Author Topic: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile  (Read 13790 times)

Night-Hawk07

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Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« on: May 13, 2014, 08:49:20 PM »
So yesterday, Zach Snyder tweeted a teaser shot of the Batmobile, and said he'd tweet the real deal "tomorrow", which is today. So here it is (hi-res shot here).



Not a fan of the short ears, but I like the rest of the suit. It goes back to looking more like his "normal" appearance and not the ultra-realistic Bat-inspired commando of the Nolan films. Can't see much of the car, but it too looks like it's going back to what we know the Batmobile to look like. Affleck looks goofier in this suit than he did in Daredevil. He doesn't look mean, he looks pouty. I just don't see myself taking him seriously.

Anyway, enough of my rambling; thoughts?

Tenzhi

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2014, 09:03:04 PM »
Can't see it well enough to judge...
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Night-Hawk07

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2014, 09:15:50 PM »
Here's another shot of the car. It's mostly under a cover, but you can get an idea of the general shape, length, etc.


Eoraptor

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2014, 12:38:30 AM »
when I look at that second shot, all I can think of is watching the schlocky batmobile from Batman and Robin and watching it's nasty plexiglass tails bounce as it drove around.
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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2014, 02:08:27 AM »
when I look at that second shot, all I can think of is watching the schlocky batmobile from Batman and Robin and watching it's nasty plexiglass tails bounce as it drove around.

I think if you look closely and compare the two shots, you will see that the "nasty plexiglass tails" effect is an unfortunate perspective issue -- that's some form of flat panel-armor or something on actuators.
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Night-Hawk07

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2014, 04:40:54 AM »
I was thinking more of a cross between the Tumbler's aesthetic (all the plates and angles, etc) with the '89 shape. One of the articles I read said it looked more like the Batmobile form Morrison and Quietly's run in the comics that could also fly. Not sure how they get this:



From the above pics posted earlier.

Magus Prime

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2014, 06:59:13 AM »
Agreed on the ears.  Those are totally Catwoman ears.  Not crazy about the insignia either.  Looks cartoony.  When Snyder revealed that Batman would be in the sequel, they showed the S shield over the bat emblem and I thought there was no way that they were going to use that logo.  Lo and behold I was wrong.  To paraphrase a line from Kingdom Come, "The trust you engendered is fast eroding."

Arcana

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2014, 09:24:13 AM »
Agreed on the ears.  Those are totally Catwoman ears.  Not crazy about the insignia either.  Looks cartoony.  When Snyder revealed that Batman would be in the sequel, they showed the S shield over the bat emblem and I thought there was no way that they were going to use that logo.  Lo and behold I was wrong.  To paraphrase a line from Kingdom Come, "The trust you engendered is fast eroding."
Trusting that they'll do what you want to do and not what they are telegraphing they are going to do is an odd form of trust.

Magus Prime

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #8 on: May 14, 2014, 10:54:55 AM »
Trusting that they'll do what you want to do and not what they are telegraphing they are going to do is an odd form of trust.

I think that might be an oversimplification.  I loved Man of Steel and was really excited upon the first announcement that Batman would be in the next film.  Snyder and team set a glide path for success and I felt like the franchise was in good hands.  Then the news that Affleck was going to play Batman shook my faith initially although I warmed up to the idea not long after.  Then I hear about Wonder Woman's involvement and I'm dubious about possibly having too many cooks in the kitchen, so to speak.  And finally, along comes Jessie Eisenberg to play Lex Luthor.  At this point, I'm shaking my head and shrugging my shoulders. 

In any case, I'll thank you not to be so quick to judge and as quick to condescend.

Tenzhi

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #9 on: May 14, 2014, 12:01:38 PM »
Saw an enhanced pic of the suit over at Nodwick.com and I like the form.  I need to see it in colour though.  Hoping we get some contrast with the emblem - Batman is not Metallica, nor is he spending a year dead for tax purposes.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #10 on: May 14, 2014, 01:20:57 PM »
I like it, it's a brave choice for a Batman movie costume, literally every other incarnation of the cinematic suit has been one thing: black rubber armor with tall ears. From what I can tell we've got a very comic book faithful costume, gray on black colors, and the short ears featured heavily in Batman's origins, 60s show, Frank Millers work, etc etc. The short ears are as much Batman as the longer ears are.

