Author Topic: New efforts!  (Read 7293486 times)

JanessaVR

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16080 on: March 27, 2015, 01:58:37 AM »
Verified by the devs numerous times on the official forums (not all of it, especially post-shutdown of course, but enough to validate any future claims she might make).  I recall seeing one or two posts by devs recounting instances where they were corrected by Arcana and it turned out she was right.  In some instances she actually knew the game better than the devs did.  And the work she did with them?  Behind-the-scenes contract work, which she was unable to reveal for obvious reasons until after the shutdown (or at least after the announcement, I forget).  Which isn't to say she can't ever be wrong, she is human (or so she claims...), but you'd better be damn ready to prove it if you think she is, or you're just as full of bluster as you think she is.

But then, you're so convinced she's a fork-tongued would-be forum god, you're probably not going to be inclined to take my word either (and to be honest you have no reason to, I'm John Q. Nobody), nor anybody else's.  So rest assured, you may remain secure in the knowledge that unlike those foolish deeming masses, you and you alone see what's really behind the curtain!

What's the difference between Arcana and *ahem* other individuals?  Her history isn't solely made up of unsubstantiated (and in many cases, provably wrong) claims.  Her reputation is earned, just as "other individuals" have earned theirs, and to be honest I really can't think of any other "forum gods" who carry anywhere near the same reputation.
+1 x 10^6  :)

ivanhedgehog

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16081 on: March 27, 2015, 02:27:51 AM »
Verified by the devs numerous times on the official forums (not all of it, especially post-shutdown of course, but enough to validate any future claims she might make).  I recall seeing one or two posts by devs recounting instances where they were corrected by Arcana and it turned out she was right.  In some instances she actually knew the game better than the devs did.  And the work she did with them?  Behind-the-scenes contract work, which she was unable to reveal for obvious reasons until after the shutdown (or at least after the announcement, I forget).  Which isn't to say she can't ever be wrong, she is human (or so she claims...), but you'd better be damn ready to prove it if you think she is, or you're just as full of bluster as you think she is.

But then, you're so convinced she's a fork-tongued would-be forum god, you're probably not going to be inclined to take my word either (and to be honest you have no reason to, I'm John Q. Nobody), nor anybody else's.  So rest assured, you may remain secure in the knowledge that unlike those foolish deeming masses, you and you alone see what's really behind the curtain!

What's the difference between Arcana and *ahem* other individuals?  Her history isn't solely made up of unsubstantiated (and in many cases, provably wrong) claims.  Her reputation is earned, just as "other individuals" have earned theirs, and to be honest I really can't think of any other "forum gods" who carry anywhere near the same reputation.

for her ally is the math and a strong ally it is (said in yoda voice)

she backed up her assertions with logs and math to show how things actually worked..im mathematicaly dense..I wont even try that

Angel Phoenix77

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16082 on: March 27, 2015, 02:42:22 AM »
+1 x 10^6  :)
is it sad that I figured this out as a math problem = 1000001 :)
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darkgob

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16083 on: March 27, 2015, 02:46:34 AM »
is it sad that I figured this out as a math problem = 1000001 :)

*ahem* Obey orders of operations, please.  It is merely 1000000.

Angel Phoenix77

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16084 on: March 27, 2015, 03:27:26 AM »
*ahem* Obey orders of operations, please.  It is merely 1000000.
that is true, I thought to add the +1 didn't see the * symbol :). So you are correct in this math problem :)
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Arcana

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16085 on: March 27, 2015, 04:36:25 AM »
Yes I know the name, she's another forum dweller. Someone that excels at having the ear of the developer doesn't make them automatically right about everything sort like everyone's favorite forum dweller "GoldenGirl" that being the next person that comes to my mind. I still look forward to heroes and villains regardless.

Worked with them in what way? Open beta and closed beta testing? Something more than that? How do you really know? I'm sure this will be taken badly but CoX has had it's fair share of forum gods that are able to convince you of anything. Really good writers and practiced at debating anyone can look like they know more than they really do. It's the internet after all
Favoritism is bad and often puts someone's word higher than it actually should be. But you probably know that.

I actually agree with you here: taking people's word without any good reason to do so can be and has often been dangerous.  It comes down to credibility: I believe I was able to build credibility with people in a number of ways.  By showing my work on analyses rather than just conclusions (which allowed people to spot errors and correct them).  By sharing as much information as I could that I was privy to, which allowed others to confirm my claims in a variety of ways.  And although I never asked them to do it, sometimes the devs took it upon themselves to correct misinformation others claimed about me in regards to my relationship with the devs (for example, at one point there was a rumor going around that the devs actually despised me and only tolerated me as a public relations issue: BaB in particular was quoted as saying such things.  BaB went so far as to refute that directly).

