reason I hope we get our accounts. Every character on that account was already 50 and with IO'd builds.. If the game were to return and accounts were not available I would first seek to put those creations back in the same state as the game closing.

That means I would be PL'ing toons a lot.. and probably in AE to get them to the level where they were before. Once that was complete... then I would create new toons and enjoy the ride..

Same here. 
If we don't get our accounts back, my first move will be to re-roll and re-level my 50s.  If we do get our accounts back, my first move will be to jump on my brute and smash the biggest mob I can find, and my second will be to roll a new character and start the journey all over again!

[AlienOne]

Let's face it, we've been trolled so much by so many people it's hard to trust what you read. But after seeing this post from Tony on the subject (I don't recall seeing anything from him before) I'm no longer concerned and believe it is indeed a reality and not someones joke.

Agreed. In fact, until that post, it was not well known that Icon was a "happenstance" result of those efforts.

I'm certainly glad Tony V posted it, even if it was in anger.

It does, however, beg the question... Why not post a simple "this is where we stand and this is what we have accomplished so far" pinned post? That would make it SO much easier for people interested in it--in fact, it would probably cut down on the amount of people asking about it, which I'm sure he'd be all for.

It appears right now in "Task Force Hail Mary," we have....2 pinned topics about Google, one about the media, one about mailing letters, one about "Team Wildcard," and another one about recruitment. I suppose everyone else is required to do the kind of research that's required to write a Master's thesis to find out "everything there is to know" about everyone else's efforts....lol! Seriously though... It does help that this effort/thread has gotten as popular as it has... It informs a lot of people out there who haven't been that in-depth into these forums over the past year(s).

Here's a FANTASTIC example of someone trying to help out (even if it did turn out that the original poster was....undeserving of the effort it took to put this post together):

CITY OF HEROES PROJECTS

SEGS
No idea what it means or stands for, but this is Nemerle's City of Heroes emulator under development, based on an earlier version of the game.
http://segs.nemerle.eu/forumz/index.php

ICON
This is Codewalker's project that allows you to create characters (with the updated Issue 24) and run or fly around the maps stored in your computer's local files. It isn't a server and you're not online, but you can do neat things like wear NPC costume parts, load up signature NPCs, and even your own characters (take a group screenshot shot of your roster!).
http://www.cohtitan.com/forum/index.php/topic,7288.0.html

The Community Server
There are plans and efforts underway to reverse-engineer City of Heroes, create a server that will run the latest version of the game client, and make it playable online again. This could take years. The people doing this haven't directly announced who they are or how much progress has been made, and if they know what's good for them (and us), they never will. (And trust me, I've bugged a lot of people, but if anyone knows anything, they're not talking.) I've done a lot of preaching about this subject. I think they should "release it into the wild" once its done, allowing many servers to pop up all at once all over the world in different countries. This will ensure that NCSoft can pay their legal department to play a game of whack-a-mole for years or even decades if they like, but using tools like Sentinel+, we can simply move our characters around.  :P
http://www.zombo.com/

PLAN Z PROJECTS
Spiritual successors

Heroes and Villains (Plan Z Studios)
This is being designed and developed from the ground up to be a very familiar game to City of Heroes, both in game play mechanics and themes. It's not a copy, but it is going to be the ultimate homage for those players (like me) who just want a place that feels like home. Online gaming sites that cover the MMORPG genre are showing a lot of interest in Heroes and Villains.
http://www.heroes-and-villains.com/
https://www.facebook.com/HeroesAndVillainsMMORPG
http://www.cohtitan.com/forum/index.php/board,164.0.html

The Phoenix Project (Missing Worlds Media)
This is being designed and developed as an evolution of the game and genre, both as a spiritual successor to City of Heroes and as an improvement on CoH's game play and themes. It might not feel like home, but for those players ready to move on to something new that still respects City of Heroes core principles of freedom and choice, this could be just the thing. The gaming press is showing a lot of interest in this project as well.
http://www.missingworldsmedia.com/
https://www.facebook.com/MissingWorldsMedia
http://www.cohtitan.com/forum/index.php?action=collapse;c=19;sa=expand;b6052b0=9d1d323b60d39c79f870f9d115a374da#c19

