A response to NCsoft

[HEATSTROKE]

NCSoft already told us to stop.

We said no.

If we don't accept that answer from them, why would we possibly accept it from some nobody on the Internet?

HA Good point..

[Manga]

There's someone like FrankTurk at every game's forms, and also in every game's broadcast channel.  I know that because every time I try to point out some treatment that's unfair (and something very real, too), and that we players should protest about, someone like Frank shows up and tells me that I'm the only one who's complaining, and I should just shut up and do what I'm told.

They have two things in common: They use the same strategy every time, and they're [apparently the t-word is censored].  They spend all day, every day, posting to forums or hanging around broadcast channels and keeping just within the rules, waiting for someone to come along and tell them to shut the hell up and go away (I wonder if that will do it...).  Then they figure, okay, now I can break the rules and blame someone else for it, and they let loose with a flame war.  It's just like politicians and campaign commercials.

[frostcoh]

That actually sounds like what's being done to NCSoft.

... because what's being done right now is so effective, yes?  It's verbal abuse to point out it's not -- that makes you not only right, but a victim.

Regardless of whether or not insulting a Korean company and having no cash to offe them can ever create the solution you think you want.

That's spectacular!  Compare the argument, "You dont have any money or experience doing business with Koreans, therefore: no wonder you can't get the solution you want," to "He's just a friendless orge or unicorn, so don't listen to him."  Work out which of those is verbal abuse.

And with that: stay awesome, Internet.  You never disappoint.

Let me phrase it for you so you can understand it.

DO YOU HAVE ANY PROACTIVE, ACTIONABLE, REAL SUGGESTIONS?

[SithRose]

...obviously never heard of Jericho and/or Firefly...

Anyway, 20 bucks per months for CoX? I would be in, though I doubt that a majority of players would pay that, even if it would save the game.
Keep up your great work, guys!

He's obviously never heard of Star Trek either....

[Tacitala]

I had in mind a nice post about how the effort to save SOH was never purely business but something formed from a grassroots-style social organization and that this forum cannot be fully taken as a 'public' setting in the traditional business world.  And it might have been nice, but then I realized that people had already said better, more elegant, things.

So with that in mind, I thought I might give an example of what a truly juvenile response to a situation is.

~ahem~


[subject] Re: WOW <- lulz wrong game!

I don't mean to be that guy, but I am: you're not doing anyone any favors by telling us what you have planned to do about what you think NCSoft has done to/for CoH.

Nuh-uh! Friends let friends in on their plans and these are my friends! Go get your own friends and make your own plans in your own special secret meetings!!  And since you're not going to tell us your plans, or how to make our plans better, then obviously your plans are dumb.

*licks the message board*  I licked it, it's MINE!  You can't post here anymore.

[JaguarX]

Let me phrase it for you so you can understand it.

DO YOU HAVE ANY PROACTIVE, ACTIONABLE, REAL SUGGESTIONS?

I like this forum.

Back on the current day COX forum, it's always negative criticism that never comes with a solution to the issue they find "wrong" or disagree with. It's like the point is to point out how stupid you and how their opinion is more valid than everyone else because they disagree with one point in the statement. Then it starts the flame war.

Here, someone points out things are wrong and people say, "Hey, do you have a better solution?" Instead of going in guns blazing/insults trying to prove how stupid/wrong the person is for saying the original idea was wrong.

I think I'm going to stay here for a while.

[Stormsurge]

If anything, Tony knows how to boost morale. Doesn't hurt that he's also right.

All I'm hearing from NCSoft is defensive posturing. They didn't even HAVE to give us any information regarding what might be going behind closed doors and just close the game, but because they are suffering from a PR nightmare, they trying to save face by feeding us lies. So even more, or me anyway, NCSoft just continues to show me how they go about conducting business; which is why I won't be giving them any more of mine.

[ukaserex]

You must be kidding.  You think shareholders vote on every business decision made by a company?  I think you need to leave Atlas Park more often.

Oh, no you did not!
Common stock usually carries with it the right to vote on certain matters, such as electing the board of directors.
Korea may, of course, do things differently.

 As I mentioned - the issue has to come up for vote - that issue could be whether or not that boardmember should remain a boardmember. If there were a commonality amongst a collection of seperate shareholders, they could make their wishes known to the board, and even at the next election, elect one of their own - if they have enough votes.

Maybe you should have spent a little more time in Atlas Park.

Perhaps you're one of those.....

[Heat Guard]

I like this forum.

Back on the current day COX forum, it's always negative criticism that never comes with a solution to the issue they find "wrong" or disagree with. It's like the point is to point out how stupid you and how their opinion is more valid than everyone else because they disagree with one point in the statement. Then it starts the flame war.

Here, someone points out things are wrong and people say, "Hey, do you have a better solution?" Instead of going in guns blazing/insults trying to prove how stupid/wrong the person is for saying the original idea was wrong.

I think I'm going to stay here for a while.

This.  So can I assume that I'm not the only one that has started thinking of 'these' forums as the CoX forums and the original ones as the 'other' forums?

[Knightslayer]

This.  So can I assume that I'm not the only one that has started thinking of 'these' forums as the CoX forums and the original ones as the 'other' forums?

I haven't even been on the 'other' forums in weeks now... >.>

[ukaserex]

The petition had no effect, mostly because it didn't speak their language. Assuming the core issue here is money, if we wanna save CoX, there's only one sure-fire way to do it.

Get 20,000 signatures on a petition to raise the monthly VIP rate to $20 USD.

1) If that doesn't turn some heads at NCSoft, it certainly will at (insert any developer who loves to make money here).

