CoH #1! ...as if we didn't already know...

[Quinch]

We've said it before, and it's still true now. If we want the original game back we need to find a way to make them look good for passing it to somebody else. Better than the bad they look for canceling it in the first place.

I cannot emphasize this enough. As PO'd as we are, there's no way CoH is going to live again unless we can appeal to their own self-interest.

[Captain Electric]

I cannot emphasize this enough. As PO'd as we are, there's no way CoH is going to live again unless we can appeal to their own self-interest.

Quinch, the problem with that is, there's only about 20 or 30 of us left who are checking in, keeping up with the situation and actively showing a willingness to chip in however we'd be able to. Most of those people, based on their posting habits, I wouldn't imagine they would ever grovel for NCSoft's favor or step near any plan like that with a ten foot pole (or even a hundred foot pole).

You don't know me from Adam, but anyone who does, they could tell you that I've been a supremely annoying optimist here and elsewhere, unwilling to see or listen to any idea that doesn't include a reason to keep going. I just want to get that out of the way before my tone turns a little grimmer below. Please listen to me and don't confuse me for some wimpy naysayer.

Our "perfect storm" has passed.
A few weeks ago, we had a big surge in eyeballs and interest return to these forums and elsewhere over Jack's "Call me" remark, and then a couple of weeks ago, Gamasutra's candid interview with Matt kept the steam going at an uptick. At seven months since the closure's first announcement, this represented an amazing, probably unprecedented amount of interest in a closed-down MMO. Some people thought Gamasutra's timing was more than just a wonderful coincidence. Regardless, in my "Perfect Storm" thread I referred to that gift of circumstances as possibly our last burst of ammunition and I had good reasons for doing so. I figured we'd have about a week to show all those eyeballs how we were going to focus their energy into one last, big vocal campaign. I was right, and now we're back to the same few voices around here. Dedicated fans of the game, ready to chip in at a moment's notice, but for most of us, without the resources and industry or press contacts to make something big happen. Some of our most influential voices seem to be moving on from the fight, including Tony, based on the frequency and tone of his posts.

I'm not saying it's time to quit. There's only one person fit to make that decision, and that'll be the last man or woman standing. But if we want to keep on fighting, then we need to accept a few realities, just for the sake of having (and most importantly, adapting to) a sound strategy.

Smaller army, tighter objectives.
Let's just get the first big issue, the taboo one, out of the way. For anyone who is still here and has some fight left in 'em, the reality is that as time drags on, as usable ammunition runs dry, we risk fighting more for principle, less for victory, unless our strategies change significantly (and maybe even then). There's a difference; and that difference is so big that most people have already become demoralized by it and moved on. This has always been a long shot, but when there's 20 or 30 active people, that's not an army. Big Calls to Action, like mail-in campaigns, require a massive amount of participants in order to be noteworthy in the press or to a publisher. That's what I'm talking about when I suggest adapting. Our army's size and configuration has changed, and so too must every idea we generate for solving our problem.

An ad campaign might still be a good idea, but again, there's a reason why I titled my big post on the subject "We're in a perfect storm. We need an advertising campaign now, this week, today." Well, that was almost two weeks ago, an eternity considering how quickly most people will lose interest in a cause which doesn't seem to need anything from them, and we're still discussing possibilities for banner art. I'm not knocking the great ideas I've seen, but I have a feeling this is going to be a little like showing up late to a party which wrapped up several hours ago. If we were going to effectively organize and show NCSoft and Jack how much we want that call to be made, we would have already done it. We didn't. Whether or not that call ever gets made is up to other factors now.

No more illusions--are ads the best way? Brainstorm.
We can still go ahead with the campaign, but there may only be a handful of us to dig deep and pay for it, and its purpose may need a more general (less timely) bent to it. Maybe that would turn out alright, and maybe it wouldn't. At this point I'm leaning toward "it wouldn't", and I think we risk souring people on throwing their money at this cause into infinity. If you're wondering why my mind changed after only two weeks, I'd only like to ask why yours hasn't. No "army" with a disadvantage can afford to "stay the course no matter what". NCSoft is clearly the immovable rock in this situation, and so we ought to be as fluid and adaptable (and as weathering) as water.

