Doubters and Downers. . .

[BadWolf]

I think that if NC Soft were really interested in selling CoX, they would have done it by now. I think Windows 10 will be out later this year and I'm told that CoX won't run on Windows 10...

Honestly, this is kind of the problem with the thread. We're told, "Hey, don't be rude to people, this is the thread for people to come and discuss their worries, be kind to them, gently reassure them..." and after 9 solid pages of people gently and politely reassuring that this is a business deal and they take a long time and everyone's under a non-disclosure agreement and you probably won't hear any news until the deal is done but that doesn't mean progress isn't happening, it's right back to, "I didn't get an update today. The deal probably fell apart because NCSoft sux."

PEOPLE. Seriously. Deals like this take a long time. As in a _long_ time. As in sometimes years. And nobody talks about it while it's happening, especially not to random strangers who feel that just because they like videogames, they should be informed on every development in a private business deal between two private parties neither of which are them. We are going to hear nothing, and we are going to hear nothing for a long time, and that is true even if things are going swimmingly and everything is progressing at the fastest pace possible for a business deal of this nature. At this point, I feel like I have to say that if you want polite, gentle reassurance on that count, go back and read the first page of this thread where people still had the patience for it.

[Ironwolf]

I think what folks don't know is that this is new type of deal to NCSoft.

It also is basically 3 startup companies that NCSoft is going to check once, twice and three times to make sure they are capable.

1. CoT - new company with zero previous products under their wing at least as this entity.
2. CoH Unreal Version - is also brand new with literally no business plan on how to actually run the game at this point.
3. The steward company who will be hosting CoH Classic.

All of these are new. They may have capable people but no track record. NCSoft is not going to just throw the software at them and cash the check (or cheque). So it will take time to hash it out and make sure that it is going to operate as envisioned. When we say no news is good news it means that slowly but surely things are going forward. If things fall apart I have no doubt we would hear quickly.

That is not the feeling that appears to be coming out of the people involved - quiet optimism and certainty that it will all work out is what I am seeing.

[FloatingFatMan]

TBH IronWolf, if people don't get it by now, they're not going to get it, ever.  So, I say let 'em stew in their own doubts.

[BadWolf]

TBH IronWolf, if people don't get it by now, they're not going to get it, ever.  So, I say let 'em stew in their own doubts.

The problem with that is that some of them aren't stewing; they're loudly complaining, telling everyone that it's time to go to NCSoft and demand ACTION! NOW!, and generally behaving like the kind of people that NCSoft has already made it pointedly clear are exactly what they're worried about when they make this deal. They don't want to sell CoH only to have it blow up in a storm of bad publicity and angry fans, not when it's barely quieted down from the original shutdown decision. So if people act like it's time for some sort of hardball action, or petition, or to fund a new effort, all they're doing is hurting things. I'm okay with people stewing quietly in their own worry, but throwing a tantrum never helps.

[Ohioknight]

That is not the feeling that appears to be coming out of the people involved - quiet optimism and certainty that it will all work out is what I am seeing.

Well as the person for whom the thread was originated, the information we've gotten since then has certainly quelled my doubts...

_{(on the other hand, a part of me want's to scream.  It's not like they were planning on doing anything with the property OTHER than this)}

an oddly apt quotation comes to mind...
 
"Ed Gruberman: Yeah yeah yeah, patience. How long will that take?
Teacher: Time has no meaning. To a true student, a year is as a day.
Ed Gruberman: A YEAR??? I wanna beat people up right now!"

[Sihada]

The trouble is you personally are setting your own time period on the deal.

I've done no such thing.  I'm doing what every person does; looking at the information available and reaching my own conclusions.  My conclusions are different than your own.  All along, I have been saying that the timeline on this thing was going to be very long if it happened at all.  My position hasn't changed.

I'll be pleasantly surprised if I23 ever sees the light of day, and I think it'll be something of a miracle if it happens this year.

[Ironwolf]

I would like it up and running tomorrow.

