NCsoft Corporation to Sell Entire Shares of NC Interactive Inc.

[Victoria Victrix]

Golden Girl was being facetious.

We really need a sarcasm emote

[healix]

how's this?

https://i.imgur.com/2oBoTl.gif

[corvus1970]

We really need a sarcasm emote

So very, very true. I have found that < /sarcasm > works fairly well.

[dwturducken]

OK.... after looking at the chart thingy in the google translated korean site.... it seems what they are doing is selling NCSoft Interactive stock to NC West Holding, that in turn is fully owned by NCSoft Corp.

The entire "faster decision making" may be just bullocks. My two guesses:

A) Creating this company, in US soil, on top of the other 3, make it easier to set up a whole new more direct chain on command over the 3 US studios.
B) This is just a way to make easy the accounting process and us taxation. Now (potentially) it's only one tax entry.
C) Doooooom!!!

First, Brits can't count! <does neener-neener dance>

Second, VV's quote from Larry won't transfer easily, here, but is there any evidence of that tactic working or not working? I know if, say, my wife dies, I'm not legally able to say, "Oh, sorry. That was in my wife's name." I know corporate law is an odd entity, and IANAL, but still.

[Tahquitz]

We're talking around $48 million US.  Not really a lot of money.

On one hand you could say they are divesting themselves from the west and it may have been yet another corporate reason to shut down Paragon.

As for why do they say 50,500 million Vs billion, two reasons.  First all business values are reported in either thousands or millions.  Second, which probably explains the first, there is actually two definitions for billion, one thousand million and one million million.  English speaking countries tend to use the first definition, the rest of Europe uses the second.  However everybody agrees what a million is.

I'm thinking this.  To reduce the valuation of the new company, and IF selling CoH's IP is in the cards, it's up to the subsidiary.

Now the "This closure means nothing concerning Arenanet and Carbide" makes a tiny bit more sense.  But not by much.  If this means what folks are reading this as (NCInteractive 100% US, wholly owned until unprofitable) it just changes who we yell at is all.

Of course, it wouldn't be the first time (or last... *peeks behind him* >.>) that I'm wrong.

Also, "NCsoft Corporation announced that it will establish a new wholly owned subsidiary in the United States to establish an entity which can be in charge of the United States and Europe businesses. The new entity, to be capitalized at KRW 50,500 million, will be mainly engaged in the management of the United States and Europe subsidiaries. The expected transaction settlement date is December 24, 2012. "

http://www.reuters.com/finance/stocks/036570.KS/key-developments/article/2658297

Still curious.  Transaction settles before the end of the year.  I wonder if the timing is significant to South Korea's reporting of taxation/securities documents. But as IANAEM (IANAL, except Economics major), I'll leave it to the pros to poke a stick at.

[NecrotechMaster]

well this is some very interesting and peculiar news

there are potentially a whole bunch of ways in which this could go and what it could mean

if we play our cards right, have some luck, we may be able to bring back coh sooner than we thought

on the other hand this could just lock coh tighter in ncsofts grasp


definitely having a wait and see attitude with this

[Triplash]

.....

This could be a way not only to shed all of their NCSoft Interactive employees without a severance package, but to rehire them at lower pay and with fewer benefits.

My brother in law works for a company that does that. They own three separate chains of grocery stores, and every few years they close down the store he works at, and reopen it the next day under one of the other chains. All the employees get let go from the old company and immediately hired to the new one... losing any accrued payraises and seniority benefits in the process. Combine that with tax savings, the ability to rewrite contracts if they feel like it, and an excuse to get rid of any employees they don't like without needing a valid reason to fire them, and the company really cleans up when they do this kind of stuff.

I could say more, but every word I want to use would just get changed to "pancake". >:(

[Surelle]

Edited because I just got back to this thread now and realize I forgot to link the Aion forums, found here: 

http://forums.na.aiononline.com/na/showthread.php?t=101292

Okay, from the mods on the Aion forums:

Nyx has asked that in response to questions such as these that we post this official statement from NCSOFT if she is not available to post it herself.

"As part of NCSOFT's ongoing efforts to become a stronger global company, we are making adjustments to ensure that our western teams and games are more independent and more agile. These efforts have no effect on NCSOFT, ArenaNet or Carbine employees, nor will they have any effect on current titles or those in development. "
__________________
{VFM}Kromede
Volunteer Forum Moderator

And an Aion player added (in his post):

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/w/...#axzz2Etp5oJBk

"Definition of 'Wholly Owned Subsidiary'
A company whose common stock is 100% owned by another company, called the parent company. A company can become a wholly owned subsidiary through acquisition by the parent company or spin off from the parent company. In contrast, a regular subsidiary is 51 to 99% owned by the parent company. One situation in which a parent company might find it helpful to establish a subsidiary company is if it wants to operate in a foreign market. This arrangement is common among high-tech companies who want to retain complete control and ownership of their technology.