We may want to consider whether some other monetarily supported strategy would be worth more bang for what little buck is left. Any kickstarter-style website that would allow donations toward the mere possibility of purchasing the IP might help us to gain enough interest from the press (and therefore a renewal of player interest, which always follows) to help us approach some other publisher to match our donations and then some (emphasis on "and then some"). The popular Kickstarter.com would not allow this, but maybe some other site would.

Conversely, maybe we ought to consider shelving any mobilization efforts outside of Hail Mary, and waiting for some opportunity to present itself in the future. One problem that I'm sure you're aware of Quinch, is that the City of Heroes IP is a valuable asset in NCSoft's portfolio (not was). Publishers who deal in the business of creative properties are measured in worth by the properties they own. Sounds kind of "duh" when I say it like that, right? It doesn't matter whether they're sitting on it or profiting from it in the current moment (or ever). It represents an asset which adds to their worth. If they sold it, they'd be selling off something which--I mean, look at all the noise and controversy over it. We've helped add value to the property. We like to say that shareholders ought to be shaking their heads at NCSoft for not selling the IP, but the opposite would more likely be the case if they did sell it now (or any time remotely close to now).

On the other hand, how hard do you think it would be to buy the Earth and Beyond IP from EA by comparison? Not saying you could buy it with the money in your wallet, but a publisher who wanted it bad enough (for some strange reason) might be able to talk 'em out of it. We may want to consider waiting until such a time comes when NCSoft would wonder why anyone would want to buy the City of Heroes IP.

Those are a couple of ideas off the top of my head. The point I'm reaching is, if we want to win, then we want our discussions to be more zoomed-out, bigger picture, top-down at ALL the options and possibilities before us. The Save City of Heroes! sub-forum ought to be full of zany, stupid, and smart threads for ideas about what we should be doing or thinking of doing.

Save ourselves first, CoH second.
Personally, however, I hope the "togetherness" of the community can shift away from primarily "SaveCOH", and toward something in addition, something that does not have at its core a sense of loss and stress. I don't know what Tony and his team have in store for the Titan Network. But the main talk of the day here, every day, is provably not enough fun to keep people comin' around. If there's no one left to save City of Heroes, it will only be sheer coincidental luck that has any chance to bring it back someday. (And be careful what you wish for if it's NCSoft's vision of a sequel.)

[Stormsurge]

We've said it before, and it's still true now. If we want the original game back we need to find a way to make them look good for passing it to somebody else. Better than the bad they look for canceling it in the first place.

How can we make them look good, when they do such a great job of making themselves look bad?

[Segev]

Save ourselves first, CoH second.
Personally, however, I hope the "togetherness" of the community can shift away from primarily "SaveCOH", and toward something in addition, something that does not have at its core a sense of loss and stress. I don't know what Tony and his team have in store for the Titan Network. But the main talk of the day here, every day, is provably not enough fun to keep people comin' around. If there's no one left to save City of Heroes, it will only be sheer coincidental luck that has any chance to bring it back someday. (And be careful what you wish for if it's NCSoft's vision of a sequel.)

This is a key point. We need to organize, not just one, but   many local groups - fan clubs, if you will - which meet regularly to talk about comics and comic-based MMOs, to plan fun events, to plan group trips to conventions, costume contests, charity efforts, even such things as camp-outs or bowling nights or whatnot.

They should keep in touch, and maybe form fraternal relationships, or organize at a higher level to be chapters of a broader club.

But to do this, we need people interested in and with the energy to pull such groups together. To put out calls for regional gatherings that are convenient. Exchange contact info and find out who lives close by you that's interested in these efforts, and just get together in a small group for dinner at a restaurant or to make a group trip to see Iron Man 3 when it comes out.

Gather and organize regular meetings, plan events, and give yourselves something positive to group around. Then be ready to support whatever efforts you deem worthy.

[Triplash]

How can we make them look good, when they do such a great job of making themselves look bad?

They really do, don't they? But if getting back the former City of Heroes game is the outcome we want, then we have to find a way. We're the ones who want it, so the burden is on us to discover the path and put in the effort.

There is another option though. As Captain and the others have been saying, we could quit dwelling on it non-stop. When an opportunity presents itself, we jump on it with full force. But until then we have to preserve what fight we have left. I don't know about you guys, but this thing where I check in here every day and talk to sad people about sad things... that's getting seriously stale. We really do need to find something else to do with our time. Something positive. So when an opportunity does comes along, we have strength left to give to it. Strength and numbers... let's bring some more people back. Heck, let's bring some new people in too. Let's get this place buzzing again. Let's fill the place up with fun people talking about fun things... nerdy people talking about nerdy things... goofy people talking about goofy things.