2) I dare anyone to find a news outlet that would pass up a story where a fanbase has actually voluntarily decided to raise their own monthly fee.

It would be a win/win situation for us.


And YES, I would gladly pay that price. This game means that much to me. Actually, I'm sorta suprised NC hasn't raised it before now, even if just to keep up with inflation. I only suggest this because I believe the majority of players would also be willing to accept a slightly higher fee to keep this unique game and it's invaluable community alive.

Honestly, I was at a loss as to why they came up with 15 dollars instead of the nice round figure of 20 bucks. Even 30 dollars is reasonable. However, for that extra money, I'd want either cheaper character transfers or free ones. (or something VIPish.)

I strongly suspect most people will say they wouldn't pay 20 or 30 dollars, but in reality, they would.

[Knightslayer]

Honestly, I was at a loss as to why they came up with 15 dollars instead of the nice round figure of 20 bucks. Even 30 dollars is reasonable. However, for that extra money, I'd want either cheaper character transfers or free ones. (or something VIPish.)

I strongly suspect most people will say they wouldn't pay 20 or 30 dollars, but in reality, they would.

I don't believe they would.
In today's F2P industry there's already lots of complaining about the existing 15$ subscriptions, raising the price above that, for an "old" game (as most of the MMO players see CoH by now) would drive them away entirely IMO.
For most MMO's I'd actually do a double take myself and ask "Why are these guys charging more than the competition?".
Just like the current petition we have, that 20k signatures you see aren't even 20k City of Heroes players - I know at least several of my friends that never played the game have signed it, as have former players that don't even have an interest in coming back to the game.
Petitions are nice, but there is a reason most companies don't put much stock into them - taking a minute to sign something, and actually paying for something are two very different things sadly =/

[omegaultima]

I had suggested to TonyV about the possibility of getting more exposure on SomethingAwful.com by purchasing banner ads directed toward bringing awareness to our activities, but didn't hear back from him.

[sl701]

*licks the message board*  I licked it, it's MINE!  You can't post here anymore.

Thank you very much for this reply, Tacitala. This definitely made my day!

[downix]

I had suggested to TonyV about the possibility of getting more exposure on SomethingAwful.com by purchasing banner ads directed toward bringing awareness to our activities, but didn't hear back from him.

I recommend people avoid that place. Lots of those-under-bridges...

[TimtheEnchanter]

I had suggested to TonyV about the possibility of getting more exposure on SomethingAwful.com by purchasing banner ads directed toward bringing awareness to our activities, but didn't hear back from him.

Cracked.com crossed my mind. "5 biggest MMO blunders?"

[omegaultima]

I recommend people avoid that place. Lots of those-under-bridges...

We've had to deal with plenty of those daily in-game anyway, not to mention there have been some in the twitchtv broadcasts since the announcement.  Besides, what kind of hero's would we be if we ran from something as small as having to deal with trolls?

[downix]

We've had to deal with plenty of those daily in-game anyway, not to mention there have been some in the twitchtv broadcasts since the announcement.  Besides, what kind of hero's would we be if we ran from something as small as having to deal with unicorns?

I had a thread there decide on running mine and my wifes name through the mud due to a drunk post by an ex of mine. I tend to avoid them like the plague now as a result.

[ukaserex]

I don't believe they would.
In today's F2P industry there's already lots of complaining about the existing 15$ subscriptions, raising the price above that, for an "old" game (as most of the MMO players see CoH by now) would drive them away entirely IMO.
For most MMO's I'd actually do a double take myself and ask "Why are these guys charging more than the competition?".
Just like the current petition we have, that 20k signatures you see aren't even 20k City of Heroes players - I know at least several of my friends that never played the game have signed it, as have former players that don't even have an interest in coming back to the game.
Petitions are nice, but there is a reason most companies don't put much stock into them - taking a minute to sign something, and actually paying for something are two very different things sadly =/

But why wouldn't people pay more for a game that they think is better than the other games? I look at it like cola. I like Diet Coke, and I'm willing to pay more for it than the Chek Cola or Diet Rite Cola, etc. They don't deliver the same value for me.

Now, I can understand that CoH doesn't represent value for everyone - but of these folks that are wanting CoH to stay, why wouldn't they pay more? I am certain that I'm not the only one who's looked at the other games out there and found them lacking in comparison to CoH. As for this age of the game I hear people mention, what does that have to do with anything? Sure, I'd like for my characters to look more real and less cartoon-ish, but that's just the way the game is. As for Micro-transactions, who needs 'em? CoH got along just fine for years without them. The booster packs seemed to be a fine way to cram all those micro-transactions in one larger one.

But, I guess that's just me. Darn it, I never have been in the majority. 

[Knightslayer]

But why wouldn't people pay more for a game that they think is better than the other games? I look at it like cola. I like The booster packs seemed to be a fine way to cram all those micro-transactions in one larger one.

But, I guess that's just me. Darn it, I never have been in the majority. 

The benefit to micro transactions is, you still got those players that would buy the pack, which will still do as they've always done - but you also get those people who say "Meh, only the Baron coat interests me in the magic pack... I'm not paying that much for just one piece that I'd use.", these would suddenly be more willing to at least spend -some- money, as opposed to nothing at all (as they would've done if they had to choose between not getting the pack and paying for everything when they just wanted one piece).
Lets say that 50% of our current player base is actually dedicated (AND capable, remember that to some countries 15$ is a LOT of money already) enough to pay that 20$ instead of the 15$, which is probably already way more than the real number is. That means the other 50% would outright cancel their account - and now suddenly the game is losing a lot more money than before.