Valiance Online (SilverHelm Studios)
This is the project with the least amount of information released on core gameplay mechanics or storyline themes, and it seems to be flying under the gaming press radar, but they've recently begun releasing a flurry of screenshots on their website and Facebook, showing off the fact that this team snagged a phenomenal character artist and modeler. If the animation and gameplay mechanics meets similar standards, this little-advertised project could end up being a big surprise for the community.
http://valiance.shogn.net/
https://www.facebook.com/ValianceOnline

Like 99 percent of forums out there, cross-posting is generally frowned upon because it breaks a conversation up, "clogs the forums up" and unnecessarily gives moderators more work to do.

You're more likely to be obliged here, but a lot of people (like me) will also expect you to check up on your own forum topic if you want to know how the conversation you started is going.  ;)

....and here I am posting later that there was at least ONE person that appreciated the effort it took to put together that information:

I definitely got some benefit from it. Thank you.

...just like I am very appreciative of what Ironwolf is doing for this effort as a spokesperson. That has GOT to be a tough job, dealing with people like us. ;)

[The Fifth Horseman]

I'm a historian by training and I can tell you that what you are doing is exceptionally difficult. Imagine it like this, as a historian, you come across some ancient text and you can recognize only every 10th word or so even the alphabet is recognized. In fact, you discover that it is a written language based on a spoken language you don't know and can't identify. (Think Linear A or Etruscan) From that you have to try and decipher what it is saying.

Not a bad approximation, but the reality is somewhat worse.
Imagine a cookbook, written in a language you understand. The problem is that understanding the language only allows you to read it, where the actual problem with the cookbook is that it was not written to be read by squishy humans.
First, it does not tell you the actual action your steps are to accomplish (though you can infer it... sometimes), uses idiot speak and requires precisely following every single smallest step. Not "crack the egg", but "Note position of egg carton. Move your hand to the noted position. Move your hand down. Grasp. Move your hand up. Note position of bowl. Note position of bowl edge. Move your hand to the noted position. Move your hand down." (etc) You blinked after picking up the egg? The recipe's messed up, start over.
Second, it's broken down into lots and lots of smaller "sub-recipes" that can mean a dozen different things depending on context. Think that page 28 contains "Put the container on the stove. Put the utensil into the container. Move utensil clockwise for five minutes.". Now every recipe that contains those steps refers to page 28 instead of including them.
Third, instead of words in the text, you get their numbers in the index at the end of the book.
Fourth, it does not really identify the utensils you need - only by figuring out the recipe itself you might be able to figure out what they are used for and from there find substitutes.

[Tyger42]

@AlienOne: Is the link wrong on that Community Server one or was the original poster trolling? Zombo.com is a pointless joke site.

[AlienOne]

@AlienOne: Is the link wrong on that Community Server one or was the original poster trolling? Zombo.com is a pointless joke site.

It was a joke from original poster... Basically stating exactly the same thing I've been saying: we know nothing...

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UmzsWxPLIOo

[Ohioknight]

... Why not post a simple "this is where we stand and this is what we have accomplished so far" pinned post? That would make it SO much easier for people interested in it--in fact, it would probably cut down on the amount of people asking about it, which I'm sure he'd be all for.

I'm thinking because in case it turns out that the person posting under the handle AlienOne (or any other id) happens to be an attorney representing a certain owner, who is just trying to chase information out into the open, then such a posting might be the basis for a cease and desist order or evidence in a future legal action.

[AlienOne]

I'm thinking because in case it turns out that the person posting under the handle AlienOne (or any other id) happens to be an attorney representing a certain owner, who is just trying to chase information out into the open, then such a posting might be the basis for a cease and desist order or evidence in a future legal action.

I kinda doubt that would happen, as SEGS has been doing the same thing for years with a forum and a try-able client, and nothing's happened.

But, I can understand the paranoia, even if the effort is "moving forward" regardless...

[blue storm]

Okay, first of all, this is precisely why I don't say a lot about the efforts going on in this arena, because I don't want the hassle of continually having to answer questions about it, especially since I'm not really a key player in its development.

