Author Topic: NCSoft Stockwatch  (Read 714370 times)

Illusionss

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #760 on: December 11, 2012, 04:49:19 PM »
It sure would be nice if some people could Save COH without continually bashing GW2.

I think you're a little overly sensitive on this. Discussing GW2's launch issues and NCStupid's questionable decision to limit new player downloads of the game because their servers were were emitting sparks and small bits of fire, like an Arachnos base map about to explode [we've all been on those maps... "meltdown imminent!"], is not "bashing the game." Its honest statements about a stupid problem that should have been foreseen months before launch of the game. You'd think it'd be all about giving people playing a new game the maxium bonding experience... but no.

All of this isn't exactly making NCSilly look any smarter. And that is the point here, not some imaginary "bashing." I am also playing GW2, but I realize that its not going to be met with shining praise here on Titan. It is also in no way, shape or form safe from the axe any time NCStupid gets another bright idea. I play with that foremost in mind.

Quote
Someone with a crappy computer making a youtube video doesn't mean much.

When the person in question is reporting for a MMO website, yeah it kinda does.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2012, 06:09:11 PM by Illusionss »

Little Green Frog

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #761 on: December 11, 2012, 04:51:54 PM »
Well, with all the fury directed at NCStupid, no surprise everything they run is getting caught in the crossfire, no matter the quality.

Soon as CoH is liberated, we'll forget and move on, and GW2 can continue... until it gets the axe in another fit of caprice.

They've regained their losses and stabilized. I don't like that.

I'd be careful with this bloodlust thing I see sometimes popping over on these boards. It doesn't really help our cause and may put off people that would otherwise be sympathetic to it. I know, NCsoft isn't exactly our best buddy right now, but hey, I have already seen accusations of a smear campaign going on against them on the talk page in their Wikipedia article. So please cool your heads a little bit.

Illusionss

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #762 on: December 11, 2012, 04:53:21 PM »
They've regained their losses and stabilized. I don't like that.

Ups and downs happen; it is the long term that needs worrying about.

Feycat

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #763 on: December 11, 2012, 04:53:38 PM »
I think you're a little overly sensitive on this. Discussing GW2's launch issues and NCStupid's questionable decision to limit new player downloads of the game because their servers were were emitting sparks and small bits of fire, like an Arachnos base map about to explode [we've all been on those maps... "meltdown imminent!"], is not "bashing the game." Its honest statements about a stupid problem that should have been foreseen months before launch of the game. You'd think it'd be all about giving people playing a new game the maxium bonding experience... but no.

Except that isn't true, so yeah, it's bashing. And going back through your post history, you haven't had much good to say about that game, just a lot of talk about how crappy and boring it is.

It doesn't exactly lend you an air of neutrality.

Feycat

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #764 on: December 11, 2012, 05:01:00 PM »
I'd be careful with this bloodlust thing I see sometimes popping over on these boards. It doesn't really help our cause and may put off people that would otherwise be sympathetic to it. I know, NCsoft isn't exactly our best buddy right now, but hey, I have already seen accusations of a smear campaign going on against them on the talk page in their Wikipedia article. So please cool your heads a little bit.

This exactly.

My GW2 guild is full of ex-COH players, some of whom were there right until the end, and some of whom quit playing years ago but still hold the game in their hearts and were devastated to learn of its impending closure.

They won't come here, they won't participate in this movement, specifically because of crap like this. Heck, GG, who is the leader of one of the Plan Z projects, posted on the COH forums that the failure of GW2 and the closure of NCsoft is necessarily part of the stated goals. Whether or not her opinion is a widely held leadership position or not, it's certainly the impression that one gets.

People who've just lost one home aren't going to flock to help out the people trying to burn their new one down.

Kistulot

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #765 on: December 11, 2012, 05:09:07 PM »
People who've just lost one home aren't going to flock to help out the people trying to burn their new one down.

I know a lot of times over the years, some game annoying me or another made me wish downfall on it. When WoW stopped working on my machine and tech support kept blaming my computer when it was happening on my friends' systems as well, I wanted the whole thing to blow up. As an example. But having felt the death of a game, I don't think we should wish that on anybody.