Don't worry if you can't think of anything right away. The ideas will come. Thank someone, encourage someone. Tell us about that cool thing you did or poke some fun at a cheesy movie you watched. Just find a thread and say something positive. Start with once a week if it's all you can manage. Then try twice a week. Then every other day.

*wags his finger* Don't make me have to nominate May 1st as "Cheer The Pancake Up Day". Cause I'll do it.

[JaguarX]

I cannot emphasize this enough. As PO'd as we are, there's no way CoH is going to live again unless we can appeal to their own self-interest.

basically.

if we cant do that, we have to do what we have to do to get the replacement or what ever other activity rolling.

[Segev]

I'd like to again encourage people to think of fun things they like in superheroes, comic books, superhero movies, or even charitable actionable causes (e.g. helping with a relief effort, bringing meals to families going through hardship, helping out at your local church or soup kitchen), and find out who lives within driving distance of each other.

Get together to play, have fun, go catch (as a group) Iron Man 3 or Man of Steel when they come out. Cosplay together. Write fan comics about your supers from CoH forming a supergroup in your local area.

But meet each other in person and talk about things that are coming that excite you, and find good things to do for other people that make you feel like heroes.

[JaguarX]

Quinch, the problem with that is, there's only about 20 or 30 of us left who are checking in, keeping up with the situation and actively showing a willingness to chip in however we'd be able to. Most of those people, based on their posting habits, I wouldn't imagine they would ever grovel for NCSoft's favor or step near any plan like that with a ten foot pole (or even a hundred foot pole).

You don't know me from Adam, but anyone who does, they could tell you that I've been a supremely annoying optimist here and elsewhere, unwilling to see or listen to any idea that doesn't include a reason to keep going. I just want to get that out of the way before my tone turns a little grimmer below. Please listen to me and don't confuse me for some wimpy naysayer.

Our "perfect storm" has passed.
A few weeks ago, we had a big surge in eyeballs and interest return to these forums and elsewhere over Jack's "Call me" remark, and then a couple of weeks ago, Gamasutra's candid interview with Matt kept the steam going at an uptick. At seven months since the closure's first announcement, this represented an amazing, probably unprecedented amount of interest in a closed-down MMO. Some people thought Gamasutra's timing was more than just a wonderful coincidence. Regardless, in my "Perfect Storm" thread I referred to that gift of circumstances as possibly our last burst of ammunition and I had good reasons for doing so. I figured we'd have about a week to show all those eyeballs how we were going to focus their energy into one last, big vocal campaign. I was right, and now we're back to the same few voices around here. Dedicated fans of the game, ready to chip in at a moment's notice, but for most of us, without the resources and industry or press contacts to make something big happen. Some of our most influential voices seem to be moving on from the fight, including Tony, based on the frequency and tone of his posts.

I'm not saying it's time to quit. There's only one person fit to make that decision, and that'll be the last man or woman standing. But if we want to keep on fighting, then we need to accept a few realities, just for the sake of having (and most importantly, adapting to) a sound strategy.

Smaller army, tighter objectives.
Let's just get the first big issue, the taboo one, out of the way. For anyone who is still here and has some fight left in 'em, the reality is that as time drags on, as usable ammunition runs dry, we risk fighting more for principle, less for victory, unless our strategies change significantly (and maybe even then). There's a difference; and that difference is so big that most people have already become demoralized by it and moved on. This has always been a long shot, but when there's 20 or 30 active people, that's not an army. Big Calls to Action, like mail-in campaigns, require a massive amount of participants in order to be noteworthy in the press or to a publisher. That's what I'm talking about when I suggest adapting. Our army's size and configuration has changed, and so too must every idea we generate for solving our problem.

An ad campaign might still be a good idea, but again, there's a reason why I titled my big post on the subject "We're in a perfect storm. We need an advertising campaign now, this week, today." Well, that was almost two weeks ago, an eternity considering how quickly most people will lose interest in a cause which doesn't seem to need anything from them, and we're still discussing possibilities for banner art. I'm not knocking the great ideas I've seen, but I have a feeling this is going to be a little like showing up late to a party which wrapped up several hours ago. If we were going to effectively organize and show NCSoft and Jack how much we want that call to be made, we would have already done it. We didn't. Whether or not that call ever gets made is up to other factors now.