Very excited about seeing more of this suit and the Batmobile, I think they both look fantastic in these teasers.

About the tail fin from the previous movies looking cheap and wobbly, I suspect that's because they were cheap and wobbly. The Batmobile from Batman and Robin was extremely over the top, anytime it moved everything shook. The tail fin on this one appears to be machined metal, I doubt it will wobble like the cheap plastic fins on the B&R batmobile.

Night-Hawk07

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #11 on: May 14, 2014, 08:09:13 PM »
Agreed on the ears.  Those are totally Catwoman ears.  Not crazy about the insignia either.  Looks cartoony.  When Snyder revealed that Batman would be in the sequel, they showed the S shield over the bat emblem and I thought there was no way that they were going to use that logo.  Lo and behold I was wrong.  To paraphrase a line from Kingdom Come, "The trust you engendered is fast eroding."

It's funny you should say that about the ears. My first thought was Catman:



I guess I'm just not a fan of them cause that's not what I grew up with, so they look weird to me. Even though I grew up in Kelley Jones' era of 6ft tall ears, those were also really unappealing. Even the ones in the Arkham games were a bit tall for my taste. Origins got it right. The insignia (and the logo you mention) looks like it's supposed to be an homage to The Dark Knight Returns. I just hope this movie isn't going to be a film version of that book.

CG

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #12 on: May 14, 2014, 08:41:12 PM »
My first thought was The Dark Knight Returns:



Short ears, big bat, no yellow, beefy guy.

Eoraptor

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2014, 12:08:42 AM »
My first thought was The Dark Knight Returns:



Short ears, big bat, no yellow, beefy guy.
I woulda thought that, except for the sulky pouty posture
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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #14 on: May 15, 2014, 01:10:05 AM »

 ;D
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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #15 on: May 15, 2014, 01:31:34 AM »
I woulda thought that, except for the sulky pouty posture

Reading a lot into a single frame, aren't you?
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Arcana

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #16 on: May 15, 2014, 05:41:03 AM »
In any case, I'll thank you not to be so quick to judge and as quick to condescend.
Its generally a bad idea to accuse me of something I'm not doing.  It compels me to demonstrate the difference.

Magus Prime

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #17 on: May 15, 2014, 09:32:49 AM »
Its generally a bad idea to accuse me of something I'm not doing.  It compels me to demonstrate the difference.

I cordially challenge you to prove my ignorance. Intent notwithstanding, your verbiage falls short of making any other point than to belittle me and/or my opinion.

Lightslinger

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #18 on: May 15, 2014, 01:08:07 PM »
Yeah honestly that pose is pure Batman, sure its fine to argue against Superman, Spiderman, Iron Man, any of those guys being moody and pouty, but that's pure Bats. Also this is very much a teaser shot, he was trying to hide details while giving us overall impressions of the suit, which worked.

This is easily one of the best constructed superhero costume previews ever, they are generally either really bad publicity shots or set shots which look awful. It really takes a lot of cinematography to make superhero suits not look silly.

Nos482

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #19 on: May 15, 2014, 04:49:17 PM »
I woulda thought that, except for the sulky pouty posture
I have to agree, that pose is an absolute no go...
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...unless I could be Batman, of course. Everybody wants to be Batman.

Arcana

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #20 on: May 15, 2014, 06:53:43 PM »
Yeah honestly that pose is pure Batman, sure its fine to argue against Superman, Spiderman, Iron Man, any of those guys being moody and pouty, but that's pure Bats.
Well, Batman is not so much moody as he tends to have only one mood.  And that picture is pretty much it.

SerialBeggar

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #21 on: May 15, 2014, 09:37:21 PM »
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Night-Hawk07

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2014, 03:48:08 PM »
I think it's possible to brood without looking like you just found out Ace ran away.