Even DRM loving lore retconning scum suckers like bli-

So anyway, yeah, let's try to stay positive. Even if this means just not bashing on NCSoft for things that arent concrete facts, and keeping in mind arenanet =/= ncsoft  (which means we can call out NCSoft for a poor launch of GW2 if they forced it, but saying Arenanet should have its doors closed is a no-no) we really do want to stay the side that good, logical, sane people want to be on.

If we want anything more than just retribution, anyway.
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Colette

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #766 on: December 11, 2012, 05:10:11 PM »
"I have already seen accusations of a smear campaign going on against them on the talk page in their Wikipedia article."

That would actually be true. We are telling the unpleasant truth about NCSoft, as loud as we possibly can. NCSoft would be well served to ask "why are our former customers so furious with us that they're waging a smear campaign?"

NCSoft callously and capriciously pulled the plug right after selling us a ton of updates, including "nature mastery" three days before the announcement. Their answers have been arrogant and condescending. We're not just kids upset because a toy's been taken from us. We're adults who have had a bellyful of corporate swindles, and we're not lying down and taking it anymore.

I am sorry if other NCSoft games like Guild Wars are being damaged by our actions, (well... not Blade and Soul. It's plain creepy!) but NCSoft will forevermore carefully consider when closing their games, so I'm confident we're actually contributing to Guild Wars' long-term survival and well-being.

Feycat

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #767 on: December 11, 2012, 05:16:03 PM »
I am sorry if other NCSoft games like Guild Wars are being damaged by our actions, (well... not Blade and Soul. It's plain creepy!) but NCSoft will forevermore carefully consider when closing their games, so I'm confident we're actually contributing to Guild Wars' long-term survival and well-being.

Agreed on all these points, actually. (B&S is creepy as hell to me!) It's why I'm still on these boards despite finding a home in GW2 - I honestly believe that our media blitz about COH has caused enough face-losing that they may hesitate to pull a similar move on other MMOs.

We didn't protest or quit playing COH when they closed 4 other MMOs, we all had our blinders on. I actually hope like hell that the fact this group raised our voices and screamed when it happened to us makes me think that NCsoft may have to ask themselves if they want to risk it happening again. Better to cut loose the studio than that - and Anet being cut loose would make me SO freaking happy.

Little Green Frog

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #768 on: December 11, 2012, 05:18:52 PM »
"I have already seen accusations of a smear campaign going on against them on the talk page in their Wikipedia article."

That would actually be true. We are telling the unpleasant truth about NCSoft, as loud as we possibly can. NCSoft would be well served to ask "why are our former customers so furious with us that they're waging a smear campaign?"

Perpetrating a smear campaign and spreading the truth about company's questionable business practices are two different things. The former will not win us many friends and will only further damage our position. Think of what happens if Disney - or any other company we are hoping to take CoH over - sees how we are handling the game closure. Then imagine what they would think would happen if they stepped on our toes, which in business world sometimes happens. Do you think they would race to purchase the game with a buzzing wasp nest that our community is degrading into attached?

We're not just kids upset because a toy's been taken from us.

Good. Stop acting like you are, then.

Sekoia

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #769 on: December 11, 2012, 05:46:36 PM »
I deleted a few posts.

Please refrain from calling someone a sock puppet unless you have something much more substantial to base that claim on than "they disagree with me" or "they aren't rabidly seeking the destruction of NCsoft".

It's also entirely inappropriate to tell people to get off the forums because you don't like what they have to say.

Kistulot

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #770 on: December 11, 2012, 05:49:28 PM »
Thank you, Sekoia.

I never like posts needing to be deleted or anything like that, but I think we really do need to stay positive here, and some things don't help...

But we can all just move on and stay positive in the future easily enough! :D
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therain93

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #771 on: December 11, 2012, 06:04:53 PM »
Perpetrating a smear campaign and spreading the truth about company's questionable business practices are two different things. The former will not win us many friends and will only further damage our position. Think of what happens if Disney - or any other company we are hoping to take CoH over - sees how we are handling the game closure. Then imagine what they would think would happen if they stepped on our toes, which in business world sometimes happens. Do you think they would race to purchase the game with a buzzing wasp nest that our community is degrading into attached?
Yep, this exactly. 
I tossed a thread onto mmorpg.com (be warned, wear a thick flame-proof suit if you dare visit it) regarding the boycottncsoft.com website; not surprising, but the response was mixed with reactions coming from both ends of the spectrum.  One particular poster who was critical of the movement (or one particular poster actually) made a very important statement (although unjustified in that particular context and was eventually modded out): we DO represent the CoH community at large.  "Bad" behavior on the part of a few can smear all of us and have unexpected repercussions.  We all have to be level-headed in our approach to raising awareness of NCsoft's practices. 
 
