New efforts!

[Power Arc X]

I remember  1st Edition Advanced D&D wishes also aged the player 10 years and I think they also had to make a constitution/system  shock check.
My older brother  made me write down precisely  what the wish was & let me read it but if I made any mistakes  it messed with my wish somewhat. Ask for a ring of regeneration  and it could regenerate you but at a millenniums  pace.

[Joshex]

People would sometimes wish for the world to be destroyed in some fashion.  The presumption was always that such wishes failed not because they didn't work, but because such wishes attempted to perform acts that large numbers of other more powerful beings had a stake in seeing not happen and could undo instantly.  Used in that way, a wish was like Yosemite Sam trying to save the Alamo.  Not only is it not going to work, you'll attract a lot of attention you don't want besides.

The cosmology of D&D contained a huge number of incredibly powerful beings capable of granting, much less using, wishes.  The fact that the world still exists with so many things that could destroy it walking around suggests its not as easy to do as just making a wish.

and that's why you do it in a backhanded way that appears to have one and only one motive which is completely different, like the octillion or nontillion or decatillion ounces of gold. the DM thinks you are trying to get rich, so he makes the size of that much gold do physical harm to you. Then you say "ok so you're gonna let the wish happen then?", they say "I'll give you a chance to undo it" (cause they are trying to be nice and keep you in the game) "no actually I'll keep my wish, remember you agreed to let it happen, go look up how big that much gold is, it's bigger than an average planet, I just killed everything on that world, I win."

"ok lets start over"

[FloatingFatMan]

Something wonderful is coming.

And here I am! TADAAAA!

/e StrikeAPose!

[FloatingFatMan]

"I just killed everything on that world, I win."

GM: "Including yourself and your party. Their ghosts would like a word with your ghost, idiot."  :p

[MWRuger]

I remember  1st Edition Advanced D&D wishes also aged the player 10 years and I think they also had to make a constitution/system  shock check.
My older brother  made me write down precisely  what the wish was & let me read it but if I made any mistakes  it messed with my wish somewhat. Ask for a ring of regeneration  and it could regenerate you but at a millenniums  pace.

That was if you cast the actual spell. If the wish was contained within an item that you found, no check was required. Also, I think it was only 5 years, but I would have to check the books. Been a while since I played 1st Edition.

[Thunder Glove]

I don't know.  If the DM is deliberately using the Wish spell as nothing but a "gotcha" to screw players over, then what's the point?  The spell description says that simple wishes should be granted without any trickery, and certainly the DM shouldn't go out of his way to make his players miserable.

So if a player simply wants his character not to be dead, which is a reasonable request, then for the DM to go "Okay, the character is not dead, he's just teleported away where he will spend the rest of his life being mercilessly tortured!  Roll up a new level 1 character!", that's not only perverting the spirit of the wish, I'd argue it's perverting the entire spirit of the game.

[JanessaVR]

I don't know.  If the DM is deliberately using the Wish spell as nothing but a "gotcha" to screw players over, then what's the point?  The spell description says that simple wishes should be granted without any trickery, and certainly the DM shouldn't go out of his way to make his players miserable.

So if a player simply wants his character not to be dead, which is a reasonable request, then for the DM to go "Okay, the character is not dead, he's just teleported away where he will spend the rest of his life being mercilessly tortured!  Roll up a new level 1 character!", that's not only perverting the spirit of the wish, I'd argue it's perverting the entire spirit of the game.

Exactly.  This was one of the main reasons that the costs and abilities of Wishes were more carefully defined as of 3rd Edition.

[Codewalker]

Sounds like at least part of the blame can be placed on the player, who specifically requested to be teleported to the best doctors in the world, instead of simply wishing to not be dead / about to die, or to undo the action that made them that way.

[Thunder Glove]

Then the DM should have used one of the best tools in his (or her) arsenal to keep players from screwing themselves over: "Are you sure?" :D

[Minotaur]

I ran a campaign where 3 people at different times made the same flawed wish, and felt too stupid to admit it which would have prevented the others making the same mistake. Thus each of them had to find another wish to fix it.

There is a cartoon which I won't link to due to obscenity of a character with a genie which goes something like:

I grant you one wish
More wishes
I cannot do that, I am limited to one wish
More genies
%^&*

[MWRuger]

I ran a campaign where 3 people at different times made the same flawed wish, and felt too stupid to admit it which would have prevented the others making the same mistake. Thus each of them had to find another wish to fix it.

There is a cartoon which I won't link to due to obscenity of a character with a genie which goes something like:

I grant you one wish
More wishes
I cannot do that, I am limited to one wish
More genies
%^&*

Teleport him straight to the City of Brass. All the Djinn he wants in one place!

[Twisted Toon]

I don't know.  If the DM is deliberately using the Wish spell as nothing but a "gotcha" to screw players over, then what's the point?  The spell description says that simple wishes should be granted without any trickery, and certainly the DM shouldn't go out of his way to make his players miserable.