Tenzhi

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2014, 05:46:08 PM »
I think it's possible that seeing a pout in that dark blot is a sort of Rorschach test.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Night-Hawk07

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #24 on: May 19, 2014, 01:10:36 AM »
Hey! Looks like I wasn't the only one who saw Catman: https://twitter.com/Syncos2/status/466277163012878336/photo/1

Got it from this page showing color variations of the costume from Frank Miller to the current New 52 look.

Lightslinger

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #25 on: May 19, 2014, 10:43:41 AM »
I'd say that's more because Catman is derivative of Batman, but hey, that is pretty hilarious!

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2014, 09:44:14 PM »
I'm bad and that's good.
I'll never be good and that's not bad.
There's no one I'd rather be than me.

...unless I could be Batman, of course. Everybody wants to be Batman.

Magus Prime

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #27 on: July 31, 2014, 07:04:28 PM »

FatherXmas

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #28 on: August 01, 2014, 04:05:14 AM »
I don't think it's bad.  I also think it is red, gold and blue but the lighting makes it look like variations of brown.
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Tenzhi

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #29 on: August 06, 2014, 08:16:26 AM »
I don't think it's bad.  I also think it is red, gold and blue but the lighting makes it look like variations of brown.

I can't help but feel that you saw the name Wonder Woman in that link and assumed it was the pic of her costume that's been making rounds.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Taceus Jiwede

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #30 on: August 06, 2014, 08:29:33 PM »
I can't help but feel that you saw the name Wonder Woman in that link and assumed it was the pic of her costume that's been making rounds.

I can't help think that FatherXmas was either A) making a joke, or B) talking about something else.  He has never led me to believe he would make assumptions based on a link title.

Tenzhi

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #31 on: August 07, 2014, 03:43:59 AM »
He's led me to believe he's human, and humans have a natural tendency to fill in blanks - even those that aren't actually blank under scrutiny - with known information.  His statement would seem contextually to indicate that's what happened.  I suppose there's a chance he was purposely applying a common comment for the circulated costume pic to the invisible jet.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #32 on: August 07, 2014, 05:10:40 AM »
I can't help but feel that you saw the name Wonder Woman in that link and assumed it was the pic of her costume that's been making rounds.

And that's what I get for not reading and assuming it was more dislike at the picture of Wonder Woman.
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Tenzhi

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #33 on: August 07, 2014, 08:49:01 AM »
And on the subject of that costume:  personally, I thought it was pretty good.  I'll be more pleased with it if it does turn out to have more of the appropriate colours to it, but I could live with it as bronze and leather. 
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Taceus Jiwede

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #34 on: August 07, 2014, 08:02:04 PM »
Ah well then!  I stand corrected  :P

FatherXmas

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #35 on: August 08, 2014, 01:22:50 AM »
Well got as far as "Leaked picture of Wonder Woman ..." and started typing.  On point about the costume, I didn't think it was bad and I do believe it's in red, blue and gold.  Darker, muter reds and blues like Superman's outfit but the dust and lighting sort of colors everything brown.
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Ohioknight

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #36 on: August 08, 2014, 12:17:05 PM »
Well got as far as "Leaked picture of Wonder Woman ..." and started typing.  On point about the costume, I didn't think it was bad and I do believe it's in red, blue and gold.  Darker, muter reds and blues like Superman's outfit but the dust and lighting sort of colors everything brown.

The Lasso isn't gold and needs to be, but that could be (and might well be intended to be) fixed post-production (considering it glows like a light-sabre)

We need Comic movies to have muted costume colors because bright comic-bookish colors might mean the films would be as unsuccessful as, oh... say, Iron Man
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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #37 on: August 08, 2014, 03:12:40 PM »
Day and night...