No more illusions--are ads the best way? Brainstorm.
We can still go ahead with the campaign, but there may only be a handful of us to dig deep and pay for it, and its purpose may need a more general (less timely) bent to it. Maybe that would turn out alright, and maybe it wouldn't. At this point I'm leaning toward "it wouldn't", and I think we risk souring people on throwing their money at this cause into infinity. If you're wondering why my mind changed after only two weeks, I'd only like to ask why yours hasn't. No "army" with a disadvantage can afford to "stay the course no matter what". NCSoft is clearly the immovable rock in this situation, and so we ought to be as fluid and adaptable (and as weathering) as water.

We may want to consider whether some other monetarily supported strategy would be worth more bang for what little buck is left. Any kickstarter-style website that would allow donations toward the mere possibility of purchasing the IP might help us to gain enough interest from the press (and therefore a renewal of player interest, which always follows) to help us approach some other publisher to match our donations and then some (emphasis on "and then some"). The popular Kickstarter.com would not allow this, but maybe some other site would.

Conversely, maybe we ought to consider shelving any mobilization efforts outside of Hail Mary, and waiting for some opportunity to present itself in the future. One problem that I'm sure you're aware of Quinch, is that the City of Heroes IP is a valuable asset in NCSoft's portfolio (not was). Publishers who deal in the business of creative properties are measured in worth by the properties they own. Sounds kind of "duh" when I say it like that, right? It doesn't matter whether they're sitting on it or profiting from it in the current moment (or ever). It represents an asset which adds to their worth. If they sold it, they'd be selling off something which--I mean, look at all the noise and controversy over it. We've helped add value to the property. We like to say that shareholders ought to be shaking their heads at NCSoft for not selling the IP, but the opposite would more likely be the case if they did sell it now (or any time remotely close to now).

On the other hand, how hard do you think it would be to buy the Earth and Beyond IP from EA by comparison? Not saying you could buy it with the money in your wallet, but a publisher who wanted it bad enough (for some strange reason) might be able to talk 'em out of it. We may want to consider waiting until such a time comes when NCSoft would wonder why anyone would want to buy the City of Heroes IP.

Those are a couple of ideas off the top of my head. The point I'm reaching is, if we want to win, then we want our discussions to be more zoomed-out, bigger picture, top-down at ALL the options and possibilities before us. The Save City of Heroes! sub-forum ought to be full of zany, stupid, and smart threads for ideas about what we should be doing or thinking of doing.

Save ourselves first, CoH second.
Personally, however, I hope the "togetherness" of the community can shift away from primarily "SaveCOH", and toward something in addition, something that does not have at its core a sense of loss and stress. I don't know what Tony and his team have in store for the Titan Network. But the main talk of the day here, every day, is provably not enough fun to keep people comin' around. If there's no one left to save City of Heroes, it will only be sheer coincidental luck that has any chance to bring it back someday. (And be careful what you wish for if it's NCSoft's vision of a sequel.)

Yeah Capt. I know you been one of the biggest non famous supporter of this SaveCOH and the COX game since day one that I seen you on the forums of the old even before the announcement and even more so after. ANd I agree with what you are saying

While I been tossing out ideas and trying to avoid being "negative" to not hurt morale, at some point in time, though, there have to be a step back and look at the actual reality and NOT fear that reality of the situation.

Now I know then, people was hurting and fresh from the news, but I think in the long run it might have hurt us a bit because it kind of turned off a portion of the community, and many of them had no other place to rally around and then many just gave up who otherwise would have stuck around and might have been invaluable but felt their grounded view at the time wasnt wanted or welcomed.  NO I'm not talking about the ones that hate TItans guts. Probably cant onvince them to join. I'm talking about the ones that dont hate us, but dont want to join us due to their view that it's all about hope and not reality and didnt want to cause problems so they never even bothered to check us out and realize we are something more. Remember the most extreme and outspoken of any movement is the one that is easily viewed by the public. Hell, even on the old forum, many people dont even remember me there. But I bet people remember people like Arcana, Golden Girl, Evil_Legacy, Another Fan, TonyV, Capt. E. here, and some of the more outspoken people good and bad.