So if a player simply wants his character not to be dead, which is a reasonable request, then for the DM to go "Okay, the character is not dead, he's just teleported away where he will spend the rest of his life being mercilessly tortured!  Roll up a new level 1 character!", that's not only perverting the spirit of the wish, I'd argue it's perverting the entire spirit of the game.

I recall one game where my level 1 mage was killed due to a series of unfortunate die rolls from another character. Seems this thief went to attack an Orc or goblin or something, rolled a horrible roll, some how managed to trip and stumble all the away across a clearing, past 4 other members of the party, only to make a critical hit on my mage. Then, after rolling a new character and meeting up with the same party, my new character was unfortunate enough to be knock unconscious by an Orc shaman's magic missile. Which allowed an Orc to whack my character with a club for about 10 rounds for 1 point each round. Of course, if any one else in the group had been running the game, they would have had that Orc do some thing more productive that beating an opponent that's down. Like, be a possible distraction for the other 5 people that are mowing the rest of the Orcs down like wheat.

Needless to say, I haven't played with that DM any more.

[RGladden]

*Sigh*  12:45 pm....April 20th....2015.   29 months...20 days since shutdown.  *Sigh*     :(

[MWRuger]

Some referees, despite what every gamebook says, just cannot view the relationship between GM and player as impartial. The idea that you "win" if you defeat the players is absurd, but I have seen it many times. How hard is it for the DM to kill/defeat the players when he pulls all the strings in the campaign?

I think this is one part the wargaming origins of the hobby and 4 parts natural competitive nature of humans.

On the flip side, I have seen plenty of players who feel like they "win" if they can pull something without the GM noticing. Players who never seem to miss or blow saving throws. Even this shouldn't require direct intervention. I just give the bad guys the same benefits. They never seem to miss or blow saves either.

Truly, the only way to win is if everyone has a good time.

[Ironwolf]

If I were the one to make the wish - I would carefully word it to make success like Groundhog day.

I could die or be defeated but the next day - I could learn what I had done wrong and start again where I did the previous day. This isn't game breaking it just let's you learn some lessons as you succeed.

[FloatingFatMan]

Players who never seem to miss or blow saving throws. Even this shouldn't require direct intervention. I just give the bad guys the same benefits. They never seem to miss or blow saves either.

Truly, the only way to win is if everyone has a good time.

I'm one of the players who always seems to roll the critical fail, every single time.  I always seem to occupy most of the GM's time just trying to keep me alive from my own rolls!

Last time I played M&M, on my first roll on entering combat.. I failed to dodge a falling gigantic bronze statue, and the result was... splat.  I think that's got to be a record of some kind... Another time, in a different game, another player asked me to hold their vibro sword whilst they quickly pulled their armour on. In that time, a zombie got into the room, I hit it with the sword (I was a thief, not a combat char), and it got stuck in it. The thing promptly ran away with the sword sticking in it.. The other player was REALLY cross!

Cost me a sodding fortune to replace...

Then there was the time, in another game, when my gatling pistol exploded in my face, on my first attack roll...

Never play PnP games with me, people.  I'm cursed!

[Joshex]

If I were the one to make the wish - I would carefully word it to make success like Groundhog day.

I could die or be defeated but the next day - I could learn what I had done wrong and start again where I did the previous day. This isn't game breaking it just let's you learn some lessons as you succeed.

ah yes the true power of the hero, unlimited do-overs.

[Ironwolf]

I hear you, was playing D&D and my character was a Chaotic/Good ranger. I had low charisma because my in my youth I had been badly scarred by an Orc. I also had a bow of +2 against Orcs and arrows of +1 against Orcs - since I had leanred to defeat them after they nearly tore my face off.

So on a scout of the coming area - I may have shot a couple Orcs, not knowing they were part of a 100 strong unit heading our way. So, the huge unit rolls in and we have a party of 6 facing 100+ Orcs and a mage who is 2 levels higher than our magic users - basically we are hosed. They all blamed me for starting it all.

I take out my wonderful +2 bow and +1 arrows and shoot at the mage - who it turns out is in the middle of casting a spell. I cause the spell to go wrong - really wrong and there is an explosion all creatures within 20 yards of the Orc wizard are vaporized. All of the creatures within 50 yards are killed. All creatures including us - within 100 yards are stunned and if facing the Orcs - blinded. The good news was - we all lived and the Orcs died or ran away. The bad news is many of the party were blind and it took several days for the cleric s to heal us - me they left blind for a few weeks to learn wisdom and to act as a trap springing tool - since I had to rely on them telling me where I should walk.

So, I know criticals.

[Arcana]

Then the DM should have used one of the best tools in his (or her) arsenal to keep players from screwing themselves over: "Are you sure?" :D

Or its modern equivalent: "would you like to phone a friend?"

[Arcana]

That reminds me, just how asleep at the wheel was Mystryl to let a mortal pull off that steal-my-divinity stunt?

The gods always claim to be all-knowing, but I have always believed they were all-knowing in the same sense a librarian is all-knowing.