Spiderman Rescues 8-Year-Old in Thailand

[Shinobu]

Pretty cool story actually:

http://seattletimes.com/html/nationworld/2008925222_spiderman26.html

[Septipheran]

Meh, I hate to be a downer but this almost seems to me like encouraging dangerous behavior. This kid's mentality might now be "if I put myself in scary situations, Spiderman will save me."

[houtex]

And...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJ_R-G_i4Xk

[TimtheEnchanter]

Meh, I hate to be a downer but this almost seems to me like encouraging dangerous behavior. This kid's mentality might now be "if I put myself in scary situations, Spiderman will save me."

Considering that attempted suicides are sometimes subconscious pleas for attention, it doesn't really matter if it's Spiderman or John Doe who saves someone.

Granted this was more of a defensive behavior, but if anything, Spidey probably gave him a few words of advice regarding courage, and he's now in school, determined not to let Spiderman down.

[Septipheran]

Considering that attempted suicides are sometimes subconscious pleas for attention, it doesn't really matter if it's Spiderman or John Doe who saves someone.

Attempted suicide? This was some little kid being a retard. I think this child probably didn't really understand the weight of his decisions. Children don't innately understand how important their decisions are- this is something that they learn as they grow up. To encourage this kid to be even further detached from reality is simply irresponsible.

[Aggelakis]

This was some little kid being a retard.

This is not an acceptable use of this term. Honestly, there isn't really ever an acceptable use of the term - the medical world has moved on from the word to terms that are more accurate.

If you read the article, not only is he so young, the boy is autistic - of COURSE he doesn't understand the results of his actions. He hasn't lived long enough to create coping mechanisms for his mental oddities. He was going somewhere to be away from things to deal with his nervousness.

I hope you never use this word so carelessly in the future. It is hurtful and dismissive of REAL people's REAL problems.

[TimtheEnchanter]

Oh... brother....

[Aggelakis]

I removed your post. I will not tolerate such language or dismissiveness. Take that attitude to another forum.

[Septipheran]

I removed your post. I will not tolerate such language or dismissiveness. Take that attitude to another forum.

lol.. wow. So "retard" is a bad word now. I was actually making a case for respecting this kid and treating him like a normal person, not deluding him into more dangerous behavior. If you want to mod yourself into winning arguments that's your prerogative. It's also very in character based on this exchange.

[Captain Electric]

Septipheran, in our few interactions, you've been one of the nicest people (except for that one argument on the old official forums :P). This really confuses me.

lol.. wow. So "retard" is a bad word now.

In recent decades, we've (i.e. people) grown more empathetic toward people with handicaps. Laws are passed, ramps are installed, spare wheelchairs are on hand within stores. Semantics are an entirely different matter in this case. When it comes to using a word that describes groups of people with disabilities--or differences, let's say--some words aren't treated as "just words". Go on live national TV and try calling someone a "retard", and you're likely to lose over three quarters of any job opportunities you may have been hoping for.

"Retard" is right up there with "gay", in the sense that when it's used out of context, it's as reprehensible as other red-flag words, like the N word. It puts a red flag over your head, and people will want to have less to do with you. And for good reason: when you call someone a "retard", you're making an attack on everyone who suffers a mental handicap. That might not be how you feel about it. And it's understandable that you're not crazy about an increasingly hypersensitive culture, but if that's the case, then it's not really Aggelakis who you have a problem with; but rather with modern, progressive society.

[Septipheran]

Septipheran, in our few interactions, you've been one of the nicest people (except for that one argument on the old official forums :P). This really confuses me.

In recent decades, we've (i.e. people) grown more empathetic toward people with handicaps. Laws are passed, ramps are installed, spare wheelchairs are on hand within stores. Semantics are an entirely different matter in this case. When it comes to using a word that describes groups of people with disabilities--or differences, let's say--some words aren't treated as "just words". Go on live national TV and try calling someone a "retard", and you're likely to lose over three quarters of any job opportunities you may have been hoping for.

"Retard" is right up there with "gay", in the sense that when it's used out of context, it's as reprehensible as other red-flag words, like the N word. It puts a red flag over your head, and people will want to have less to do with you. And for good reason: when you call someone a "retard", you're making an attack on everyone who suffers a mental handicap. That might not be how you feel about it. And it's understandable that you're not crazy about an increasingly hypersensitive culture, but if that's the case, then it's not really Aggelakis who you have a problem with; but rather with modern, progressive society.

