New efforts!

[Felderburg]

Having thought about this a litte, would anyone from paragonwiki be interested in having the files for more general perusal?

Well, I'm pretty sure that there are a few articles that may reference the videos, so it would be nice if they were put up on youtube or something, so that links could be appropriately targeted.

[Arcana]

Before I bought City of Heroes, I read about the powersets, and it was the Gravity Control powerset that really attracted me to the game.
Was there a power-set you guys got drawn in by?

Its cliche, but its energy blast.  That's what got me into the game, that's what I played as my main from level 1 to full incarnate, that's what I was signed in as when the end came.  And I liked it probably for all the reasons a lot of people didn't.  I liked its power diversity, I liked knocking things around, I liked the (relatively slow) animations.  Not that I didn't try to get those sped up a bit for balance purposes, but I still liked them.

I've yet to find another game that offers gravity control as a power.
I like the idea of gravity control vs telekinesis, because its more like magnetism. You create a gravity field that pulls objects towards it, opposed to actually physically manipulating the object itself.
Not to mention that gravity offers up potentials for wormhole and singularity creation etc.

But do you miss Fold Space?

[Arcana]

Really though your intuition has stumbled on to something. However scientists would rather believe in a force we have no actual proof of so they can attempt to explain time and space by lumping them into a 'fabric'.

My wish for the day is that you are cursed to walk the Earth with every GPS you ever own giving you directions that only use your laws of physics and not relativistic ones.

Also, "fabric" is a metaphor used to explain spacetime to laypeople that do not have a background in relativistic higher mathematics and artists who make textbook covers.

[Taceus Jiwede]

Also, "fabric" is a metaphor used to explain spacetime to laypeople that do not have a background in relativistic higher mathematics and artists who make textbook covers.

Wait......my shirt is made out of math? I'll let my self out.

[Arcana]

Wait......my shirt is made out of math?

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/03/d7/e5/03d7e5c459d0209a359f9d41d3ace631.jpg

[adarict]

what you are speaking of started as a trend long ago when video game companies lost their dream and became obsessed with getting the final outcome, money.

you look at developers like Gumpei Yokoi and you see the difference, they were there because they loved doing their job, their goal was to make something to entertain audiences, and rather than just assuming that market trends were a representative of what people want they made new things that followed no trends but instead their own educated guess to see who bit. now days it's all trend following, and we know who starts the trends, and we know how simple and down right boring those trends are at the end of it all, and that tells us a lot about the games spawned by trends replay value.

modern developers? most are there because of money, or there because because. they really don't like making games, it's a lot of work and they really have 0 care about their audience aside from what tactics they can use to get money from them. Of course they are going to half-ass stuff, they'll half-ass anything they can get away with. 0 drive to try, 0 drive to think, 0 drive to develop new anything.

then there's the scrum process, an unnecessary evil that just makes bad teams make worse games. And they call it 'the agile development process', agile psh yeah right. You get a bunch of people who know nothing who were hired and born yesterday saying things like "wouldn't it be cool if [their own idea based off some weird dream that really has no place in the proposed game series]?" and all of them are accepted, called "user stories" and put up on a to do list. Some may be disregarded due to time constraints or just plain laziness, or too many smoke breaks, but usually the most outlandish ones get put in first, you know the ones that someone came up with late at night that they thought was the most awesome thing in the world but really wasn't.

Then there are the devs who have some sort of mental problem which makes them unable to make logical connections so when someone spouts out a silly idea, like "lets make all the NPCs bobble heads" these devs say "well the only way we can make this work is if we add in a randomizer statistic for the battle calculations that has nothing to do with the bobble head it's just there to piss off players."

It's like; I can understand goign from A to B, but how the heck did you just put A1 and Q8 together as if something completely unrelated and not a logical conclusion at all is the only valid direct result of something entirely different? or the better question: What are you smoking?

CO? I cannot judge this game, I get bored playing it too much to actually know enough to comment. but that may just be me.

Truly, I am gobsmacked.  Your understanding of so many topics bears next to zero resemblance to reality.  Your generalizations of the motivations of game developers are just plain ignorant.  While I have a significant disdain for the agile/scrum process, your description and complaints of the process shows that you only actually know about it from anecdotes.

I find your bizarre comments on math and/or the theory of the universe amusing.  I'm sure Arcana doesn't find it anywhere near as amusing, since you are messing with her area of expertise.  For that same reason, I take offense to your spouting of stupidity as it relates to software design.  I see you talk about all this work you do designing games, and all of this.  There is no way that you actually participate in any large scale software endeavor if you truly believe the things you are spouting.  You are a hobbyist, who possibly works for a company that also produces software.  There is no way you are directly involved in it, unless you are an entry level QA person, or a brand newly hired developer.  There are a number of projects that Agile is not suited for, but none of them apply to anything you are saying.  Any software company who worked the way you described, would last a very short amount of time unless they already had a monopoly on some sector.

You want to have an opinion about it?  Go right ahead.  Doesn't mean your opinion has any basis in reality.  You give software developers (and apparently a great many other professions) a bad name.