But yeah it do seem that it's only about 20-30 people that even post on a regular basis granted though some had real life issues and I think a few lost jobs and probably focused on that at the moment. But one thing my friend in real life but virtual enemy nutcase said that did get me thinking is that, the community goes beyond Titan. She may or may not meant that in a nice manner but still, she have a point I think. I think we should do more to reach out the the community members that are more moderate and may not hate ncsoft yet with a passion. Of course we are mostly moderate here but do people that have not visited here or been to the website know that?

Think about the people that speak about us on other websites. That is the kind of information the rest of the people have to go by, true or not, and we know that negative images stick way easier than positive ones. And even if they visited this website, do it portray the opposite of what brought them here or confirms it? Depends on what they are looking for and to be honest they could find both. Nothing much we can do about that.


The main point through all the rambling is this. We have to stop seriously stop with this division, and no it's not all the fault of Titan and people here but being the largest and maybe the only organizational thing where ex coxers have community, it should be portrayed as the community is welcomed here, the people that hated the game closed but not so angry at ncsoft for it, the ones that may not care too much yet, the fenceline people, the people that want to do something but depend more on reality and strategy, ones that want to have fun, and to tell you the truth as much as grieving is understood, it's still no fun to be around, especially as people stop grieving it puts them in awkwards situation when surrounded by those that are still grieving so many just exit quietly and never bother to look back. Then you have people that may not care the game is closed but itching to try a new game, some may never heard of COX nor know the plight of the closing but been in a game that ncsoft closed but have no place to go. Then you have people who may not care or "understand" the closing but want to help build a new game. Really dont take this the wrong way or anything, no one please, as I dont mean it as such. The air in here do seem to only welcome people that are grieving, angry at NCsoft or have hope and if a person dont fit into those three or combined, there will be tension and they MIGHT be tolerated but ot treated as equal. Outside looking in, that is the perception I'm getting from the reactions by many towards some people when it dont include hate towards ncsoft, being angry, or greiving. And as long as I been here, I'm a pretty patient person and can get along with anyone well including probably the Devil himself, really, being surrounded by angry greiving people is no fun to many people. And most isnt goign to come here and straight out and say that. NAd I'm saying stop hoping, but I think we can be hopeful and more open in perceptions at the same time believe it or not. Some things require the perception of pure cold hard reality. Other need a little hope to keep the morale.

ANother ramble follow. Not much to do with the main poitn but something on my heart.

I remember the old community. We had our potty mouth PvPers, we had our helpful people, we had our resident doom sayers, we had people that was shy, we had aggressive in your face people, we had people with strange look on life, we had dreamers, we had doers, we had people that did nothing at all, we had drive by shooters (good and bad), we had people who were experts at builds, we had noobs, we had newbs, we had people who were beasts on a computer, we had people that were barely could turn on a computer and made people wonder how did they manage to get online in the first place, we had Star trek experts we had star wars experts we had people who didnt give a hoot about neither and we had gossip experts and I think we even had an ex-Amish guy, A community.

Even if we do manage to get COX back or build the new game, it wont be the same without those people, yes even the crazy ones. I mean I like you guys and dont mind playing a game with ya'll but are we building a game for the the community or a play ground for Titan Network members where by definition anyone can walk in but not all are actually welcomed. Of course, there are extreme cases that do more harm than good and might have to be excluded but in general.

[Tanklet]

There's so much of this I agree with ... where to even start ...

Our "perfect storm" has passed.
A few weeks ago, we had a big surge in eyeballs and interest return to these forums and elsewhere over Jack's "Call me" remark, and then a couple of weeks ago, Gamasutra's candid interview with Matt kept the steam going at an uptick. At seven months since the closure's first announcement, this represented an amazing, probably unprecedented amount of interest in a closed-down MMO. Some people thought Gamasutra's timing was more than just a wonderful coincidence. Regardless, in my "Perfect Storm" thread I referred to that gift of circumstances as possibly our last burst of ammunition and I had good reasons for doing so. I figured we'd have about a week to show all those eyeballs how we were going to focus their energy into one last, big vocal campaign. I was right, and now we're back to the same few voices around here. Dedicated fans of the game, ready to chip in at a moment's notice, but for most of us, without the resources and industry or press contacts to make something big happen. Some of our most influential voices seem to be moving on from the fight, including Tony, based on the frequency and tone of his posts.

