A response to NCsoft

[ukaserex]

Very interesting. Suppose we send them 15 bucks for the month of December....if they are foolish enough to cash the check...
I'm no attorney, but my old business law class said that cashing a check in those circumstances would obligate them.

[Victoria Victrix]

My gut instinct says they will return or destroy the checks.  Possibly cash them, deduct the postage required to send them back, and send that amount back. 

[Taceus Jiwede]

My gut instinct says they will return or destroy the checks.  Possibly cash them, deduct the postage required to send them back, and send that amount back.

I think its a cool idea and would even be willing to give it a shot with you Floride.  But I have feeling they will just do as stated above by VV.  I don't have any legal training so my input is nothing more than speculation but I feel their legal team would just advise them to return the money.  If we do go through with it we should send letters with the money.  Probably wont make much of a difference but at least they have to unfold the letter for the check to fall out.

[Clave Dark 5]

NCSoft knowingly sacrificed the CoH revenue stream when they cancelled the game, that would have been something factored in before they chose to do so.  Seems a bit silly to think otherwise or that waving a portion of said stream at them after they've made up their minds would change them.

[Manga]

Very interesting. Suppose we send them 15 bucks for the month of December....if they are foolish enough to cash the check...
I'm no attorney, but my old business law class said that cashing a check in those circumstances would obligate them.

Sounds like a good way to end up with a subscription credit toward Blade & Soul.

[Moonfyire101]

Sounds like a good way to end up with a subscription credit toward Blade & Soul.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[StarRanger4]

But I have feeling they will just do as stated above by VV.  I don't have any legal training so my input is nothing more than speculation but I feel their legal team would just advise them to return the money. 

Thirded. 

[Nafaustu]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

ROFL...thank you, Moonfyire I needed that.

Also, I love all of your guys, whether I disagree with you or not.   I feel like most of the 'garbage brawl' in this thread could be resolved by a good, solid "READ THIS FIRST: MISSION STATEMENT" post.    We should make a seperate thread to draft if down to a mission statement, and that way we could have a timeline of 'things we've already tried' so the new people (and welcome, new people!) know where we are coming from and what we've already tried.

TonyV is the one who authored the "NCSoft is not our enemy" thread, and there are a lot of people don't know that.   Its like walking into the middle of an 'in' conversation (or maybe the way people look at gamers in resturants ).   You have no idea what is going on, and a lot of what you hear is potentially offensive out of context.

So what do you think, should be start a "Where we've been/Mission statement" thread?

[Moonfyire101]

ROFL...thank you, Moonfyire I needed that.

Also, I love all of your guys, whether I disagree with you or not.   I feel like most of the 'garbage brawl' in this thread could be resolved by a good, solid "READ THIS FIRST: MISSION STATEMENT" post.    We should make a seperate thread to draft if down to a mission statement, and that way we could have a timeline of 'things we've already tried' so the new people (and welcome, new people!) know where we are coming from and what we've already tried.

TonyV is the one who authored the "NCSoft is not our enemy" thread, and there are a lot of people don't know that.   Its like walking into the middle of an 'in' conversation (or maybe the way people look at gamers in resturants ).   You have no idea what is going on, and a lot of what you hear is potentially offensive out of context.

So what do you think, should be start a "Where we've been/Mission statement" thread?

yes, that would be helpful especially if it had links to the corresponding threads.

And thank you i aim to please

[chaparralshrub]

TonyV is the one who authored the "NCSoft is not our enemy" thread, and there are a lot of people don't know that.   Its like walking into the middle of an 'in' conversation (or maybe the way people look at gamers in resturants ).   You have no idea what is going on, and a lot of what you hear is potentially offensive out of context.

I think that the problem is that a lot of us perceive that NCSoft has become our enemy, even though this was not always the case. It is clear right now that NCSoft does not want to sell the IP, or they would have done so. We need to convince them that they're in for some pain of they don't.

Still, being friendly, respectful, and forthright is essential from our prospective, because our war on NCSoft consists of getting the media and the market to put so much pressure on the company that they will do something that will allow the game to continue. If we are seen slinging mud at NCSoft, then our PR campaign will be a lot less successful.

[emu265]

I think that the problem is that a lot of us perceive that NCSoft has become our enemy, even though this was not always the case. It is clear right now that NCSoft does not want to sell the IP, or they would have done so. We need to convince them that they're in for some pain of they don't.

Still, being friendly, respectful, and forthright is essential from our prospective, because our war on NCSoft consists of getting the media and the market to put so much pressure on the company that they will do something that will allow the game to continue. If we are seen slinging mud at NCSoft, then our PR campaign will be a lot less successful.