[Felderburg]

Scrum: https://www.atlassian.com/agile/scrum
Agile whatever: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agile_software_development

I did not feel like reading those articles in depth, but hopefully other people that want to know what's going on will find them useful.

I find your bizarre comments on math and/or the theory of the universe amusing.  I'm sure Arcana doesn't find it anywhere near as amusing, since you are messing with her area of expertise.

*Is* Arcana's area of expertise "math and / or the theory of the universe"?

[adarict]

Scrum: https://www.atlassian.com/agile/scrum
Agile whatever: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agile_software_development

I did not feel like reading those articles in depth, but hopefully other people that want to know what's going on will find them useful.

*Is* Arcana's area of expertise "math and / or the theory of the universe"?

As far as I can tell, she seems to be the foremost authority.  :)  Close enough for me.

[Vee]

*Is* Arcana's area of expertise "math and / or the theory of the universe"?

She has many areas of expertise, but they all pale next to her encyclopedic knowledge of rousing sea shanties.

[pinballdave]

Many of them are actual people, and of those some are great, some are average, some are Kellogg's Frosted Flakes. <snip>

Personally I am more cuckoo for cocoa puffs.

[Arcana]

*Is* Arcana's area of expertise "math and / or the theory of the universe"?

No, it is not.  Math and Science are things I've been interested in since I was young, and as someone with an educational background in physical sciences and engineering they are things I have more than a passing knowledge of.  If you're currently going for your PhD in relativistic physics, you almost certainly know more than me about that.  But I can hold my own against anyone outside the professionals.  Basically, I can answer questions well, and I can recognize pseudo-science bovine fertilizer from a mile away.  But if any professionals want to come in and correct me on something, by all means.

On the other hand, information systems is.  Joshex's statement(s) about programmers is basically Dan Brown territory.  Some people like scrum.  Some people hate scrum.  The steely eyed professionals know it has pros and cons.  I don't know anyone that would characterize the problem with scrum anywhere close to what Joshex is saying.  Agile-scrum should replace top-down driven development with agile devs working within an administrative framework.  It often isn't: its often implemented by managers who still try to keep top-down control, and then it becomes a nightmare of amplified top-down requirement change dumpster fires.  That's almost never the fault of the actual developers themselves becoming lazy brainstorming chain smokers.  Actually the opposite.  Agile becomes the excuse to allow management to toss out change control and vomit crazy specs non-stop.  And it doesn't encourage aggressive creativity as Joshex asserts, but over time the reverse: it encourages people to become more timid when making suggestions so that those timid suggestions have a higher probability of scoring agile brown-nose points with management.

And really, in my opinion agile should be a temporary or limited-use development tool/methodology.  During a guerrilla boot-strap phase, or as a limited lifespan troubleshooting hit team, or an emergency fix to a project about to sink.  It should not be a permanent lifecycle fixture.  Very few managers can resist the temptation to corrupt the scrum process when handed the reigns indefinitely.  Eventually the lack of checks and balances becomes self-defeating.

[Arcana]

She has many areas of expertise, but they all pale next to her encyclopedic knowledge of rousing sea shanties.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPYAZUcohmw

[JoshexProxy]

On the other hand, information systems is.  Joshex's statement(s) about programmers is basically Dan Brown territory.  Some people like scrum.  Some people hate scrum.  The steely eyed professionals know it has pros and cons.  I don't know anyone that would characterize the problem with scrum anywhere close to what Joshex is saying.  Agile-scrum should replace top-down driven development with agile devs working within an administrative framework.  It often isn't: its often implemented by managers who still try to keep top-down control, and then it becomes a nightmare of amplified top-down requirement change dumpster fires.  That's almost never the fault of the actual developers themselves becoming lazy brainstorming chain smokers.  Actually the opposite.  Agile becomes the excuse to allow management to toss out change control and vomit crazy specs non-stop.  And it doesn't encourage aggressive creativity as Joshex asserts, but over time the reverse: it encourages people to become more timid when making suggestions so that those timid suggestions have a higher probability of scoring agile brown-nose points with management.

And really, in my opinion agile should be a temporary or limited-use development tool/methodology.  During a guerrilla boot-strap phase, or as a limited lifespan troubleshooting hit team, or an emergency fix to a project about to sink.  It should not be a permanent lifecycle fixture.  Very few managers can resist the temptation to corrupt the scrum process when handed the reigns indefinitely.  Eventually the lack of checks and balances becomes self-defeating.

yes. I suppose I shouldn't have said 'most' developers but, I know of a few teams that do do as I said, so I suppose I should say 'a few'. where as I know a few teams that do as you've described here, however both have the same effect, people don't really come up with anything new. Retro studios for example was bullied by the nintendo execs when they made metroid prime on just about every aspect, originally when in the process of being given the license to work on it they had to legally agree that they would not violate a statement. the statement; "just don't make it zelda in space." what the execs meant was they didn't want to see mother brain returning every 2 games like gannon as well as gameplay aspects had to never look or feel zelda-ey, in fact that's part of the reason it became an FPS, another reason was they decided samus's main ability was shooting.