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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #38 on: August 08, 2014, 07:10:22 PM »
Wonder Woman's outfit looks SO much different in the day time. ;D
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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #39 on: August 08, 2014, 08:44:38 PM »
The Lasso isn't gold and needs to be, but that could be (and might well be intended to be) fixed post-production (considering it glows like a light-sabre)

We need Comic movies to have muted costume colors because bright comic-bookish colors might mean the films would be as unsuccessful as, oh... say, Iron Man

Absolutely. Comic-book movies are serious business. The days of putting in stupid kiddie comedy business like wacky talking animals is in the past now.

What'll they suggest next, a climactic dance-off?

houtex

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #40 on: August 09, 2014, 02:54:26 AM »
Training/contest costume vs the one she'll wear outside Themyscira, way not the same one.

Eoraptor

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #41 on: August 09, 2014, 02:56:16 AM »
Absolutely. Comic-book movies are serious business. The days of putting in stupid kiddie comedy business like wacky talking animals is in the past now.

What'll they suggest next, a climactic dance-off?
XD


but seriously, I thought the suit in Superman Returns struck a good balance. It was not so garishly colored that it clashed with the setting, but it was also not so drab or washed out as to seem like they were actively avoiding the character's roots. DC needs to learn what Marvel seems to know... you have to embrace the super-human and wild nature of any comic book movie. They make a fine batman movie; but superman is not batman, and wonder woman is not batman. Sadly, the nu52 is almost entirely batman it seems.

I'll be over here, with the ol' school stuff, and my fan fictions, and my web comics.
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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #42 on: August 09, 2014, 03:41:44 PM »
DC is in a sort of revolution in their characters.  New 52 (which I've not read, but that's a reboot, as I understand it) and now, with the success of Batman Begins and changing quite a bit of how to tell the story of Batman, I suspect the 'as real as possible' method is where DC/Warner is going to take this stuff.  The Nolanverse Batman is still somewhat fantastic in nature, but the underpinnings for the suit and the tech is still based in 'what is, for the most part, possible today?  How could this really possibly happen if it were to be an actual thing?'

'Course, they got a little bit away from that to get the last movie in, with the nuke power thing, and the Bat.  Not saying it couldn't happen, but...

I like the new direction, myself.  I have some issues with some things in Man of Steel that show much more vulnerability of Kal that could be exploited (atmospherics can change his abilities?!  Snap his neck and he's done?  Jonathan didn't have to die that way.  Or at all, to be honest!) but overall, the 'more like real life' direction appeals to me.  Kal El, put simply, could never have a perfect 'never kill' ratio in real life on this Earth.  And honestly, neither could Batman.

So their being more human... or more correctly, more 'real'... is a good thing, for me.  Just wish some of the story wasn't so suck sometimes, but eh... it's a comic book movie.  Gotta just let some of it go and enjoy the thing as much as possible, right?

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #43 on: September 10, 2014, 03:14:24 PM »

houtex

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #44 on: September 11, 2014, 02:07:16 AM »
Doors are stupid.  I mean... Batman wouldn't design that.  FOX wouldn't design that.  You can't open the doors unless you have 8 foot or more of clearance. 

What if he had to get out in a parking garage?

*raspy batvoice:*

"You wait right here.  I gotta find a parking space, then I'll get out and kick your ass.  Better yet, can you just meet me outside the garage?  Thanks."

Nice one, guys.

Other than that, looks cool, similar to the Tumbler enough.

SerialBeggar

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #45 on: September 11, 2014, 03:33:13 AM »
Maybe there'll be an instance in the movie where he needs to improvise a braking parachute.   :roll:
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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #46 on: September 11, 2014, 03:16:05 PM »
I tend to like the Batmobile looking more like a car than a tank.  That thing is a monstrosity I'd expect to find in some futuristic Space Marine film, not as the sleek stealth car that Batman is supposed to drive.

I guess I want a car that's a little more Knight Rider and a lot less Aliens vs. Predator.

Night-Hawk07

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #47 on: September 11, 2014, 06:55:46 PM »
I read a comment on an article (might have been the one I posted) where someone said they always felt the Batmobile should look like a cross between a tank and an F1 car. I tend to agree, and this one seems to fit that. I also agree that the doors look stupid.