It was actually a lot of work being me.  You might think I had an advantage in that many less informed players took what I had to say at face value without any skepticism, and to a degree that was true - even though I myself personally discouraged that.  But the flip side of that was that those players knowledgeable enough to be able to confirm or deny my statements didn't just give me a free pass; in fact I was often a much more visible and therefore worthy target of their skepticism and their time.  Rightly so if I said anything about the game that could be challenged, the most knowledgeable players lined up to take a swing.  If I made a mistake, or error, or misjudgment, it basically never went unchallenged and uncorrected.  Catching me in an error was practically a sport.  It still is: if I misremember something or make a calculation error here, it gets caught pretty quickly.  And that's as it should be.  Most players didn't have the knowledge or experience to challenge many of the things I posted.  But they could rest easy knowing the players that could, did.

This isn't a woe is me thing, its just the way it was.  I'm not saying something a lot of other players (but not most of them) don't know: that there was a cottage industry of gamesmanship between the "quants" to cross-check, edit, educate, and correct each other, and I was certainly one of the larger trophies on the wall.

Now, as to the specific issue of whether I had actual inside information from the devs, that was confirmed lots of times, but it was difficult for me to keep confirming that while the game was still running because I was in a tough spot here: there were those who believed I was just making it up and I actually had no real contact with the devs.  Then there were those that believed I had too much contact with the devs and it wasn't fair I had more access to them.  That put me in a weird box. 

Today, there's a couple of things I could do.  I could post details of my involvement that were confirmable at one time, but would be difficult to confirm today.  For example, I had knowledge about how the I7 critter accuracy changes worked, because I posted about that at the time.  I was the one that suggested that the global hide command bring up an options panel to give players options on how to hide.  I am the reason there was a tohit roll channel when real numbers launched.  I'm literally the only person that posted information about how PvP diminishing returns worked, because I had direct knowledge about how that worked (the devs never actually released the specifics).  Those kinds of things were obviously things I was involved with at the time because of my knowledge of them. 

I could suggest references.  There were other players in communication with the devs, and many of them would have sufficient knowledge to confirm I had some direct contact and relationship with many of them.  The problem there is I wouldn't want to single them out, and that would just be kicking the can down the street, as it were.

I suppose the strongest evidence you could still confirm today is that I have a box credit for Going Rogue.  That's due to my work with the custom critter system.  You could check the manual, and you'd see "Arcanaville" listed there under a special thanks area I think.  Of course, "special thanks" could mean something else, but there's also the Going Rogue wall.  That was a wall at Paragon Studios in one of the conference rooms that everyone who worked on that expansion were asked to sign.  When I had an opportunity to visit Paragon, I was asked to sign it.  I was actually pretty honored to be on that wall, even though its landfill now.  I know there were players that made up stories, but I guess you have to use your own judgment whether I would lie about something like that in a public forum I could easily be challenged on by people in a position to know.

Also, I once made Matt Miller momentarily speechless when I compared the evil in the Rogue Isles storylines to the human centipede.  Of course, not many people can confirm that.

If you were a spectator to it all, its actually really difficult to confirm any of this.  But my notoriety rested within two main worlds: the quantitative players, and those in contact with the devs (there was some overlap between the two).  In both worlds, the truth is we could spot a fake from a mile away.  The quants could *easily* tell when someone didn't really know what they were doing.  And the players that regularly communicated with the devs could usually easily spot someone just faking it just because they would quickly say something about the devs known to be false.  Short of asking the devs directly, I don't know if there is unimpeachable evidence of my involvement with the game.  What I do know is that those two communities of players I mention above would never let me get away with being a fake.  I'd have been exposed quickly and decisively.  I could snow the average player.  I couldn't snow all of them.

MM3squints

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16086 on: March 27, 2015, 05:02:35 AM »
I'm literally the only person that posted information about how PvP diminishing returns worked, because I had direct knowledge about how that worked (the devs never actually released the specifics).  Those kinds of things were obviously things I was involved with at the time because of my knowledge of them. 