but don't think there was no laziness going on there, speed booster was omitted from the prime series and replaced with speedboost ball and several other attempts, why? because getting the physics right was over their heads/time constraints. then there's space jump, omitted and replaced in metroid prime because of pure laziness in environment design (the environment would have to be 'capped' for one thing where as you can turn on a jump hack with action replay to find out that it isn't, there is no roof to keep players from leaving the environment area and falling to their doom) retro just wanted to make it look good to get nintendo off their backs. Same thing with high jump boots which was essentially what they replaced spacejump with (just not as high), they didn't want to be bothered controlling platform/ledge heights. then there was their next attempt at spacejump in a later game which limited players to a ground-parallel non-turning 11 max jumps because anything else would have allowed too much freedom which would have required better environment designs. it was at this point where they kinda figured out that FPS was not the ideal match for metroid in 3D, but still haven't broken from it probably due to a bit of executive push for consistency and laziness because they don't want to have to redo the physics and figure out how to do purposed environment design and how to build the game around the use of samus's other abilities as well as shooting.

they made some attempts to fix this, by including the wall jump  but made it only work in certain areas (just like they limited spiderball) because that would take systematic purposed environment design everywhere that it mattered.

then there was team ninja's attempt at metroid, they were constantly in fights with the execs because the execs took the driver seat. what did it turn into? a metroid fusion in 3D, "you can't go there, you must go here, now, now... bob dole.. now.." not much of an adventure game if you're always told where to go and what to do and there aren't even other options. that and they changed Samus's personality from a hardened yet intelligent bounty hunter to.. Hey look folks it's captain stupid! she's your typical mindless fan-service character that always needs someone else to tell her what to do.

the difference between:

Samus Aran; Space Hunter, traits: this person feels most at home when they are alone without friendly communication deep inside a hostile alien home base, killing things in an emotionless fashion for cash and then blowing it up later.

Samus Aran; ditsy, traits: can't think for herself, is afraid of any slightly worrying situation and needs constant communication with a  superior officer, is emotional.

[Victoria Victrix]

*Looks at another tl;dr crazy-infested Joshex post.*

*Goes to look at cockatoo videos instead."

[ivanhedgehog]

*Looks at another tl;dr crazy-infested Joshex post.*

*Goes to look at cockatoo videos instead."

good choice, I have 2 cockatoos and they are a blast.

[JoshexProxy]

*Looks at another tl;dr crazy-infested Joshex post.*

*Goes to look at cockatoo videos instead."

summary;

I shouldn't have said most, But do know of a few who function like I specified, then went on to say I also know of some that function like Arcana specified and gave cases that I happen to know well.

[Vee]

I know nothing about game design or this argument but I do know that people on this forum aren't going to accept a game from 2002 as your example of current game design trends. It's 2004 or gtfo with this crew.

[Arcana]

I shouldn't have said most, But do know of a few who function like I specified, then went on to say I also know of some that function like Arcana specified and gave cases that I happen to know well.

So who exactly do you know at Retro Studios that you can describe their inner workings knowledgeably?

[JoshexProxy]

So who exactly do you know at Retro Studios that you can describe their inner workings knowledgeably?

Everything I have said was either the output of a nintendo power article which interviewed persons, in a video made by the developers released for sale as some special or included in game as an un-lockable, or in a very small number of cases pulled from ign, gamespy or other online articles etc. oh and the MDB.

some of it is based on my knowledge of Gumpei Yokoi's metroid universe and his goals for the game (did you know he had a personal goal in life to try and make girls become gamers? yep metroid was one such initiative, create a strong female lead character that could make mulan or frozen cry (who didn't exist at the time)).

Personal: I used to rant on the nintendo forums about how different metroid prime was from classic metroid til the devs stepped in and admitted I had a point but that there were restrictions that kept them from doing this and not just executive restrictions, one was the physics consideration, Samus just doesn't do 3D physics well, she's too acrobatic and graceful, and in some cases too heavy footed, you can't do both. or at least that's the summary of the few things they've said.

I however have my methods to do both. it just takes initiative and long hours to figure it out.

[darkgob]

Everything I have said was either the output of a nintendo power article which interviewed persons, in a video made by the developers released for sale as some special or included in game as an un-lockable, or in a very small number of cases pulled from ign, gamespy or other online articles etc. oh and the MDB.

some of it is based on my knowledge of Gumpei Yokoi's metroid universe and his goals for the game (did you know he had a personal goal in life to try and make girls become gamers? yep metroid was one such initiative, create a strong female lead character that could make mulan or frozen cry (who didn't exist at the time)).

Personal: I used to rant on the nintendo forums about how different metroid prime was from classic metroid til the devs stepped in and admitted I had a point but that there were restrictions that kept them from doing this and not just executive restrictions, one was the physics consideration, Samus just doesn't do 3D physics well, she's too acrobatic and graceful, and in some cases too heavy footed, you can't do both. or at least that's the summary of the few things they've said.

I however have my methods to do both. it just takes initiative and long hours to figure it out.

[citation needed]