I'm not saying it's time to quit. There's only one person fit to make that decision, and that'll be the last man or woman standing. But if we want to keep on fighting, then we need to accept a few realities, just for the sake of having (and most importantly, adapting to) a sound strategy.

I agree, and felt this way too. I'd been hoping (and still do hope, though it's waning) that the banners would go up, and we'd have been supporting them for 2 weeks now. I think a lot of it really came down to too many chiefs, or no 1 chief. There was never consensus. There still isn't.

I'd offered to help on designs & asked for where I could find to purchase ads on my own, because of this very reason. Heard nothing. And, like you, I too feel the perfect storm has passed. If not passed entirely, it's trailing remnants are wafting away...

Smaller army, tighter objectives.
Let's just get the first big issue, the taboo one, out of the way. For anyone who is still here and has some fight left in 'em, the reality is that as time drags on, as usable ammunition runs dry, we risk fighting more for principle, less for victory, unless our strategies change significantly (and maybe even then). There's a difference; and that difference is so big that most people have already become demoralized by it and moved on. This has always been a long shot, but when there's 20 or 30 active people, that's not an army. Big Calls to Action, like mail-in campaigns, require a massive amount of participants in order to be noteworthy in the press or to a publisher. That's what I'm talking about when I suggest adapting. Our army's size and configuration has changed, and so too must every idea we generate for solving our problem.

An ad campaign might still be a good idea, but again, there's a reason why I titled my big post on the subject "We're in a perfect storm. We need an advertising campaign now, this week, today." Well, that was almost two weeks ago, an eternity considering how quickly most people will lose interest in a cause which doesn't seem to need anything from them, and we're still discussing possibilities for banner art. I'm not knocking the great ideas I've seen, but I have a feeling this is going to be a little like showing up late to a party which wrapped up several hours ago. If we were going to effectively organize and show NCSoft and Jack how much we want that call to be made, we would have already done it. We didn't. Whether or not that call ever gets made is up to other factors now.

*nod* even my frequency in checking on Hail Mary & Banners Etc has dwindled. Sure, 20-30 people can make some noise that might start getting attention ... but after so long in there being nothing to mobilize behind, it just feels like opportunities passing by and I dunno about anyone else, but I feel drained along with it...

Save ourselves first, CoH second.
Personally, however, I hope the "togetherness" of the community can shift away from primarily "SaveCOH", and toward something in addition, something that does not have at its core a sense of loss and stress. I don't know what Tony and his team have in store for the Titan Network. But the main talk of the day here, every day, is provably not enough fun to keep people comin' around. If there's no one left to save City of Heroes, it will only be sheer coincidental luck that has any chance to bring it back someday. (And be careful what you wish for if it's NCSoft's vision of a sequel.)

One of the things that always energized me was RP. Just collaboratively writing stories with other players ... I can't describe the feeling  of wonderfulness I had. Since the closure, I'd been trying to get involved & stay connected in doing that. But it seems with the loss of City, everything of that venue disappeared. What I wouldn't give for the chance to connect with someone again, face  to face, through writing, whatever the case may be. When I was a part of City, I felt needed. ... I don't feel that anymore... I really do feel alone, and I think it's my unwillingness to accept that, that has me holding on. If I finally do let go ... I doubt I'll look back. And in remembering what I had .. well I'm just not sure how to accept that maybe without City I am alone.


Anyway, I'm rambling here too. tl;dr ... you've hit some very valid points...

[Taceus Jiwede]

Even if we do manage to get COX back or build the new game, it wont be the same without those people, yes even the crazy ones. I mean I like you guys and dont mind playing a game with ya'll but are we building a game for the the community or a play ground for Titan Network members where by definition anyone can walk in but not all are actually welcomed