Second of all, it hasn't been three years.  Three years ago, not only was the game still up and running, but it was still three issues away from closing down.  SCoRE didn't really kick off in earnest until a few weeks after the shutdown notice, and even then, it was a mad rush to collect network traces and dissect API information.  Actually thinking about coding something up to implement that stuff didn't occur until a few months after that.  In other words, SCoRE has really only been working on this as a project for a little over a year.

Third of all, where do you get off claiming that there as been nothing that's come of it? Have you played around with Icon at all? Do you consider that "nothing"? That program came directly out of client-side reverse engineering efforts, and given that you wouldn't even be able to get into the costume editor without it, being able to actually get into and wander around the city is, in my humble opinion, hardly "absolutely nothing".

If I come off as defensive, it's because I'm in a long-running chat session with the folks who are working on this stuff, and I see the amount of time they're putting into it.  Hardly a day goes by when there's not some serious discussion going on about how to implement some server-side functionality. What I think might be lost on some people is that this stuff is hard. Like, really hard. City of Heroes wasn't built on a well-known and documented game engine, it was built from the ground up. There is no public information on how the game works internally, and trying to recreate a black box like that from scratch is extremely time-consuming.

Even the low-level network protocol used to communicate between the client and the server was designed from scratch, a variant of UDP. And it's not like there's just one monolithic piece of code that has to be replicated, either. There are account servers, authentication servers, database servers, map servers, chat servers, etc., all of which have to be implemented and working for stuff to function correctly. In other words, it's not just reverse engineering one program, but like eight or ten, each one pretty durn complex.

If you want to give up on SCoRE, then that's fine, give up on SCoRE.  Will CoT launch before it's finished?  I don't know, probably.  Will CoH relaunch before it's finished?  Maybe, but even if so, that won't be the end of SCoRE, as the people working on it have expressed to me that they don't want to be caught flat-footed if the game shuts down again in the future.

But rest assured that just because we don't post a stream of messages about the project, it's not dead, and the hyperbole about it being three years with nothing to show for it really rubs me the wrong way.

Thanks for the post Tony. It strikes me as important to keep those efforts as low profile as possible, but I guess that once in a while, a message like yours is important in re-aligning the community as to the complexity of the task at hand and the dedication of those who are working on it. I, for one, having contributed modestly, in the data collection effort, know that this project will ultimately mean that CoH will never be taken away from us again, ever.

As to the release date of it, you could have just said : "when it's done".

[MWRuger]

Not a bad approximation, but the reality is somewhat worse.
Imagine a cookbook, written in a language you understand. The problem is that understanding the language only allows you to read it, where the actual problem with the cookbook is that it was not written to be read by squishy humans.
First, it does not tell you the actual action your steps are to accomplish (though you can infer it... sometimes), uses idiot speak and requires precisely following every single smallest step. Not "crack the egg", but "Note position of egg carton. Move your hand to the noted position. Move your hand down. Grasp. Move your hand up. Note position of bowl. Note position of bowl edge. Move your hand to the noted position. Move your hand down." (etc) You blinked after picking up the egg? The recipe's messed up, start over.
Second, it's broken down into lots and lots of smaller "sub-recipes" that can mean a dozen different things depending on context. Think that page 28 contains "Put the container on the stove. Put the utensil into the container. Move utensil clockwise for five minutes.". Now every recipe that contains those steps refers to page 28 instead of including them.
Third, instead of words in the text, you get their numbers in the index at the end of the book.
Fourth, it does not really identify the utensils you need - only by figuring out the recipe itself you might be able to figure out what they are used for and from there find substitutes.

That does sound worse.  ;D

[MWRuger]

GAAAAHHHHH!  I hope to HELL there's more hope for reverse engineering CoH than for translating Linear A or Etruscan!

Michael Ventris, who translated Linear B was a very good hope. He was a British cryptologist who realized that that it was based on the oldest form of Greek, Mycenean. He said that he had some interesting ideas on Linear A that seemed to be bearing fruit shortly he died in auto accident in 1956.

He may have been our best bet. Personally, I think it was a long shot but you never know. He was part of the team that cracked Enigma for the British.

[AlienOne]

TheDevilYouKnow, I like your signature.