Actually this is not true. The DR was one of the reasons besides movement and mez nerf the PvP community hated the new i13 system (and the reason why many people left the game.) Alot of senior buffers like Not Putzing showed why DR in pvp setting was not a good idea. Not only did she did the numbers, but also explain the difference on how it looks on paper vs how it is applied in actual combat. One of the good perks the PvP community got from Ex_Libris was we had access to closed beta to do our league matches, so basically we tested the changes, and made notes about the changes and the future negative effects that will follow if implemented, but that train was already going on full blast and in the end, the "acceptable loss" part of the community voices were pretty much ignored.This basicly left a void of knowledge of buff stats for powers. Like I said earlier somewhere earlier in this thread, the vindication for me atleast was when they decided to allow people to get PvP IOs with PvE content.

darkgob

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16087 on: March 27, 2015, 07:23:32 AM »
Also, I once made Matt Miller momentarily speechless when I compared the evil in the Rogue Isles storylines to the human centipede.  Of course, not many people can confirm that.


LaughingAlex

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16088 on: March 27, 2015, 09:24:47 AM »


Funny image.  I dunno if many of them are as evil as human centipede, which to me is crueler than spec ops the line.  Spec ops the line is far crueler than many villain plots in city of heroes and even crueler than many vigilante to villain missions.  Granted, i've not played every rogue isle mission, but I do recall the vigilante to villain allignment missions to be especially dark.  And they are not anywhere near as bad as Spec Ops the line to me.

I know, shared it before but, spoilers, do not click either of these links if you don't want the game spoiled.  Especially the second one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-b7TaLjdXMc - This one makes the grandmother and teenager scene look like the work of a saint.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wveQMlKZjH8 (this one is actually meaner than the above, but some dialogue in the vigilante to villain missions in CoX can relate somewhat to this one.  Likewise, this is just ONE way this scene can play out)

« Last Edit: March 27, 2015, 09:48:55 AM by LaughingAlex »
Currently; Not doing any streaming, found myself with less time available recently.  Still playing starbound periodically, though I am thinking of trying other games.  Don't tell me to play mmohtg's though please :).  Getting back into participating in VO and the successors again to.

Graydar

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16089 on: March 27, 2015, 04:35:58 PM »
Anyone else get dreams of playing CoH? I have them from time to time and they're spooky. Today I had a dream about playing the Statesman TF.  :o

EmmaStyles

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16090 on: March 27, 2015, 04:53:10 PM »
I always had a variety of friends in the game and one day when I logged on one of my friends that I had not seen in ages had come back to the game. I had just made a new character the night before and gotten her to level 14 and I got sent a tell saying EMMA!!!!! Come play with us!!!!! I of course said yes because I was so happy to see my friend. I told them to let me get on a lvl 50 because they were going to be doing AVs but they would said nah we can handle it and they did handle it. They teleported me from mission to mission if I needed them to. Little did I know my fun was soon to come to an end because someone I had met a few days ago in a tf would be online. As soon as this person saw I was in PI I got a tell telling me how I was ruining the game for everyone else and that I should stop power leveling. I told the person I was not power leveling that an old friend had just came back to the game and invited me to a group that turned out to be a AV group and I was side kicked to a lvl 50. What I said made little difference to this person because he told me that at my lvl I was contributing nothing to the group and if I was really their friend I would leave the group. I was floored this was a person I thought had been a nice person but was set to believe that because I was lower level and in PI I had nothing to offer to a group of friends. (I had gain some lvls since they invited me I cannot remember how many.) I was nice to him though and I said I am sorry he felt that way because every tf I have been on with him he had said I was a great player. My friends started noticing me lagging behind and asked me what was up and if they needed to slow down and I told them no. I had to start ignoring all the tells I was getting in order stay with my group. The tells became very rude and to the point that it ruined the fun I was having with my friends. The tells did not stop on that day because every day after that I would get a tell asking me if I was going to power level. If I was saw on a level 50 I would be asked if I was going to power level my friends. I am happy that it was only with this one individual I had to suffer through this experience with though. 
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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16091 on: March 27, 2015, 05:02:47 PM »
Anyone else get dreams of playing CoH? I have them from time to time and they're spooky. Today I had a dream about playing the Statesman TF.  :o

No dreams, but its a rare week that goes by that an idea for a new CoH character concept comes to mind before going "Oh..." and feeling sad the rest of the day.