This is a good point.  CoH which I believe someday still will come back won't be the same.  That doesn't mean it will be bad just different.  There will be somewhat of a new community and most likely a somewhat new Dev team.  It may look the same and play the same but things will be different.  While I loved the old community and style of CoH.  That went away the day it closed down.  What come next could be better or worse but it certainly won't be the same.  Also, there may fewer and fewer people doing what they can to help bring back CoH but there are a lot of people out there would probably still love to see the game come back and would even support it coming back.  They just aren't here now and they have that right to pick and choose the fights they will come across in life.  And I hate to say it but all the things we do in the world while reminding NCSoft we are still here don't always work towards the actual goal which is getting the giant NCSoft to release it's firm grip on the IP.  While I believe there is SOMETHING that can be done to convince NCSoft into selling the game not everyone will hop on every shot in the dark.  I would contribute to the banners and when they get rolling I will.  However for the "Call Jack" idea I just didn't think it was the path that would work for me.  It wasn't a battle I wanted to take part in because I didn't believe Jack was serious, later being confirmed on the PWE board that he made a knee jerk comment.  That may not mean he isn't interested at all and it was good to have  big name developer on our side but it doesn't seem like he is going out of his way to purchase the game or have any particular plans to do so.

[JaguarX]

This is a good point.  CoH which I believe someday still will come back won't be the same.  That doesn't mean it will be bad just different.  There will be somewhat of a new community and most likely a somewhat new Dev team.  It may look the same and play the same but things will be different.  While I loved the old community and style of CoH.  That went away the day it closed down.  What come next could be better or worse but it certainly won't be the same.  Also, there may fewer and fewer people doing what they can to help bring back CoH but there are a lot of people out there would probably still love to see the game come back and would even support it coming back.  They just aren't here now and they have that right to pick and choose the fights they will come across in life.  And I hate to say it but all the things we do in the world while reminding NCSoft we are still here don't always work towards the actual goal which is getting the giant NCSoft to release it's firm grip on the IP.  While I believe there is SOMETHING that can be done to convince NCSoft into selling the game not everyone will hop on every shot in the dark.  I would contribute to the banners and when they get rolling I will.  However for the "Call Jack" idea I just didn't think it was the path that would work for me.  It wasn't a battle I wanted to take part in because I didn't believe Jack was serious, later being confirmed on the PWE board that he made a knee jerk comment.  That may not mean he isn't interested at all and it was good to have  big name developer on our side but it doesn't seem like he is going out of his way to purchase the game or have any particular plans to do so.

yup

[MakoMako]

Our "perfect storm" has passed.
A few weeks ago, we had a big surge in eyeballs and interest return to these forums and elsewhere over Jack's "Call me" remark, and then a couple of weeks ago, Gamasutra's candid interview with Matt kept the steam going at an uptick. At seven months since the closure's first announcement, this represented an amazing, probably unprecedented amount of interest in a closed-down MMO. Some people thought Gamasutra's timing was more than just a wonderful coincidence. Regardless, in my "Perfect Storm" thread I referred to that gift of circumstances as possibly our last burst of ammunition and I had good reasons for doing so. I figured we'd have about a week to show all those eyeballs how we were going to focus their energy into one last, big vocal campaign. I was right, and now we're back to the same few voices around here. Dedicated fans of the game, ready to chip in at a moment's notice, but for most of us, without the resources and industry or press contacts to make something big happen. Some of our most influential voices seem to be moving on from the fight, including Tony, based on the frequency and tone of his posts

This is something I've noticed, big time, from all our big players.

I've come into this forum every day. I've sent my letters. My e-mails. I even did a favor to other forum members and sent letters in their name. Every time a new thing comes up, I make certain to read up and if I'm capable, I partake.

I work a military job in the reserve, and a full time civilian job. I have plenty of my own set of issues in life and I'm still active here, waiting and hoping; in spite of being one of the more silent ones.

In the recent months we've all been hit hard with our personal lives. NCSoft employees have a job to work against things like this, while we're sacrificing actual personal time. Nobody likes having to do this, and this is why some have given up hope. People are giving up, getting upset that others haven't, and those that haven't given up are getting upset that many others are leaving. It's driving a wedge in our community.

Among the people I knew in the beginning that fought the ending of CoH, the majority of which all have one thing in common. They want CoH to come back and will rally behind any realistic plan, but they've all long since come to terms with the fact it's gone and are only depressed to come to a forum where it feels like the efforts are dead.

We've got powerful allies in this... And I'm getting very worried that people like Tony, Rae, and Mercedes seem to be working too much behind the scenes. We need something... Anything. Even if it's not an actual goal oriented venture. Attendees are dropping very low.

I think all I'm asking for is our big players, the ones performing the movement of appealing to Google and otherwise, show some more presence. I'm not saying anything about doing any more than just posting and saying we're all still here.