Hey Capt. I really like you too. :) I PM'ed Agg about this but now I feel a need to just sort of come out and say it. I am a diagnosed high functioning autist. Diagnostically, I guess the word retard could apply to me. It could certainly indisputably apply to me just as much as it could to the child in this story.

What I can't get behind here really comes down two fold. I can't get behind people who are unwilling to take responsibility for their actions and therefore encourage others not to take responsibility for their actions. I also can't get behind fear mongering and hypersensitivity.

It's funny that you should use this example, since it sort of highlights exactly why I don't like to speak from hypothetical positions. My best friend is gay- in fact, I think I have more gay friends than straight friends. When one of my buddies does something flamboyant and silly, the word faggot is typically used in one form or another. And that person is usually me. Yes, I am a straight dude who is called a faggot by his much more masculine gay friends on a regular basis. If that somehow blows your mind, I suggest coming and hanging out in New York at some point. It's really not that weird.

The point is that words are words. Especially in this case, it seems extremely arbitrary and tedious to dissect my use of the word "retard." The kid was acting like a retard, whether he's autistic or not. Keep in mind that this is coming from an autist, so the hypersensitive argument is kind of inherently dismantled.

I seriously HATE this idea that people with mental disorders are incapable of behaving intelligently and fitting into society just as well as everyone else, and when you attempt to dismiss us as these people who need protecting from your self righteous crusade by defending us against scary words, you're doing far more harm than good.

[TimtheEnchanter]

"Retard" is right up there with "gay", in the sense that when it's used out of context, it's as reprehensible as other red-flag words, like the N word. It puts a red flag over your head, and people will want to have less to do with you. And for good reason: when you call someone a "retard", you're making an attack on everyone who suffers a mental handicap. That might not be how you feel about it. And it's understandable that you're not crazy about an increasingly hypersensitive culture, but if that's the case, then it's not really Aggelakis who you have a problem with; but rather with modern, progressive society.

When a society turns everything into an offensive word, I wouldn't call that progress. "Retard" is right up there with "gay" when it's being used as an insult. That wasn't the case here.

(apologies in advance for invoking Godwin)
The requirements placed on society to do away with something because of a couple of bad eggs has always sickened me. I just found out in the past couple years that the American pledge of allegiance used to be done with the same gesture that is now universally known as the Nazi salute, even though America was doing it first (and Rome, before America). We don't do that anymore. Gee, I wonder why?

My wife has a Mjolnir (Thor's Hammer) pendant because she likes the Norse gods. But she can't ever wear it in public because hate groups have usurped it.

Isn't if fascinating how one person or a tiny minority of people can take ownership of any public symbol away from the masses, just by being complete jerks?

[Captain Electric]

About the first part of your post, yeah, I have some pretty weird friends too. I've known lots of different kinds of people, and I'd be lying like a bitch if I told you that some so-called inappropriate words never flew out of my mouth in the company of friends. :P

I think that's the first time I've ever typed "bitch" on a forum. But that's kind of my point. You're not just among friends here. Hundreds of strangers, too. Individual people with individual values. So it pays to be respectfully cautious, I think. That doesn't have to mean walking on eggshells. It just means avoiding a few of the more controversial things you could let slip out of your typing fingers in our particular day and age.

The point is that words are words. Especially in this case, it seems extremely arbitrary and tedious to dissect my use of the word "retard." The kid was acting like a retard, whether he's autistic or not. Keep in mind that this is coming from an autist, so the hypersensitive argument is kind of inherently dismantled.

I seriously HATE this idea that people with mental disorders are incapable of behaving intelligently and fitting into society just as well as everyone else, and when you attempt to dismiss us as these people who need protecting from your self righteous crusade by defending us against scary words, you're doing far more harm than good.

One of my best friends ever was a high-functioning autistic. Most people never knew. We were friends for 15 years. I outlasted any other friend he had made. The reason we're no longer friends is as whimsical as he was. He just changed his mind about things, one day. Of course, he was an artist... probably not autism-related, on second thought.  :P

I saw my friend make many compromises in order to fit in with the rest of us. Empathy may or may not be in your bag of tools. But the ability to grok empathy conceptually is something you're more than capable of, and it's highly recommended by Daniel Tammet. Who I'm inclined to listen to, because after all, not enough of ya'll are writing books for the rest of us to understand you by. ;D

Anything else I type in reply to this is just going to be knee-jerk words, informed by whatever opinion I already had before the discussion. So, instead, I'm going to pull a Captain Electric, and promise to get back to this thread (if it survives) once I've had some time to think about the points you've made.