I don't set any timeline - I don't say this year or next or never - I say Soon.

[GN2]

My concern isn't so much *if* it's happening (as has been already said many times, it never would have gotten this far if they had no intention of selling), so much as *how* it's going to happen if the deal is set.

Things like:
How many servers? I doubt that the game will have the population to support the same number of servers as it had (It barely did in the first place, most of the time a good number of the servers were ghost towns)

Are the f2p restrictions going to be the exact same as they were on live?

How will veteran rewards/past purchases be handled? I think it's safe to say that getting intact character data/account data is pretty unlikely at this point, so will everyone be starting from scratch on that front, or will they try to work something out?

Is "CoH 1.5" still the plan?

I know this may be a bit inappropriate to ask in this thread, but I greatly prefer this thread's atmosphere to that of the other two: Skepticism is healthy, and even if IW has been curt in some of his replies (putting it nicely), it shows that he does actually care about this, and I appreciate it for that.

[Burnt Toast]

None of the HOWS are known at this time. Once the ink is on the paper...that's when your questions as well as a myriad of other questions will be answered/figured out. The team already has an idea for pricing models etc, but that information will not become public knowledge until the deal is finished.


I would like to see only 4-5 servers personally and so NO ONE gets butt hurt... brand new names for each server.
RP Server (think Virtue)
Min/Max & pvp Server (like Freedom)
EU Server
etc


There was a thread... that contained a lot of people's ideas for new server names. The reason I think they should be renamed is: No matter what servers "get cut" someone will complain. So if you start with 4-5 servers with brand new names... no one can say "Hey my home server got cut!!!!!" My only hope is that the new servers are "explained" before/at launch so people like me who stayed as far away from RP as possible don't end up rolling toons on the RP server.


As for vet rewards etc... No clue what they plan. I would hope they plan different packages so to speak. Like $15 gets you a copy of the game and x amount of vet rewards. $30 copy of game and x+6 vet rewards, etc etc.


Anyways... until the deal is done...everything about how CoH Legacy will be ran is being kept hush hush.

My concern isn't so much *if* it's happening (as has been already said many times, it never would have gotten this far if they had no intention of selling), so much as *how* it's going to happen if the deal is set.

Things like:
How many servers? I doubt that the game will have the population to support the same number of servers as it had (It barely did in the first place, most of the time a good number of the servers were ghost towns)

Are the f2p restrictions going to be the exact same as they were on live?

How will veteran rewards/past purchases be handled? I think it's safe to say that getting intact character data/account data is pretty unlikely at this point, so will everyone be starting from scratch on that front, or will they try to work something out?

Is "CoH 1.5" still the plan?

I know this may be a bit inappropriate to ask in this thread, but I greatly prefer this thread's atmosphere to that of the other two: Skepticism is healthy, and even if IW has been curt in some of his replies (putting it nicely), it shows that he does actually care about this, and I appreciate it for that.

[BadWolf]

My concern isn't so much *if* it's happening (as has been already said many times, it never would have gotten this far if they had no intention of selling), so much as *how* it's going to happen if the deal is set.

Things like:
How many servers? I doubt that the game will have the population to support the same number of servers as it had (It barely did in the first place, most of the time a good number of the servers were ghost towns)

Are the f2p restrictions going to be the exact same as they were on live?

How will veteran rewards/past purchases be handled? I think it's safe to say that getting intact character data/account data is pretty unlikely at this point, so will everyone be starting from scratch on that front, or will they try to work something out?

Is "CoH 1.5" still the plan?

I know this may be a bit inappropriate to ask in this thread, but I greatly prefer this thread's atmosphere to that of the other two: Skepticism is healthy, and even if IW has been curt in some of his replies (putting it nicely), it shows that he does actually care about this, and I appreciate it for that.

And those are good questions--it's just that unfortunately it's too early to get answers. It's like going on a road trip, and asking what color the trees are in California when you're still in Oregon. All we can say back is, "Wait and see."