There may be bloodlust in your heart, be keep a cool exterior and be thoughtful in your posting.
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Atlantea

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #772 on: December 11, 2012, 06:11:17 PM »
Agreed on all these points, actually. (B&S is creepy as hell to me!) It's why I'm still on these boards despite finding a home in GW2 - I honestly believe that our media blitz about COH has caused enough face-losing that they may hesitate to pull a similar move on other MMOs.

We didn't protest or quit playing COH when they closed 4 other MMOs, we all had our blinders on. I actually hope like hell that the fact this group raised our voices and screamed when it happened to us makes me think that NCsoft may have to ask themselves if they want to risk it happening again. Better to cut loose the studio than that - and Anet being cut loose would make me SO freaking happy.

I for one have no hate for GW2 or Arenanet. I've been playing GW2 sporadically here and there. I've been impressed with the game a lot. It's very good. And I'll likely play more soon.

(I don't think it's anywhere NEAR as "groundbreaking" as a lot of people say. It's a high-fantasy MMO. That's not exactly genre busting. It has a lot of little quality of life upgrades that are nice and make the gameplay more convenient. And reward you more for sheer exploration than any other game other than COH. But that's about it.)

Some dear friends who bought the game on pre-order and jumped in early were raving about it and were about to drag me in.

And then Black Friday happened. And I regretfully told them I couldn't make that purchase or personally support the game monetarily in any way. I was disappointed, because I WANTED to play.

I'm serious. I COULD. NOT. DO. IT. I actually went down to a Gamestop and held the box in my hand for 15 minutes trying to convince myself to buy it for my friends sake. (Because in the case of at least one, it's the ONLY game they are now playing.)

But that NCSoft logo kept burning in my hand.

My friends surprised the heck out of me by chipping in and dividing up funds and bought me an account. "Call it an early Christmas Gift" was one response.

Well heck - what can you do? I can't refuse that gesture!

So yes. I'm in. And although an initial purchase was made on my behalf, I guess I technically stuck to my vow of never giving NCsoft another penny of my money.

I can do positive game reviews for them. If I was a video maker like Samuraiko I'd happily make videos of the gameplay and post on youtube and point out the cool things. I can learn the lore (and it's very interesting) and talk about it. And I can encourage COH players not to hate on them.

I can/would do all those things. But no money. None. Sorry. Can't.

Which is not to say I would refuse to support Arenanet IF THEY ESCAPED from NCSoft! If that happened I'd do a 180 and IMMEDIATELY do all I could to support them. Heck - I'd buy a whole new retail box if they did that! I like the game and the studio enough to wish them the best.

I don't think I'm alone or even in the minority here in my feelings. And there are plenty here who actually aren't as adamant about these sorts of things who have no problems making that purchase and enjoying GW2.

So please don't say Titan boards are a cesspool of hate for GW2. That's simply not true. We completely recognize that Arenanet is in a similar position as that of Paragon Studios. They're good people making a good game whose publisher may yet kill their game for no good reason.

If that happens, I'd like to think that Guild Wars players would JOIN us. We'd certainly fight on their behalf as well as ours!


Illusionss

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #773 on: December 11, 2012, 06:18:11 PM »
Except that isn't true, so yeah, it's bashing.

GuildWars2 did NOT have server load issues at launch, and the game did NOT become unavailable as a download for a time due to players overloading the servers? Really? Ok then.

I am tempted to ask why you think the download ability was really pulled, then, but I'm not going to continue to argue about this; it is at best academic. You seem unable to admit the veracity of anything except the aforementioned shining praise when it comes to this issue, so I will leave you in whatever version of MMO reality that you inhabit. Just don't get too attached, because when NCSilly gets the whim to burn it down around everyone's ears, they will do it and be damned to the hindermost. That includes you, btw. They don't care what you think either.