Investopedia explains 'Wholly Owned Subsidiary'
Wholly owned subsidiaries allow the parent company to retain the greatest amount of control, but also leave the parent with all the costs and risks of full ownership. When a lesser number of costs and risks are desirable, or when it is not possible to obtain complete or majority control, the parent company might introduce an affiliate, associate or associate company in which it would own a minority stake.

So basically Ncsoft have full control. "

???

[Solaris]

So this whole plan is confusing me but could it be a way to shed shareholders? Make them answerable to no one but the parent company?

[Kheprera]

Disclaimer: While I *am* an IRS employee, I write technical training manuals. I am not well versed in corporate tax law.

*enables the Olantern Signal, who is a corporate tax lawyer*

Okay, from the very basic face of things, and remember I am not well versed, this is not illegal.  Many companies do this kind of restructuring.

Taxes owed are taxes owed.  Regardless if a company no longer exists, when they go into bankruptcy there is a tiered payment of who gets paid first once all assests are liquidated. Taxes are up at the top.  Since this is a sale, though, I am not certain how the tax code for the subsidiary of a foreign corporation would apply.

Maybe Olantern could elucidate.

[Perfidus]

"As part of NCSOFT's ongoing efforts to become a stronger global company, we are making adjustments to ensure that our western teams and games are more independent and more agile. These efforts have no effect on NCSOFT, ArenaNet or Carbine employees, nor will they have any effect on current titles or those in development. "

If this is true it's such a slap in the face.

[Psyte]

Okay, from the mods on the Aion forums:

Nyx has asked that in response to questions such as these that we post this official statement from NCSOFT if she is not available to post it herself.

"As part of NCSOFT's ongoing efforts to become a stronger global company, we are making adjustments to ensure that our western teams and games are more independent and more agile. These efforts have no effect on NCSOFT, ArenaNet or Carbine employees, nor will they have any effect on current titles or those in development. "

Citation?

[Minotaur]

I mentioned this to a friend and ex CoHer who works in the city of London, he said that there were some changes to capital gains tax (not sure where) coming in Jan 1 that might be relevant to this.

[Victoria Victrix]

"As part of NCSOFT's ongoing efforts to become a stronger global company, we are making adjustments to ensure that our western teams and games are more independent and more agile. These efforts have no effect on NCSOFT, ArenaNet or Carbine employees, nor will they have any effect on current titles or those in development. "

If this is true it's such a slap in the face.

I thought the level of my hate and contempt for NCSoft could not possibly reach any further.

I was wrong.

[Colette]

As I said, the corporate world is foreign to me.

I do have some specific knowledge of how shady businesses operate, unfortunately.

The pattern is consistent: set up shop in some office, fill it with classy-looking furniture. Rip some people off. Move to a new office and file a new DBA... in sum, change the company name and location without changing personnel or M.O. Their people, well-scrubbed con artists with pearly white teeth, tend to change their names a lot as well.

The fact that so many cleverer people than me are scratching their heads about this says "obfuscation, escape, cuttlefish-ink" to me. If I ran a gaming company at the center of a "pancake-storm" like the one we've conjured, I'd be playing obfuscatory games too.

Don't be surprised if NCSoft changes its name by the end of next year.

[corvus1970]

Its like they bought a copy of "Infamy for Dummies", along with a copy of "How to generate loathing in your customer base".

[Vasarto]

So I am still a tiny bit confused. What does this mean exactly? They are selling off everything they have that is not in South Korea or Japan to whomever will buy it?

I read a little bit from the comments but does that complicate or relax the ability to get cox back?

[FatherXmas]

Honestly they are putting all their western eggs in one basket, a new wholly own subsidiary that now "owns" two of their previous wholly own subsidiary and one western studio.  Now if push comes to shove they could sell off all of their western assets in one fell swoop.

Now whether or not there's going to be more local control or this is just a way to formalize what was called "NCSoft West", which wasn't an actual separate entity from a subsidiary basis, who knows.

[corvus1970]

So I am still a tiny bit confused. What does this mean exactly? They are selling off everything they have that is not in South Korea or Japan to whomever will buy it?

I read a little bit from the comments but does that complicate or relax the ability to get cox back?

No, they didn't put it up for sale for anyone who would buy it. They are basically spinning off those concerns into their own subsidiary, but one still wholly owned by NCSoft.

Say hello to the new Boss. Same as the old boss. Really.

As for what it means for CoX. Its way too early to tell.

[healix]

Muhahahahahaha! Celie's curse (from the Color Purple) seems appropriate for NCSoft here...

"I curse you. Until you do right by The CoH players everything you think about is gonna crumble...
Until you do right by The CoH community, everything you even think about gonna fail..."
(Or at least, may the fleas of a thousand camels rest in your crotchal area, and may you suffer early transmission failure on the freeway at rush hour!

https://i.imgur.com/GgRbT.gif