[mikenovember]

I would like it up and running tomorrow.

I don't set any timeline - I don't say this year or next or never - I say Soon.

I don't know... that's sayin a lot.   

Here's how I've looked at this news since the day it hit.   I've worked in software now for 20 years (scary thought) and in all that time there is only one thing I have 100% learned to count on.  Nothing is ever a done deal until it's out the door and shipped - and even that is pushing it. 

But that doesn't mean you don't push forward.  If you don't nothing gets done.  Nothing gets shipped.  No software ever gets made.  I've worked for companies that had the money, the resources, the legal, the you name it - to do anything they wanted and make it happen if they wanted to - with total backing from all the way up the chain on a project, only to come in one morning and see the ever so bright project - shelved.  I've also seen them go from having nothing going on, to completed and out the door in 3 months.

There are no done deals.  Ever.  There are no closed deals.  Ever.  The only thing you can rely on is that if someone, somewhere, has the drive and the ambition, a bit of luck and a hell of a lot of moxy driving to something they really want, then it can happen, and often does. 

You've got a lot of people wanting to make this happen.  You've got people working very hard and doing it right - they're not being children and demanding.  They're showing the right amount of interest and attention, they're speaking to the right people, and they're capable of not blinking.  They understand that the people who hold the cards in this aren't on their time table and aren't on their schedule.  We need to understand that too. 

Patience sucks.  It's hard to be a good fisherman, a good hunter, or a good businessman.  You have to set things in motion and wait.  Nudge them along.  Wait.  Look for when things are too quiet and nudge a bit more.  Wait. 

When the moment is right ... you get what you want.  Hearing nothing is good.  There are only two sounds you need to listen for... the sound of someone giving up, and the sound for someone saying "Yes".  The rest, is just patience and background noise.

Ironwolf and all the folks who have worked so hard for so long on this have earned a lot of trust and respect for good reasons.  My thanks to them for their dedication and patience.

[Ironwolf]

My concern isn't so much *if* it's happening (as has been already said many times, it never would have gotten this far if they had no intention of selling), so much as *how* it's going to happen if the deal is set.

Things like:
How many servers? I doubt that the game will have the population to support the same number of servers as it had (It barely did in the first place, most of the time a good number of the servers were ghost towns)

Are the f2p restrictions going to be the exact same as they were on live?

How will veteran rewards/past purchases be handled? I think it's safe to say that getting intact character data/account data is pretty unlikely at this point, so will everyone be starting from scratch on that front, or will they try to work something out?

Is "CoH 1.5" still the plan?

I know this may be a bit inappropriate to ask in this thread, but I greatly prefer this thread's atmosphere to that of the other two: Skepticism is healthy, and even if IW has been curt in some of his replies (putting it nicely), it shows that he does actually care about this, and I appreciate it for that.

Please realize if I do get curt - it is because I have answered the same questions often hundreds of times. I try answering them in different ways and yet in many cases people just read what they want to read. I know you aren't aware but you get everything from let me buy you stuff to threats to come to your house and attack you.

In between we have a deal going but many of the questions about servers and finance - I want to know myself

[Ohioknight]

I would like to see only 4-5 servers personally and so NO ONE gets butt hurt... brand new names for each server.
RP Server (think Virtue)
Min/Max & pvp Server (like Freedom)
EU Server
etc

There was a thread... that contained a lot of people's ideas for new server names. The reason I think they should be renamed is: No matter what servers "get cut" someone will complain. So if you start with 4-5 servers with brand new names... no one can say "Hey my home server got cut!!!!!" My only hope is that the new servers are "explained" before/at launch so people like me who stayed as far away from RP as possible don't end up rolling toons on the RP server.

As for vet rewards etc... No clue what they plan. I would hope they plan different packages so to speak. Like $15 gets you a copy of the game and x amount of vet rewards. $30 copy of game and x+6 vet rewards, etc etc.