I agree.  I wouldn't count NCsoft among my friends, but getting trigger happy isn't going to help either.  Their motives are... confusing, at best.  Until they are exposed as the root of all evil, which many suspect them to be, we should probably remain civil and cordial.  But hey, the fighters up and around here may get their chance.  I do hope it doesn't come to that, though.

[FrankTurk]

someone like Frank shows up and tells me that I'm the only one who's complaining, and I should just shut up and do what I'm told.

It would be awesome to see where FrankTurk said that.  I think he instead said that it would be better to do constructive things rather than string out our hopes -- but if FrankTurk said, "shut up," or anything like that, it would be good to see where he said that.

[FrankTurk]

Let me phrase it for you so you can understand it.

DO YOU HAVE ANY PROACTIVE, ACTIONABLE, REAL SUGGESTIONS?

It's a short list: play the game as if you loved it like you say you love it.  Anything else short of $50 million in cash is the real-world equivalent of CAPS LOCK ARGUMENTATION. 

[FrankTurk]

Oh, no you did not!
Common stock usually carries with it the right to vote on certain matters, such as electing the board of directors.
Korea may, of course, do things differently.

 As I mentioned - the issue has to come up for vote - that issue could be whether or not that boardmember should remain a boardmember. If there were a commonality amongst a collection of seperate shareholders, they could make their wishes known to the board, and even at the next election, elect one of their own - if they have enough votes.

Maybe you should have spent a little more time in Atlas Park.

Perhaps you're one of those.....

I'll play along just to see how this turns out for you, ukaserex: can you document any time in the last 50 years in which the shareholders voted on a matter in which the publicly-traded company made a decision impacting less than 5% of it revenue and less than 2% of its profits? 

I'd love to see it.

[Arctic Force.]

Frank why are you so negative? People are just trying to come up with solutions, they may be the wrong path. But I have yet to see you throw out some constructive ideas to help the situation. Why are you here if you are not on board to help?

[downix]

I'll play along just to see how this turns out for you, ukaserex: can you document any time in the last 50 years in which the shareholders voted on a matter in which the publicly-traded company made a decision impacting less than 5% of it revenue and less than 2% of its profits? 

I'd love to see it.

Commodore 1983 - successfully ousted the CEO after he made the decision to close down the LCD division, less than 0.5% of its profits and 2% of revenue.

[chaparralshrub]

Commodore 1983 - successfully ousted the CEO after he made the decision to close down the LCD division, less than 0.5% of its profits and 2% of revenue.

Although I get the impression that CEOs have a stronger hold on their companies now. They act more like owners. At least that's the impression I get given how many CEOs effectively destroy their companies and take their companies' money.


The real tragedy, I guess would be if Mr. Kim does this to NCSoft - if there was nothing evil or anything about the company itself, and most of them wanted to save CoH just as much as Paragon do, but their CEO naysaid it so that he could take all the money for himself.

I hope Mr. Kim is only peripherally involved in this, personally. I hope he's not as evil as some American executives. Still, it has me worry.

[TimtheEnchanter]

It's a short list: play the game as if you loved it like you say you love it.  Anything else short of $50 million in cash is the real-world equivalent of CAPS LOCK ARGUMENTATION.

Yes, I'm sure every group of fans who kept a TV show going after a planned cancellation had $50 mil to send to the studio. 

[Moonfyire101]

Yes, I'm sure every group of fans who kept a TV show going after a planned cancellation had $50 mil to send to the studio. 

rofl, no need to say anymore

[gypsyav]

It's a short list: play the game as if you loved it like you say you love it.  Anything else short of $50 million in cash is the real-world equivalent of CAPS LOCK ARGUMENTATION.

I am really tired of seeing this in not only this thread but in every area of life. We give our money to corporations. Without us they wouldn't exist in the first place. And yet when they do something a good portion of their customers disagree with and those customers voice their disagreement a bunch of people with your attitude show up and say it's their company and if you don't have the money to buy them out don't complain and just be grateful for what they are giving you.

So how do you stop these corporations from raking you over the coals? For me this fight isn't just over City of Heroes.

When I was a kid my grandfather owned a pet store where I worked when I got older. One of the things stressed was making the customer happy so they would return and tell others what a great place it was to do business. This was 30 years ago. Now corporations are so big they don't care if they upset their customers. There are always more people out there like you who won't speak out against the wrongs done. We need to change that perception and get back to where the customer is the most important piece of the puzzle.