I remember the old community. We had our potty mouth PvPers, we had our helpful people, we had our resident doom sayers, we had people that was shy, we had aggressive in your face people, we had people with strange look on life, we had dreamers, we had doers, we had people that did nothing at all, we had drive by shooters (good and bad), we had people who were experts at builds, we had noobs, we had newbs, we had people who were beasts on a computer, we had people that were barely could turn on a computer and made people wonder how did they manage to get online in the first place, we had Star trek experts we had star wars experts we had people who didnt give a hoot about neither and we had gossip experts and I think we even had an ex-Amish guy, A community.

Funny story. I was a roleplayer on Virtue server. Anyone that knows how things worked there, also knows that Pocket D held some of the strangest characters in the server. Normally these people tended to make me giggle, but I never harassed anyone, and often just let them do their thing.

In the final month of game time, my scientist character was beset by a strange space alien catman that tried commission my character to build him an electroshock pod chamber as a sex toy for his anthromorphic homosexual husband.

Yes, I know. Weird as hell. And on a normal day I would've cringed and walked away. But this weirdness came with it a charm that I know I'll never find anywhere else. City of Heroes had every kind of person from the weird and deviant, to an immense LGBT community, to even military members former and current. And in the time I've spent on Champions, the closest thing we've got to Paragon; I've seen nothing of such a range. Mostly just ex CoH players hanging onto old characters and a rather inclined furry community.

That catman may very well be the last time I encounter the strange and unusual in the style of City of Heroes Pocket D horrors. And I confess that I'm starting to miss how weird the community could be, as it certainly made for good conversational experience.

[JaguarX]

People are giving up, getting upset that others haven't, and those that haven't given up are getting upset that many others are leaving. It's driving a wedge in our community.

this

[downix]

People are giving up, getting upset that others haven't, and those that haven't given up are getting upset that many others are leaving. It's driving a wedge in our community.

Part of why I've focused on the Plan Z side. Ultimately, those who give up do so because they lack hope. Unless NCSoft changes their tune, there is no way to give them hope of a return from just the usual routines, so give them hope for something new.

[Ironwolf]

My main problems have been one of timing, I have to travel to Florida next Wednesday for my daughters wedding and this on top of normal real life - wife goes in for surgery the day after we get back and will be laid up for a month, has just made it nearly impossible for me to find time for much of anything.

I am sorry - I bought a website and have been working on it but Vyolet has done such an awesome job in far less time than I have spent that there is no point my going forward with anything but funding.

I still have hopes for this game and there are far, far more lurkers than posters on any website. This doesn't mean they don't care and won't quietly help - they just aren't as forward as others.

[Tubbius]

I'm here; I'm just one broke English teacher (which is a redundant phrase) who might be having to relocate in a month or two. 

[LadyWizard]

Anyone else notice how many on that top 10 were no customization?

Fusion Fall is very restrictive for your trainer holding nanos(gear based looks after hair, skin, and eyes)
DC Infinite Crisis by Turbine is Champions based(and not even in beta yet though they just sent out preferred beta code access emails)
Marvel Heroes/Super Hero Squad NO customization at all by Gazillion
Avengers Alliance you barely get the customize your shield agent in the beginning then swap in and out on the rest of your team
gotham city imposters is fps so probably not much customization there

never tried Hero Smash but it's by dragonfable creators artix

This list is not making me feel real good on custom chances since only real customization ones on there is Champions and DC UO as well as City of Heroes

[dwturducken]

Do we need a roll call? See how many people are still here?

[Memorandum]

Guys, just because not everybody here is posting 20 replys every day, doesn't mean, that people and fans of the game are not following the threads. 

[MakoMako]

Guys, just because not everybody here is posting 20 replys every day, doesn't mean, that people and fans of the game are not following the threads. 

Uh. That's been acknowledged. There's a difference between having a presence and lurking.

The concern is community. So when image of community comes into play, the fact that people supportive of the game aren't active posters means we really can't prove just how active things are. We had, what, 20,000 independent signatures in a petition to keep CoH going? Out of all those, only 30 people are active on the main forum for saving it? What does that say?

Nobody said that lurkers aren't following the threads. In fact, I think that was a paranoid delusion for a while, that we had a ton of NCSoft lurkers keeping track of us.