That all sounds remarkably sensible and very workable -- personally I'd hope that they added character slots per server to the subscription plans or fee structure -- so RP players who wanted 100-some characters could buy 100 slots on the RP server (or whatever)

[microc]

I like to see some people do art for coh for posters or shirts. have a nice empty wall that could use some tanker art.

[Abraxus]

Please realize if I do get curt - it is because I have answered the same questions often hundreds of times. I try answering them in different ways and yet in many cases people just read what they want to read. I know you aren't aware but you get everything from let me buy you stuff to threats to come to your house and attack you.

In between we have a deal going but many of the questions about servers and finance - I want to know myself

I don't know if this has been suggested, but perhaps a thread containing a FAQ which consolidates all of this information.  In the future, your only answer would be "Please refer to the FAQ located here".

[Angel Phoenix77]

I don't know if this has been suggested, but perhaps a thread containing a FAQ which consolidates all of this information.  In the future, your only answer would be "Please refer to the FAQ located here".

there is a time line to look at when it comes to the events.  Look for wolf's post. http://www.cohtitan.com/forum/index.php/topic,9675.0.html

[Arcana]

I would like to see only 4-5 servers personally and so NO ONE gets butt hurt... brand new names for each server.

Of course, if one of the new servers is called "Butt Hurt" then that would be difficult.

[Codewalker]

That all sounds remarkably sensible and very workable -- personally I'd hope that they added character slots per server to the subscription plans or fee structure -- so RP players who wanted 100-some characters could buy 100 slots on the RP server (or whatever)

Changing server names requires patching the client, and recompiling a binary file that whoever buys it probably won't get the tools to do. If they ask for community help it might be possible because there are a couple people who know the format well enough to both read and write it, but it would be much easier to simply re-use one of the old server names.

More than 48 characters per server is simply impossible without source code.

[pinballdave]

Changing server names requires patching the client, and recompiling a binary file that whoever buys it probably won't get the tools to do. If they ask for community help it might be possible because there are a couple people who know the format well enough to both read and write it, but it would be much easier to simply re-use one of the old server names.

More than 48 characters per server is simply impossible without source code.

I am not entirely sure what difficulty there would be in changing the names of the servers. The level in entering the game is before you even create a character and we know the character names can change. However, I admit my ignorance on this matter.

There is far, far less chance they can add more than the standard default numbers. There is Hope in CoH 1.5 which Irish Girl is writing.

[ukaserex]

I think what folks don't know is that this is new type of deal to NCSoft.

It also is basically 3 startup companies that NCSoft is going to check once, twice and three times to make sure they are capable.

1. CoT - new company with zero previous products under their wing at least as this entity.
2. CoH Unreal Version - is also brand new with literally no business plan on how to actually run the game at this point.
3. The steward company who will be hosting CoH Classic.

All of these are new. They may have capable people but no track record. NCSoft is not going to just throw the software at them and cash the check (or cheque). So it will take time to hash it out and make sure that it is going to operate as envisioned. When we say no news is good news it means that slowly but surely things are going forward. If things fall apart I have no doubt we would hear quickly.

That is not the feeling that appears to be coming out of the people involved - quiet optimism and certainty that it will all work out is what I am seeing.

It is threads like these that give me an appreciation of how very little I use my own brain sometimes. I "knew" that these people had no track record. I "knew" that any owner of an IP would be making a very solid effort to ensure that the purchase would go to group/company capable of running it.

And yet...I never really put those thoughts together.
I also don't think I put it in my head that they were reviewing multiple groups - I thought it was just the one. I'd been trying to not torture myself by visiting the forums so often. Must have missed that part.

But anyway, glad to see the nice summary of the why it's taking so long. In a way, I think it will be a good thing for the other games coming out - Valiance, MWM, HvsV - I don't think too many people would play them if CoH went back online - at least, not the way they will while it's still out. But, I could certainly be wrong. Lord knows I've been wrong plenty of times.

Hope everyone had a Merry Christmas and are enjoying a good start to the New Year!