Brighellac

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16092 on: March 27, 2015, 05:17:27 PM »
I always had a variety of friends in the game and one day when I logged on one of my friends that I had not seen in ages had come back to the game. I had just made a new character the night before and gotten her to level 14 and I got sent a tell saying EMMA!!!!! Come play with us!!!!! I of course said yes because I was so happy to see my friend. I told them to let me get on a lvl 50 because they were going to be doing AVs but they would said nah we can handle it and they did handle it. They teleported me from mission to mission if I needed them to. Little did I know my fun was soon to come to an end because someone I had met a few days ago in a tf would be online. As soon as this person saw I was in PI I got a tell telling me how I was ruining the game for everyone else and that I should stop power leveling. I told the person I was not power leveling that an old friend had just came back to the game and invited me to a group that turned out to be a AV group and I was side kicked to a lvl 50. What I said made little difference to this person because he told me that at my lvl I was contributing nothing to the group and if I was really their friend I would leave the group. I was floored this was a person I thought had been a nice person but was set to believe that because I was lower level and in PI I had nothing to offer to a group of friends. (I had gain some lvls since they invited me I cannot remember how many.) I was nice to him though and I said I am sorry he felt that way because every tf I have been on with him he had said I was a great player. My friends started noticing me lagging behind and asked me what was up and if they needed to slow down and I told them no. I had to start ignoring all the tells I was getting in order stay with my group. The tells became very rude and to the point that it ruined the fun I was having with my friends. The tells did not stop on that day because every day after that I would get a tell asking me if I was going to power level. If I was saw on a level 50 I would be asked if I was going to power level my friends. I am happy that it was only with this one individual I had to suffer through this experience with though.

That seems like reportable harassment, and a situation perfect for the ignore button...

Why didn't you ignore and report?  I'm not trying to blame the victim but a certain protectiveness of one's self seems warranted.

EmmaStyles

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16093 on: March 27, 2015, 05:39:20 PM »
That seems like reportable harassment, and a situation perfect for the ignore button...

Why didn't you ignore and report?  I'm not trying to blame the victim but a certain protectiveness of one's self seems warranted.

It did get to the point of harassment but I was honestly hoping it would not get to that point. The first time I considered a misunderstanding and something that could be worked out but when someone will not let you talk it is hard to work things out. I had fun with this person running different tfs and it was something I had hoped would continue. So I did let things continue longer than I should have I will admit but I did not want to get anyone in trouble for something I thought was just a simple misunderstanding.
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LaughingAlex

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16094 on: March 27, 2015, 05:57:49 PM »
It did get to the point of harassment but I was honestly hoping it would not get to that point. The first time I considered a misunderstanding and something that could be worked out but when someone will not let you talk it is hard to work things out. I had fun with this person running different tfs and it was something I had hoped would continue. So I did let things continue longer than I should have I will admit but I did not want to get anyone in trouble for something I thought was just a simple misunderstanding.

Definent harrassment and a total shfg(stop having fun guy).  But then again shfg's are prone to that it'd seem, if I log onto CO I actively get stalked by some of it's shfg's these days for being the realist and saying they are the reason so many fewer people play it now.  One time I ran into one of such jerks twice in the day, the second time I just said "How many players did you drive away today?".  Because said prick won't leave me alone when I come on if he finds me online.  It's a good thing he's on my ignore and a good thing he's unpopular, in fact I think a good number of other players hate him as much as I do for what he did.

I don't think every shfg is that way but honestly, I dunno anymore.  All stop having fun guys are generally total bigots, just they tend to take "play the best way" to an annoying extreme.  It's not like the efforts many support players like me to tell people to do more than healing in CoX and stop playing the pure healer(as in someone who never attacks, makes poor use of buffs and debuffs and neglects crowd control) and setting bad examples, most of us are nice in informing people how to improve.  A stop having fun guy has no lines drawn and is like to resort to such tactics.

Funnily enough most of them I'm sure probably demanded everyone play empaths at a point.  I remember a case where someone started behaving that way towards me when I had shown some interest in pvp previously with someone else.  Well, I thought that person was a friend, I decided she wasn't when she sent a person who started threatening me when I wasn't willing to, right at that moment, talk about pvp.  I decided not to get into pvp.  I was left thinking "if these two are so extreme about builds in a very specific way, pvp must be even crappier than I thought".  The person also wouldn't leave me alone for a time, but did stop eventually.

I guess shfg's also have to be considered stalkers now.....
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JanessaVR

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16095 on: March 27, 2015, 06:13:49 PM »
It did get to the point of harassment but I was honestly hoping it would not get to that point. The first time I considered a misunderstanding and something that could be worked out but when someone will not let you talk it is hard to work things out. I had fun with this person running different tfs and it was something I had hoped would continue. So I did let things continue longer than I should have I will admit but I did not want to get anyone in trouble for something I thought was just a simple misunderstanding.
You waited too long there - I'd have had this twit on my Global Ignore list after about 1 minute of that.  I'd have also told the TF leader he was rudely and continually harassing me.

Twisted Toon

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16096 on: March 27, 2015, 06:15:41 PM »
I used to do Speed runs, non-speed runs, kill every living things runs and specialty runs where we all are the same AT.