[Septipheran]

About the first part of your post, yeah, I have some pretty weird friends too. I've known lots of different kinds of people, and I'd be lying like a bitch if I told you that some so-called inappropriate words never flew out of my mouth in the company of friends. :P

I think that's the first time I've ever typed "bitch" on a forum. But that's kind of my point. You're not just among friends here. Hundreds of strangers, too. Individual people with individual values. So it pays to be respectfully cautious, I think. That doesn't have to mean walking on eggshells. It just means avoiding a few of the more controversial things you could let slip out of your typing fingers in our particular day and age.

I'm just not one to pander to potential demographics. I think being honest and sticking up for what you believe in are both very important traits. I do both perpetually. I love the COH community and I like to think of this board as an extension of that community. I think it's great that we might have opposing views and values, but I think we can hash out those differences like adults without resorting to completely dismissing or demonizing one another.

One of my best friends ever was a high-functioning autistic. Most people never knew. We were friends for 15 years. I outlasted any other friend he had made. The reason we're no longer friends is as whimsical as he was. He just changed his mind about things, one day. Of course, he was an artist... probably not autism-related, on second thought.  :P

It's really a very silly distinction to make. I hate identifying myself based on being autistic. I also happen to have green eyes. I'm aware of how I come across at times, but I don't feel a need to pin a sign on my back. People are people.

I saw my friend make many compromises in order to fit in with the rest of us. Empathy may or may not be in your bag of tools. But the ability to grok empathy conceptually is something you're more than capable of, and it's highly recommended by Daniel Tammet. Who I'm inclined to listen to, because after all, not enough of ya'll are writing books for the rest of us to understand you by. ;D

Empathy in real life ironically reminds me a lot of Empathy in City of Heroes (the powerset.) It might seem like a good idea, but there are far better tools to accomplish superior results. I don't think it makes sense to feel sorry for people. I think people can take care of themselves. I certainly take care of myself. Once you start treating people like lesser beings who are reliant upon  special treatment to get by in the world, you really just demoralize them.

Autism isn't something I like to talk about because it's really not something worth discussing. I honestly see it as an advantage in almost every sense, being someone who 'suffers' from it. I do not comprehend irrational emotional interactions. I don't like sentimental weakness and I don't like seeing it used as an excuse for anything, OP's story included. I DEFINITELY don't see it as a logical extension of the 'war on words,' but that's really an illogical movement in the first place.

Anything else I type in reply to this is just going to be knee-jerk words, informed by whatever opinion I already had before the discussion. So, instead, I'm going to pull a Captain Electric, and promise to get back to this thread (if it survives) once I've had some time to think about the points you've made.

I hope the thread can survive because I think it's an important discussion to have for a couple of parties here. This isn't the first time I've seen something like this come up, but it's generally just something I have no vested interest in and therefore I kinda don't participate. But I do intend to remain a part of this community and I really hope I'm not strong-armed out via arbitrary censorship in this established fashion.

[Aggelakis]

Don't use the word retard and we won't have any trouble. It's as simple as that. Remove it from your vocabulary while on this forum, and no one will notice. I appreciate you staying calm and explaining yourself, but that doesn't change anything. Don't use the word.

"He was acting like a retard" reads like an insult. It doesn't matter how you MEANT it, that's how it reads. Don't use the word.

[Septipheran]

Don't use the word retard and we won't have any trouble. It's as simple as that. Remove it from your vocabulary while on this forum, and no one will notice. I appreciate you staying calm and explaining yourself, but that doesn't change anything. Don't use the word.

"He was acting like a retard" reads like an insult. It doesn't matter how you MEANT it, that's how it reads. Don't use the word.

You just used it twice. If you're going to not only be a hypocrite but enforce arbitrary restrictions on terminology, I think you might want to reexamine what the root of the problem might be here.

[Aggelakis]

You just used it twice. If you're going to not only be a hypocrite but enforce arbitrary restrictions on terminology, I think you might want to reexamine what the root of the problem might be here.

I used the word in the process of explaining my ruling. Don't be a brat.

[TonyV]

Yes, the word "retard" is offensive.  There have been significant efforts in recent years to bring more attention to discrimination against the mentally handicapped, and many in this very community either have mental handicaps or have close family members with handicaps.  Even if you have a handicap, that doesn't make it acceptable to use offensive words.  Agge might have been a bit harsh, but she's correct in clamping down on it.

To the OP: Cool story.