As for your other claim, I have never claimed neutrality. Far from it. I will continue to speak the truth regarding both my experiences in GW2, and my experiences as a customer who had her online home burned to the ground by NCStupid, and then sown with salt.

Feycat

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #774 on: December 11, 2012, 06:22:39 PM »
GuildWars2 did NOT have server load issues at launch, and the game did NOT become unavailable as a download for a time due to players overloading the servers? Really? Ok then.

I am tempted to ask wh you think the download ability was really pulled, then, but I'm not going to continue to argue about this; it is at best academic. You seem unable to admit the veracity of anything except the aforementioned shining praise when it comes to this issue, so I will leave you in whatever version of MMO reality that you inhabit. Just don't get too attached, because when NCSilly gets the whim to burn it down around everyone's ears, they will do it and be damned to the hindermost. That includes you, btw. They don't care what you think either.

As for your other claim, I have never claimed neutrality. Far from it. I will continue to speak the truth regarding both my experiences in GW2, and my experiences as a customer who had her online home burned to the ground by NCStupid, and then sown with salt.

Again, you are wrong and mischaracterizing me. I in no way think the game deserves nothing but praise. I will, however, defend it from misinformation and slander.

And no. The infrastructure DID have crowding issues, and the game DID stop sales. And as I've said in other posts, ARENANET cut off the sales. Not NCsoft. And not because they're stupid for "not selling hotcakes while they're flying out of the kitchen" - because they're smart enough to care about the playing experience of the people who already paid their money. It was Anet's decision, and I fully support it. I had friends who were late into the game and had to wait to buy it - it was sad they had to wait, but I agree with Anet that keeping the customers you HAVE happy is more important than selling a game that needs to be stabilized to a bunch of new people. Then you ruin everyone's experience and are more likely to lose repeat customers.

Those are the facts of the matter. It wasn't "NCstupid" to pull the digital downloads - it was good sense and good customer service, and it originated with Anet.

Illusionss

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #775 on: December 11, 2012, 06:31:04 PM »
Perpetrating a smear campaign and spreading the truth about company's questionable business practices are two different things. The former will not win us many friends and will only further damage our position. Think of what happens if Disney - or any other company we are hoping to take CoH over - sees how we are handling the game closure. Then imagine what they would think would happen if they stepped on our toes, which in business world sometimes happens. Do you think they would race to purchase the game with a buzzing wasp nest that our community is degrading into attached?

I'd say that given the severity of what NCStupid did to us, that most people have been remarkably RESTRAINED in their comments and actions. And that the game's population is a lot kinder than that of many others. Imagine what WoW players would do if that game shut down! They would probably detonate a suitcase nuke at Blizzard's main headquarters! I exaggerate, but only slightly.

And I'd say NCSoft would be stupid to actually expect that they will escape the consequences of their actions unscathed. Hence: NCStupid.

As far as a "smear campaign," its a little more subtle than that. Its called poisoning the well, and it takes time. We here in the US just watched MONTHS of well-poisoning go on, in the name of a presidential election. Well-poisoning can be very, very effective. Or it can fail miserably.... hello, Mittens Romney I am looking at you. But regardless, this is a well-known political tactic and one I itend to employ to the fullest on this issue. In the nicest possible way, I will make certain that everyone knows exactly how NCSilly treats their customers. I just cannot sign on to continued deference to a company that has treated us like this; I just can't.

Every time I passed the magic store in Talos, some Freak NPC nearby would say: "Why be nice? What has it gotten you?" Maybe he was just a little bit right. I will miss CoX NPC chat a lot, but I digress.

Golden Girl

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #776 on: December 11, 2012, 07:21:07 PM »
All NCsoft titles are legitimate targets.
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Feycat

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #777 on: December 11, 2012, 07:24:09 PM »
All NCsoft titles are legitimate targets.

Like this.

Targets for WHAT? What is your goal?

Golden Girl

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #778 on: December 11, 2012, 07:26:39 PM »
Like this.

Targets for WHAT? What is your goal?

Victory ;)
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Little Green Frog

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Re: NCSoft Stockwatch
« Reply #779 on: December 11, 2012, 07:26:49 PM »
All NCsoft titles are legitimate targets.

Would you like dedicated players of other NCsoft games to lose access to their games just like we did lose access to City of Heroes because, well, we don't have access to City of Heroes anymore? Or am I missing a nuance here?