Author Topic: New efforts!  (Read 7294507 times)

darkgob

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25360 on: July 30, 2016, 03:43:13 PM »
I need to hang on to this sentence in case anyone ever tries to talk me into playing Terraria.

He's honestly pretty skippable, you'd be missing out on his weapon drops but by that point you have so many other choices.

LaughingAlex

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25361 on: July 30, 2016, 04:34:33 PM »
This is just not true in most instances (and the 30+ minutes figure is never true, not sure where you're getting that from).

The Brain of Cthulhu, the Eater of Worlds, King Slime, Queen Bee, the Wall of Flesh, and the Golem all have summoning items (which are admittedly consumable but also craftable, except for the WoF's summoner) that can be used at any time.

The Eye of Cthulhu and Skeletron can only be fought at night, but daytime in Terraria only lasts 15 real-time minutes, and nighttime lasts 9 (also, Skeletron's summoning item is not consumable, and the Eye's is craftable as well as littered in chests across the world).

The Mechanical Bosses have craftable, consumable summoning items although they can only be used at night.  Plantera's Bulb respawns in the Underground Hardmode Jungle constantly.  Duke Fishron is admittedly a massive pain just to summon without creating a specialized Underground Mushroom biome to farm Truffle Worms.

The Lunatic Cultist->Solar Pillar->Moon Lord cycle is definitely a pain since the Pillars take so damn long.  The Lunatic Cultist doesn't need to be summoned to start the cycle though, and after a few cycles you can have the materials to create the Moon Lord's summoning item and summon him directly.

I don't agree at all that options are limited, go read some boss fight guides if you think that's the case and you'll see how many strategies are available.  Mounts (including a couple with limitless flying like you said), Minecart tracks or Asphalt skybridges for extra speed, teleporters, AoE buffs, tons of weapon options...the list just goes on.

One thing I will agree with you on is that Expert Mode is obscenely difficult (I just recently started an Expert Mode world, even just the Expert Eye of Cthulhu is ridiculous), but that's why it's called "Expert".

The 30 minutes I speak of is actually the fact that your not going to want to summon the mechanical bosses or say skeletron immedietly after losing to them because they are timed boss fights.  It's madness to start a boss fight on them without having a fresh night.  So if you lose on them, your going to be waiting until the start of the next night, thats about 20 minutes.  If your unlucky, you may get a blood moon, so there goes that night, another 20 minutes ect.

Thats what I speak of when I complain about long times to attempt a boss again.

When I talk about options being limited, I speak of the earlier stages and mechanical bosses, likewise.  You at best can build a lot of platforms on skeletron and bosses like eye of cthulhu.  See the thing is the bosses on NORMAL mode are balanced, but expert they are not due to the waiting time crap combined with there much higher health.

Good luck on skeletron, it took me and a friend of mine 5 times to kill him on expert.  Ever since I destroy him on the first try...by sequence breaks, because I outright cannot beat him otherwise.  You don't need to play a normal mode world and use post normal mode gear to beat him, but trust me, he's insane.  Enough so he just as well be able to one-shot you(and he has killed me 'instantly' a couple times).

Also don't be surprised if you scream in fury at plantera after dying to her 7-8 times like I did and then never want to play expert a second time.  There are only a few practical ways to beat her and they are not the usual cheese methods.

The thing is, many bosses can only be fought at night.
They are tough enough(especially on expert) you'll want all of the time you can get.(And outright need it on expert mechanical bosses, except maaybe the destroyer if you get a certain weapon).

So your mentioning them being only summon able at night proves my earlier point about terraria not being able to afford to be very hard due to iteration times being criminally long.

Edit: I will touch on another thing.  Yes, you can use a variety of arenas and tactics on the bosses........ on normal mode.  That sadly does NOT fly on expert.  Tactics that work reliably on normal will get you killed repeatedly.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2016, 05:01:50 PM by LaughingAlex »
Currently; Not doing any streaming, found myself with less time available recently.  Still playing starbound periodically, though I am thinking of trying other games.  Don't tell me to play mmohtg's though please :).  Getting back into participating in VO and the successors again to.

LaughingAlex

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25362 on: July 30, 2016, 05:09:16 PM »
Truthfully though?  I hated terraria in the end on expert, for the following reasons:

1: The need to prepare the world for hard mode for 5-6 hours.  Including cutting a dozen shafts, lining them with crafted bricks of whatever you can make, and fishing so your not getting 3 shotted by everything.  Not to mention annoying spreading biomes.
2: Plantera and how much of the desert was loss to hallowed thanks to dying on her 7-8 times.
3: Skeletron breeds bad memories of ruining a multiplayer experience single-handedly.
4: Inconsistency of rules.  Especially when ferel bite gets involved by every stinking god damned bat REVERSING YOUR CONTROLS RANDOMLY AND THE FACT THAT THE COUNTER TAKES UP AN ACCESSORY YOU MAY NOT BE ABLE TO SPARE A SLOT FOR DUE TO THINGS LIKE INCONSISTENT KNOCKBACK UNTIL YOU GRIND ENOUGH FOR THE COUNTER TO EVERYTHING!  AND THEN THROWING MORE DEBUFFS THAT HAVE NO COUNTER TO THEM ATTACHED TO HOMING WALL IGNORING PROJECTILES FROM COMMON TELEPORTING ENEMIES! (yes, I hated the hardmode expert dungeon).
5: The necessity for all defense and worm scarf at all costs to be remotely survivable(speed caps easy with shield of cthulu/black belt combined with boots anyways).
6: Constant arena building for bosses is annoying to me, even more-so when I have to spend 40-50 minutes on it.  I would rather build other things.  Even more-so if I am not allowed to do so ahead of time thanks to hallow/corruption/crimson waves possibly hitting the arena you built ahead of time for 2-3 hours thanks to endless mob spawns and find you have to do it all over again on normal let alone expert.(if that sounds very specific, it's because I had a plantera arena prepared after 3 hours before killed the wall of flesh and then suddenly a crimson wave flew right through it after I killed wall of flesh.  This was normal difficulty after giving up on expert.  Regardless, I was very pissed).
7: Loss of exploration being a factor after hardmode starts.  Especially when fishing was involved for very good reason thanks to spreading biomes and random polluting block spawning from alter smashing.
8:To much, ultimately, artificial rather than challenging difficulty!  Especially to try and "inflate" the games lifespan artificially.