You announce what you are doing to the team. If you then choose to stay - its on you. Once Belle saw it was a speed run after the first mission - I would have left. I would not apologize or make a fuss - just quit. They lied to her for some reason - that deserves no loyalty.

On the kill every living thing runs we would usually pair up and go to town so you had 4 teams clearing the bigger maps. I was instantly kicked once for playing a dark/dark/dark defender - the leader said I want heals. The main point is there are always going to be idiots in charge of some teams - don't let that detract from the fun you can have. I played for fun, period. If what we were doing stopped being fun I would say folks, this is no longer fun - have a good day and I hope things get better for you and move on.
I remember getting a tell once when I was paying my Dark/Dark Defender, asking if  I was a healer. I replied, I have a heal. I wasn't invited to the team. I guess because my one heal and the most powerful Rez in the universe, not to mention the numerous debuffs I had, wasn't good enough for the "team". Their loss. I'm usually happier soloing. But, I don't mind helping out occasionally.
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Arcana

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16097 on: March 27, 2015, 07:07:20 PM »
Actually this is not true. The DR was one of the reasons besides movement and mez nerf the PvP community hated the new i13 system (and the reason why many people left the game.) Alot of senior buffers like Not Putzing showed why DR in pvp setting was not a good idea. Not only did she did the numbers, but also explain the difference on how it looks on paper vs how it is applied in actual combat. One of the good perks the PvP community got from Ex_Libris was we had access to closed beta to do our league matches, so basically we tested the changes, and made notes about the changes and the future negative effects that will follow if implemented, but that train was already going on full blast and in the end, the "acceptable loss" part of the community voices were pretty much ignored.This basicly left a void of knowledge of buff stats for powers. Like I said earlier somewhere earlier in this thread, the vindication for me atleast was when they decided to allow people to get PvP IOs with PvE content.

Although many players tested DR in a variety of ways, so far as I know I'm the only person to have posted a guide to it with the actual explicit mechanics (wayback link courtesy of paragonwiki).  I did that because I was pretty sure it was highly unlikely a tester was going to derive that formula through testing.  There are few players that I believe could have eventually reverse engineered that formula, and I didn't believe any of them were collecting the data necessary to do so at the time.  At the time, I felt the PvP players deserved to know the details of what they were testing.

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16098 on: March 27, 2015, 11:01:45 PM »
Anyone else get dreams of playing CoH? I have them from time to time and they're spooky. Today I had a dream about playing the Statesman TF.  :o

I get them from time to time but oddly enough I get more dreams about my first mmo love which was planetside. Really miss that game too but everyone moved onto the second game which to me... well the second game too closely mimics other modern shooters and their many many clones and that sucks.

My planetside dreams are much different though... it's like what it would look like if it were real and I'm setting up mine fields, getting shot at and capturing towers and bases. The fear of being shot and everything is there too. It's unlike any type of dream I've had before.

I had a very brief dream that I was in a realistic paragon city once but something woke me up.

MM3squints

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #16099 on: March 27, 2015, 11:16:46 PM »
Although many players tested DR in a variety of ways, so far as I know I'm the only person to have posted a guide to it with the actual explicit mechanics (wayback link courtesy of paragonwiki).  I did that because I was pretty sure it was highly unlikely a tester was going to derive that formula through testing.  There are few players that I believe could have eventually reverse engineered that formula, and I didn't believe any of them were collecting the data necessary to do so at the time.  At the time, I felt the PvP players deserved to know the details of what they were testing.

Alot of what was posted was on the closed beta forum. Not Putzing went into detail where with the new proposed PvP system (i13) even with the new PvP resistance the spike will always die. No amount of healing (stack that with heal decay) would be able to survive a spike and that's from an imperfect scenario (no one was fort buff, no reds are popped etc) The initial hit, followup hits, heals that were applied, everything was taken into account. It would have been a paper argument if the PvP community didn't throw in hard numbers and just said "hur durrr... changes suck... game over man." There was lots that was posted with the numbers, but after i13 went live, no one else cared enough to post it or was deleted because it divulged into a flame war. Kind of funny to actually see the latter from the achieved forums. In the thread PvP Community Wishlist - Finished Copy on page 19, there is a "mysterious" 2 month gap between the last post and another response post. Also funnier is the thread What changes do we need? One of the last post before the mysterious 2 month gap pretty much summed up the situation best, "Aw, crap. "By then majority of the people left and the forum mod probably didn't care either. BTW I didn't know this thing existed. I'm going to go walk through memory lane :D
« Last Edit: March 27, 2015, 11:33:38 PM by MM3squints »