Reviving the Primalist AT

[Corona89]

Hey fellow Citizens! ;D

I come here today to talk to you about the Primalist Epic Archetype.  I'm not sure how many people remember this one so I'll start with a very brief introduction:

The Primalist was an EAT (Epic Archetype) that was originally planned for release Soon^TM but before the servers went dark Positron confirmed that it had been scrapped in the design phase due to the complexity of its concept.  You can check out a fully defined list of its powers over at ParagonWiki (http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Primalist).  It doesn't take long to see what the problem with the AT was.  The power descriptions alone make it sound like the Devs had a meeting and said, "Let's make an AT that does all the things!"

Personally though, I was very much in love with the idea of a new Epic AT and the Primalist was pretty much everything I wanted in a toon.  So I've spent some time analyzing and theorycrafting and I've arrived at a redesigned version that I think will be workable when CoX makes its return.  My ideas are below. 

[Corona89]

Ok, so after much ado I'm back to bring you what I've got. 

I'll start with some basics.  First of all, the biggest issue with the Primalist was its sheer complexity.  The whole idea behind the Primalist was that it could do a little bit of everything.  Buff, debuff, control, stealth, you name it.  In case that wasn't enough, the AT also generates and uses Primal Power (A mechanic identical to Tidal Power in Water Blast).  Similar to Khelds, a lot of that versatility was built into its shapeshifting mechanics.  Different powers had different effects depending on which form you were in.  Unfortunately, that was a grand pain in the cape even in the design phase (I shudder to think what the coding team would've had to face :'().  The Devs really went all out in putting together the concept for this AT and it seems they overreached.  So I've changed several fundamentals of the idea which I'll be breaking down now.

1) Eliminate power effects that vary with current form.  This is the root of a lot of the Primalist's problems.  These mechanics, while really cool to think about, are just plain cumbersome.  So they've gotta go but just removing them takes the base concept away from the AT.  So I'm proposing they be replaced by three separate Inherent Auto powers.  They are as follows:

1. Primal Aura - Provides a +Regen buff to the Primalist and all teammates within range.  The potency of this buff increases and decreases depending on how many stacks of Primal Power the Primalist has.  I envision the flavor text going something like this:

The Primalist is, above all, a healer and excels at using the restorative power of nature to help their allies.

2. Hunter's Aura - Applies a -Recharge and -Movement Speed debuff to all enemies within range. The potency of this debuff increases and decreases depending on how many stacks of Primal Power the Primalist has.  Flavor text here would be something like:

Just like its cousin, the Dire Wolf, the Hunter is a creature born to the cold.  Its chilling nature radiates outward to affect foes.

3. Prowler's Aura - Applies a Fear effect to all targets within range.  The magnitude of this control effect becomes more or less intense depending on how many stacks of Primal Power the Primalist has.  Flavor text:

The Prowler is rarely seen by its prey, a fact that makes it even more terrifying when it finally appears before them.

This system retains the concept of the Primalist as a form changer with buffs, debuffs and controls while eliminating a lot of the mechanical complexity involved in having so many powers doing so many different things depending on the situation.  Moving on from there...

2) All attacks just deal Lethal damage - This is related to my first point.  In Primal (Human) Form the Primalist's attacks were planned to deal Smashing damage and heal nearby allies.  Those same attacks used in Hunter (Wolf) Form would deal Lethal damage and debuff Defense.  And in Prowler Form they would deal initial Lethal Damage along with a Lethal damage DoT and have a chance to Stun.   

You can see the legacy of this idea in the planned Savage Melee set (http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Savage_Melee).  But why the need for so much back and forth?  Again, this was a very cool idea but it's kinda ridiculous to have so many powers doing so many things.  So instead all powers would just do Lethal damage regardless of form.  Despite my undying hatred for DoT based classes (>:() the bleeds are staying as they add a lot to the flavor we're going for here.  Any chance for Stun would be limited to Pounce (The AT's equivalent of Assasin's Strike for Stalkers), Brutal Swipe (The cone PBAoE), and Savage Blow (The big melee attack) and would also apply regardless of form.  Next up...

3) Limit which powers can be used while shapeshifted.  Up front this seems like a disappointment.  One of the complaints I heard about Khelds a lot was how limited they were when they were in one of their forms.  Some people argued that it made playing a TriForm Kheld rather irritating.  I think the Devs heard those same complaints because they clearly tried to stay away from limiting players in terms of which powers were available when they started designing the Primalist.  The problem with that, IMO, is that it forces you to cram a bunch of other effects into the forms in order to make them feel unique (See point #2). 

So I'd propose that Hunter and Prowler forms only have access to the following powers:

Feral Might
1. The "basic" melee attacks(Feral Blow, Vicious Strike, Brutal Swipe, Primal Strike, and Savage Blow)
2. Special abilites that come with the Forms (Hunter's Howl and Pounce)
3. Stealth and placate powers (Primalist Cloak and Primal Guile, respectively).  These would be inherent to Prowler form and thus unavailable to the others.

Primal Gifts
1. Special abilities that require you to be shapeshifted (Primal Howl and Wild Roar)

All the other powers would be restricted to Primal Form.  If necessary you could create duplicates of those powers which would only be usable while the particular form was active (Just like Khelds) but I don't think you'd need to.  The technology to lockout certain powers while another is toggled on is already built into the game's code.

However, this change leaves you with a problem.  The Primalist secondary powerset was to include mez protection in the form of Nature's Embrace.  If the forms don't have access to it then they're vulnerable to control effects.  As part of this retooling I thought a lot about what to do about this particular issue.  In the end, my experience playing a Peacebringer as my main really led me to eliminate Nature's Embrace altogether and simply build mez protection into Hunter and Prowler forms.  My reasoning was that it would allow the Primalist to be more in line with the other Buff/Debuff focused ATs.  Defenders, Corruptors and Controllers were all susceptible to control effects.  Allowing the Primalist to be completely exempt from that weakness and have full access to its support abilities at all times didn't really seem to fit within the game's overall class structure.

So there you have it, folks.  These are my ideas for the Primalist in a more general sense.  I want to do a pure numbers workup for the AT to really get a feel for how it would need to be balanced but I'd rather leave that kind of thing up to someone more mathematically inclined (Arcanaville, you still out there somewhere?).  Again, my apologies for taking so long getting this done.  Hope you enjoyed the read and I can't wait to hear your opinions :D

[Felderburg]

So... Any progress?

[Nyx Nought Nothing]

So... Any progress?

Considering the devs who had access to the programmers and all the other studio resources scrapped it as being too difficult i think it's only fair to wait a few months.  ;)

[Corona89]

Rise up, my thread...RISE! :gonk:

Phew, sorry this took so long, guys.  I had a lot going on both with this project and IRL that kept me from getting it done anywhere near as quickly as I wanted.  Anyway, I've modified my initial response (The one that I used as a placeholder).  It now contains my proposed changes to simplify the Primalist in order to make it a workable AT that we could, hopefully, see in-game one day.