Edit: Oh yeah another one: Arena effectiveness and usefullness dependant on multiple worlds to grab heart statues if your not lucky enough.  So lets add luck based difficulty to the list to.

When a person brings up dozens of points WHY expert mode fails, and has to bring up a video, and then later the developers also nerf a few ways to beat some bosses getting everyone scared of further nerfs to tactics, yeah, I have good reason to strongly dislike expert terraria.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2016, 05:27:45 PM by LaughingAlex »
Currently; Not doing any streaming, found myself with less time available recently.  Still playing starbound periodically, though I am thinking of trying other games.  Don't tell me to play mmohtg's though please :).  Getting back into participating in VO and the successors again to.

blacksly

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25363 on: July 30, 2016, 05:12:57 PM »
"Take me down to Paragon City where the grass is green and the villains are a'plenty! Oh, take me home!"

Take me down to Paragon City where the Trolls are green and the Trainers are pretty!! Oh, take me home!

Sinistar

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25364 on: July 30, 2016, 06:56:56 PM »
Take me down to Paragon City where the Trolls are green and the Trainers are pretty!! Oh, take me home!

Man, now I'm thinking of the Troll raves in Skyway!
In fearful COH-less days
In Raging COH-less nights
With Strong Hearts Full, we shall UNITE!
When all seems lost in the effort to bring CoH back to life,
Look to Cyberspace, where HOPE burns bright!

Remaugen

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25365 on: July 30, 2016, 07:13:25 PM »
Man, now I'm thinking of the Troll raves in Skyway!

I was thinking the exact same thing!
We're almost there!  ;D

The RNG hates me.

pinballdave

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25366 on: July 30, 2016, 07:22:36 PM »
Come on empaths, kineticize, anchor the fools
Some more rings, shields, ice armor hitting the cap,
A trick arrow, storming pal and don't forget traps!
With Time manip we can't lose

And we'll be Defendin' in Paragon
Defendin' the Paragon tonight
Defeindin' in Paragon
Defendin' the Paragon tonight
Tonight, tonight...


(yes, I ripped Styx off for some attempt at comedy relief)

Vee

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25367 on: July 30, 2016, 07:52:09 PM »
/summon Joshex

Nyx Nought Nothing

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25368 on: July 30, 2016, 10:51:52 PM »
/summon Joshex
Yeah, that's not going to happen.
So far so good. Onward and upward!

blacksly

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25369 on: July 31, 2016, 02:19:43 AM »
/summon UniqueDragon

Brigadine

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25370 on: July 31, 2016, 05:10:29 PM »
/summon Joshex
/summon lord nemesis

Twisted Toon

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25371 on: July 31, 2016, 05:56:01 PM »
/summon lord nemesis

Arcana is already here. No need to summon her.
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms

RGladden

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25372 on: July 31, 2016, 06:19:05 PM »
Summon the friggin' game already!

duane

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25373 on: July 31, 2016, 06:56:22 PM »

pinballdave

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25374 on: July 31, 2016, 07:11:43 PM »
beetle juice, beetle juice, beetle juice

Tahquitz

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25375 on: July 31, 2016, 07:42:16 PM »
/summon "The kid that made "kil skuls" a thing."
"Work is love made visible." -- Khalil Gibran

Tubbius

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25376 on: July 31, 2016, 09:16:49 PM »
I miss my City.

That is all.

Taceus Jiwede

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25377 on: July 31, 2016, 09:43:10 PM »
I missed a "How every MMO should be made" discussion?!  But my opinion!

Actually  I don't really have anything to add except for one small thing

Quote
Paragon made very good lemonade out of the lemons they were handed.  But you can't serve everyone lemonade.
  Arcana this is a really good analogy (or is  it a metaphor?) and to continue building on it, especially the last part about serving everyone lemonade, I try to look at games and MMO's like this
--

If CoH is Lemonade and WoW is Pineapple juice neither one is inferior or superior in any objective way. Some people like Lemonade and others like Pineapple Juice and some people, like me, enjoy both.  It's okay to like one more then the other, but it doesn't objectively make the other one worse.  Different games for different people, if we all liked the same stuff the world would have really long lines.

Taceus Jiwede

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25378 on: July 31, 2016, 09:49:47 PM »
/summon Joshex

Joshex, Joshex, Joshex.....hmm it didn't wor....OH GOD HES RIGHT BEHIND ME

Paragon Avenger

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Re: New efforts!
« Reply #25379 on: July 31, 2016, 11:45:18 PM »
Joshex, Joshex, Joshex.....hmm it didn't wor....OH GOD HES RIGHT BEHIND ME

Ok, remain calm, no sudden moves.  Offer him pie, but not too much.  Maybe he will go away and you won't have to call ...

Joshex-Busters!