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #48 on: September 12, 2014, 04:58:20 AM »
It looks like they're not so much doors as a unique cockpit that opens up and splits out in a way that might, say, allow one to fire a grappling line up and launch out as they're opening.  And judging from the nearby car, I don't think it requires more clearance than a beefy pickup (and given that it's Batman, I'd be shocked if there wasn't another means of egress).
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #50 on: September 12, 2014, 01:10:54 PM »
I read a comment on an article (might have been the one I posted) where someone said they always felt the Batmobile should look like a cross between a tank and an F1 car. I tend to agree, and this one seems to fit that. I also agree that the doors look stupid.
Am I dating myself if I remember the 70s batmobile was built as a stock (race) car?

Batman doesn't use guns that shoot bullets because Batman doesn't kill.  Well, Superman isn't supposed to either, but we know how that turned out...

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #51 on: September 12, 2014, 06:26:39 PM »
The Adam West Batmobile was a Lincoln Futura.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincoln_Futura
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CG

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #52 on: September 12, 2014, 06:51:04 PM »
I should clarify that I meant the batmobile in the comics, but the Futura is an excellent example of something that isn't a tank. :)

Night-Hawk07

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #53 on: September 13, 2014, 06:59:59 PM »
Personally, this was always my favorite:



With the way Batman is portrayed these days, the Bat-tank just seems like it fits better. If they ever go back to portraying him as a smooth, less gaudy detective and not a tech-based super soldier, I'd love to see a return to cars like ^that one.

Thunder Glove

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #54 on: September 15, 2014, 03:18:55 PM »
Yeah, but every Batmobile is shown to be armor-plated and filled with gadgets to stop fleeing or pursuing vehicles.  I don't see the appeal in making it bulky and ugly on top of it (especially since Batman's whole schtick is stealth and subtlety, which are two things that none of the recent movie Batmobiles have).

Nos482

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #55 on: September 15, 2014, 06:00:57 PM »
"Stealth" and "car" are two concepts that mix really bad, unless you want Bats to change his name to Mr. Plow.
His bodycount would sky-rocket...
I'm bad and that's good.
I'll never be good and that's not bad.
There's no one I'd rather be than me.

...unless I could be Batman, of course. Everybody wants to be Batman.

Twisted Toon

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #56 on: September 15, 2014, 07:02:05 PM »
"Stealth" and "car" are two concepts that mix really bad, unless you want Bats to change his name to Mr. Plow.
His bodycount would sky-rocket...
I am not seeing the correlation between a stealthy car and a huge body count. Would you please explain you thought process on that, please?
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms

houtex

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #57 on: September 17, 2014, 02:43:44 AM »
Sung to the tune of 'Mr. Plow':

SWEAR TO ME, 'cause I'm Batman, I am the night, and Mr. Plow.


Nos482

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #58 on: September 19, 2014, 05:06:14 AM »
I am not seeing the correlation between a stealthy car and a huge body count. Would you please explain you thought process on that, please?
If a car can't be heard or seen or people won't be able to get out of the way.
I'm bad and that's good.
I'll never be good and that's not bad.
There's no one I'd rather be than me.

...unless I could be Batman, of course. Everybody wants to be Batman.

Thunder Glove

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #59 on: September 19, 2014, 09:13:42 AM »
... I said "stealth and subtlety", not "completely undetectable by all human senses until it runs over a dozen people".  I certainly didn't say "the driver should be unable to see anyone or anything so he just runs over people without knowing about it."

I just meant "a sleek aerodynamic car, as opposed to a gigantic lumbering tank."

Twisted Toon

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Re: Batman vs. Superman: Bat-suit and Batmobile
« Reply #60 on: September 21, 2014, 06:58:16 PM »
If a car can't be heard or seen or people won't be able to get out of the way.
That would be making the assumption that Batman would, at the very least, not care if he ran over people. That doesn't sound like Batman to me.

Just because Wonder woman flies an Invisible Jet doesn't mean that she'll run into every mountain she passes because the jet can't be seen.
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms