Author Topic: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?  (Read 14300 times)

Captain Electric

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 674
  • Crime doesn't pay, evildoers!
    • CoH Faces Profile
Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« on: May 26, 2013, 12:49:44 PM »
Justin Olivetti of Massively's "The Daily Grind" column, which "probes the minds of their readers with deep, thought-provoking questions" every morning, wants to know what readers think.

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/05/26/the-daily-grind-is-automation-preferrable-to-mmo-closures/

Note: this is NOT Eliot Lefebvre, the columnist behind Massively's "Mild Mannered Reporter". So if you've got a bone to pick with Eliot, you know, don't direct that at Justin Olivetti by mistake.

Also, personally, for my own curiosity, I'm asking ya'll to dig deep for this question. Many of us have played or are playing Champions Online, and are pretty miffed at Cryptic for slowing development down to a crawl. I've heard a lot of people throw the term "maintenance mode" at Champs. Well, it's not in maintenance mode if it's still getting content updates.

Imagine City of Heroes getting less than what Champs gets (i.e. imagine if NCSoft turned the servers on but no more content updates ever again). Would you be forever grateful if CoH was returned but forever in maintenance mode? Do you think people would lose their gratitude after a few months (or weeks?) and start griping about CoH being in maintenance mode?
« Last Edit: May 26, 2013, 12:55:24 PM by Captain Electric »

FlyingCarcass

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 264
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #1 on: May 26, 2013, 01:26:19 PM »
CoH had a system that could bring in new content were the game to be put on automation mode, the mission architect. Ultimately, fan made content has the ability to extend the life of a game for many years after development on it has ceased, just look at Morrowind which is still getting modded about a decade since its last official expansion was released.

LaughingAlex

  • Giggling like an
  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,019
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2013, 02:35:27 PM »
It boils down to how much content a game has and if players can help or not.  CoX had the mission architect, so it being in maintenance mode wouldn't be anywhere near as much of a problem.  But say CO in the same kind of maintenance mode isn't so much, as it's easy to run out of content in that game to easily, in fact the content problem has been the core of alot of grief in CO.  It's also the core as to why people want the foundry so bad for that game.
Currently; Not doing any streaming, found myself with less time available recently.  Still playing starbound periodically, though I am thinking of trying other games.  Don't tell me to play mmohtg's though please :).  Getting back into participating in VO and the successors again to.

General Idiot

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 648
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2013, 02:49:24 PM »
Quote
CoH had a system that could bring in new content were the game to be put on automation mode, the mission architect.

In a truly perfect world, Issue 24 and all the content in development at the time would've been released, and the final patch before going into maintenence mode would've been an upgrade to the mission architect to let us do some or all of those cool things people wanted for years. Sadly, we live in a very imperfect world.

Lily Barclay

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 407
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2013, 03:34:18 PM »
Honestly? I hadn't played City's new content in years. I was still playing through all the old arcs and my favorite arcs. It wasn't until the shutdown announcement that I started playing through some of the newer stuff. I would have been perfectly fine if it had been automated, so long as they allowed paragon to continue on their other projects. I would have been less fine if they canned everyone, but probably would never have looked into the facts about the studio's profitability and would have just assumed the studio wasn't doing well. I would have kept playing and probably would have still paid a sub. If NCSoft were to bring it back automated now, I would play, but never give them another dime of my money.

LaughingAlex

  • Giggling like an
  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,019
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #5 on: May 26, 2013, 03:46:57 PM »
NCSoft really just wanted to get rid of CoX was my thought on the matter.  But I also suspect CoX had something to do with it, NCSoft would indeed shut guild wars down if they could and get away with it.  But the player base clearly isn't anymore, especially with how everyone in alot of games reacted to the shutdown.  It tells them that NCSoft isn't willing to provide them services or support for their games and at the same time, CoX was rated as the best super hero mmo when it was shut down.  Shutting down any kind of heavy weight is going to cause a morale shock among customers.  If they shut guild wars 1 down I imagine it woulda caused just as big of a backlash to be honest.
Currently; Not doing any streaming, found myself with less time available recently.  Still playing starbound periodically, though I am thinking of trying other games.  Don't tell me to play mmohtg's though please :).  Getting back into participating in VO and the successors again to.

JaguarX

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,393
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #6 on: May 26, 2013, 03:50:52 PM »
I think there would have been a major uproar and hate at NCSoft for putting a healthy game and thus ridding most of the devs into maintance mode just as much if they were closing it. Hell, there was uproar when seerver merger was even suggested.

But in hindsight I think given the choices, I think many would take maintance mode anyday given te alternative. Just like now many would kill and wouldnt care if all the servers were merged into freedom if that what it took to keep the game running now when then it was considered the dumbest idea ever suggested by many here, mostly about names, which at the time with not much indication of closure of even being an option, was the most important. If it was that much uproar over a mere server merger with no closure being sighted in the future I oculd only image the pissy mood and hate at NCSoft if they fired all the devs and put COX into maintence mode.


I think MA had potential to extend the game life but really, it was just farmville in MA. Farm missions at least to me got boring with updates, and slogging through thousands and thousands of farm missions to find somethign decent to play was a slog. I dont think at first it would seem MA would save the game in maintance mode as people that stayed away from MA probably wouldnt stay for MA as many reasons for them staying away from it was the difficulty of finding non-farm and or story arcs wit hsubstance. But with no updates, then I think farming might of waned out after a while since there was no updates to farm towards not to mention with no updates, I think maybe more people that didnt shun MA would start building more of their own stories and instead of making farm missions the majority, make farm missions the minority, which then will extend the life of the game but the catch is depedning on how long for the content oriented story arcs retaking MA takes. If it takes too long many people would have already left, leaving less players on top the players that leave due maintence mode and being bored, then people who leave then because the less ease to find a team, which means probably most teams will be smaller and that leaves a lot smaller pool of players for end games especially tryign to get 8 man team let alone 16-24 man to do incarnate stuff unless prior to slipping into maintence mode they readjust the content. If not, even with MA, COX in maintence mode would be worse off than CO in maintance mode. CO content very very very few things is team gated. So low population does not impede getting most badges and accodlaes that nice buffs like in COX where a good accolade that give a nice sized buff basically requires a team multiple times over to obtain.

Sure COX was best super hero game but more than likely NCSOft and other major corporations aint looking who is the best in this genre or that genre or who is the best game with heroes which is best game with the color red which is best game with population under 70,000 which is best game with population over 2 million. It's more than likely, how are the games regardless of genre performing? Unfortunately COX was at the bottom. Although I think other things regardless of the moans and graons at the idea at the time SHOULD Have been done like server merger, cutting back on frequency of updates,  etc. SUre I'm sure with no indication of shutdown some people will be just as angry at ncsoft for those actions as they are now but as angry as they will be most still will stick around and havea game to play instead of the alternative that we are experienceing now. But hopefully, now it taught us overall to be humble to ideas like that and be more aware to when peopel notice on the graphs and in game population drops instead of immediately mocking them as doom sayers, and doing something about it then instead of waiting till last minute when death is upon us like a cigarette smoker deciding to ignore the warning signs but wait when he is starng at the grim reaper to swera off smoking forever as if the reaper will suddenly change his mind. It dont hurt pleading for life even then but the chances are slim compared to the vast amount of chances when the game was still running and listening instead of attacking thinking they are telling you to stop smoking just to get a rise out of ya.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2013, 03:57:51 PM by JaguarX »

LaughingAlex

  • Giggling like an
  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,019
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #7 on: May 26, 2013, 06:03:22 PM »
Thought i'd read otherwise that CoX was actually doing better since the freedom update.  If NCSoft listens to google I think perhaps we'll see the truth of that matter though.  The amount of content being developed for CoX in that last year also contradicted it's success, a game that much in decline that some of us thought wouldn't be having updates like that; it wouldn't have the money for it.
Currently; Not doing any streaming, found myself with less time available recently.  Still playing starbound periodically, though I am thinking of trying other games.  Don't tell me to play mmohtg's though please :).  Getting back into participating in VO and the successors again to.

Noyjitat

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 717
  • Guess who cares?
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #8 on: May 26, 2013, 06:26:27 PM »
Positron said time and time again that sales were higher than ever.

JaguarX

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,393
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2013, 06:35:33 PM »
Positron said time and time again that sales were higher than ever.

yes, for COX. but compared to the rest of the line up, it still was near if not at the bottom.

saipaman

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 921
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #10 on: May 26, 2013, 08:42:45 PM »
yes, for COX. but compared to the rest of the line up, it still was near if not at the bottom.

That may be true; however, I'm sure it would have at least remained stable with I24, if not going up after that.  Lots of companies make the mistake of throwing out products with steady profits in hopes of going for some new blockbuster project.

JaguarX

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,393
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #11 on: May 26, 2013, 09:09:10 PM »
That may be true; however, I'm sure it would have at least remained stable with I24, if not going up after that.  Lots of companies make the mistake of throwing out products with steady profits in hopes of going for some new blockbuster project.
yup.


The times are a changing it seems. Small steady and or growing is not enough anymore. It's like they want instant hits instant results now now now, or it's gets thrown out. I guess it's just a reflection of society mindset that is also into instant results instant gratification now and days.


I think if we get an old school company or if COX and the likes fall into the hands of one with patience and not all or nothing mindset or too big to worry about a few measely millions, I think that company will be the next big thing as long as they dont lose sight of why they are there.

FatherXmas

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,646
  • You think the holidays are bad for you ...
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #12 on: May 26, 2013, 10:05:57 PM »
How is that different from movies or TV series?  Has to have big numbers on the opening weekend or it's a failure.  Must have huge ratings within the first two weeks or it's canceled.

Once the box sales drop off it's all about the monthly income stream, whether it's subscription, cash shop or both.  How many people pay for that next month and the month after?  How many buy something off the store?

Is automation preferable?  Versus closure of course.  Dumb question.  You have to understand what they mean when they say automation in GW, seasonal events, birthday gifts, regular tournaments will continue to happen like clockwork, just nothing "new".

And in a game like CoH, where the character possibilities were quite large, not talking costume but powers, plus 7 years of content before they did the whole SSA business, there was loads of content that most players never encountered.  I've been playing GW2 for 6 months now, I've done probably 95% or more of the PvE content.  In 6 months of CoH I barely scratched the surface, probably due to altitus.  It was way to much fun to try new builds, ATs, looks, etc.

I surely think CoH could have idled for more than a year before the old timers started wanting new stuff.  But for newer players, they could have stayed there for years.
Tempus unum hominem manet

Twitter - AtomicSamuraiRobot@NukeSamuraiBot

JaguarX

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,393
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2013, 10:32:07 PM »
How is that different from movies or TV series?  Has to have big numbers on the opening weekend or it's a failure.  Must have huge ratings within the first two weeks or it's canceled.

Aint no difference.
Just in case I was referign to the times prior to tv movies, instant hits and etc where people had to travel and peddle their merchandice to get it caught on, which hardly ever took instant and then from there they had to grow their product and expand which took decades in some cases and mostly the children fo the owner reaped the financial benefits with the hopes they make it grow. Now modern times, tv time, movies, etc, they dont have decades it's now or nothing.

Once the box sales drop off it's all about the monthly income stream, whether it's subscription, cash shop or both.  How many people pay for that next month and the month after?  How many buy something off the store?

Is automation preferable?  Versus closure of course.  Dumb question.  You have to understand what they mean when they say automation in GW, seasonal events, birthday gifts, regular tournaments will continue to happen like clockwork, just nothing "new".

And in a game like CoH, where the character possibilities were quite large, not talking costume but powers, plus 7 years of content before they did the whole SSA business, there was loads of content that most players never encountered.  I've been playing GW2 for 6 months now, I've done probably 95% or more of the PvE content.  In 6 months of CoH I barely scratched the surface, probably due to altitus.  It was way to much fun to try new builds, ATs, looks, etc.

I surely think CoH could have idled for more than a year before the old timers started wanting new stuff.  But for newer players, they could have stayed there for years.
[/quote]

Yup.

Is it me, or are they building games now to be burst hits. What I mean by that they build them with just north of bare minimum content and stuff to bring in big sales then after that, its off to cruise mode until sunset whether that means closing or maintance mode or somewhere in between. Or if it's a big hit like the lottery they might add some stuff here and there. It seems the initial investment and risk is down compared to what it used to be.

If you look at the amount of content that many of the games from the 2004 era was released with some of them were more expansive than some of the new games have been in three years worth of work. Then again I guess those expansion and those big worlds are exspensive to buld and the more exspensive the more risk because it seems no matter how much content the players are always screaming "MORE! MORE! MORE! MORE!" so why spend big money on a bunch of maps out the box when you can release it bit by bit and if things do belly up, not all is lost.

New players, yes they would have liked it but really with the game being relatively unknown, and not many people I know are attracted to games that go into maintence mode, ie CO is prime example of this of people that is new goign there and realzing and complaining about "Hey, where si the dev attention" or rather lack of and leave in a quick manner. And that game is not even in official maintence mode yet. The old guard probably would stay and keep it afloat for years. New players besides oens here and there probably would be few just as it was when it was running over all. No one outside the tight knit group even knew about the existance of COX. COX is getting more publicity it seems after it's dead than when it was alive. SMH.

TimtheEnchanter

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,466
  • There are some who call me... Tim?
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #14 on: May 26, 2013, 11:31:15 PM »
Just a thought... is it possible that CoX could not have existed in maintenance mode, because of the lawsuit requiring them to actively hunt for copyright offenders?

JaguarX

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,393
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #15 on: May 26, 2013, 11:49:31 PM »
Just a thought... is it possible that CoX could not have existed in maintenance mode, because of the lawsuit requiring them to actively hunt for copyright offenders?
oh snap. that is an interesting thought.

Maintence mode for COX could have been a lasuit waiting to happen for NCSoft and or Paragon Studios due to those jokers that like to make copyright infriging characters.

MindBlender

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 129
  • My Main was a healer, wish he was here now.
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #16 on: May 27, 2013, 12:18:02 AM »
From what I know about the player base, if AE was still part of the game in maintenance mode, we had the creativity to "take over" new content.  Nothing new from a dev group would not have stopped the game from evolving.  Yes, it got boring with all the farm missions, but if you give that system to folks not waiting on the next release and they will create something better.
All my computer skill was used up on my Commodore 64 decades ago...

Osborn

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 188
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #17 on: May 27, 2013, 12:33:21 AM »
Justin Olivetti of Massively's "The Daily Grind" column, which "probes the minds of their readers with deep, thought-provoking questions" every morning, wants to know what readers think.

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/05/26/the-daily-grind-is-automation-preferrable-to-mmo-closures/

Note: this is NOT Eliot Lefebvre, the columnist behind Massively's "Mild Mannered Reporter". So if you've got a bone to pick with Eliot, you know, don't direct that at Justin Olivetti by mistake.

Also, personally, for my own curiosity, I'm asking ya'll to dig deep for this question. Many of us have played or are playing Champions Online, and are pretty miffed at Cryptic for slowing development down to a crawl. I've heard a lot of people throw the term "maintenance mode" at Champs. Well, it's not in maintenance mode if it's still getting content updates.

Imagine City of Heroes getting less than what Champs gets (i.e. imagine if NCSoft turned the servers on but no more content updates ever again). Would you be forever grateful if CoH was returned but forever in maintenance mode? Do you think people would lose their gratitude after a few months (or weeks?) and start griping about CoH being in maintenance mode?

I think if CO stopped pretending to not be in maintenance mode, and dropped the VIP thing and only had a minimal cash store to cover just maintenance mode and wasn't using CO to develop STO or NWN, then I think most of the people's complaints would stop, except those that would want the game to come out of maintenance mode and into full game mode.

I think the same would be for CoH. You'd have some people that would want full updates to happen again as long as the game was profitable no matter what state the cash store is in, and they'd feel ripped off if CoH was in the sort of Schrodinger's half-dead/half-alive state CO is in.

But if it was in a minimalistic maintenance mode where it wasn't as monetized, like what it'd be if the game went to private servers, then I don't think as many people would complain.

I think people's complaints mostly stem from either the game being gone 100%, or the game being in limbo where they still want you to pay for a full game, but aren't delivering on it. I think if they told you straight up "This game is in maintenance mode" and closed most of the monetization, people would be fine with it.

And even the people who would want the game to come back to full development/full monetization mode would be still happier than having either nothing or what looks like a scam.

JWBullfrog

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 605
  • I didn't leave Paragon City. They threw me out!
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #18 on: May 27, 2013, 01:35:01 AM »
Perpetual Maintence mode or no game at all???
 
No contest.
As long as somebody keeps making up stories for it, the City isn't gone.

Tubbius

  • Fun Title
  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 605
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #19 on: May 27, 2013, 04:13:27 PM »
If it meant maintenance mode vs. no mode at all, maintenance.  I was one of the AE authors who actually cared deeply for AE's potential, creating some wonderfully fun stuff, including one at 8 p.m. Eastern the night the servers went down.  I'd be more than up to the challenge of writing more AE stuff if it meant having to rely on that for future story development in-game.

LydiaFrost

  • Minion
  • **
  • Posts: 31
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #20 on: May 27, 2013, 05:15:35 PM »
I think a Game needs Updates in Content, Powers and Storys.
I would be OK with a slower development cycle, but Maintainance would mean dead for me.
For me the Story arcs and the changes in the world are very intresting, new Powers to work for like Incarnate powers give me something to do with my time.

I dont read the same comic over and over.

AE would have been a possible solution, but highest ranking mission had hundreds of goons swarming me and killing me instant. That was it for me with AE.

Lydia Frost MM

Cinnder

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 246
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #21 on: May 27, 2013, 05:38:36 PM »
I'd like to add a resounding YES to the preference of maintenance mode over closure.  There were so many missions in CoH even without AE that I never levelled up a character via the same path twice in a row.  (Well, except for the first few levels when they removed all the choice of regular missions for the early game, but that's a separate gripe...)

One of the things I enjoyed best about CoX was the vast array of power sets.  I think only after I had a 50 in every power set would I start to get bored.

Lucretia MacEvil

  • Guest
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #22 on: May 27, 2013, 10:20:08 PM »
I think only after I had a 50 in every power set would I start to get bored.

But what about all those great synergistic combos of powersets?   :D

Honestly, there was so much content that I never got around to that even Maintenance Mode would keep me busy for a long, long time.  Ideally, I24 would get finished and published (crashless nukes, pleeeeeeeease!!!!), but even if that didn't happen, I'd still hang around forever.

Absolute

  • Lieutenant
  • ***
  • Posts: 75
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #23 on: May 27, 2013, 10:25:24 PM »
If it meant maintenance mode vs. no mode at all, maintenance.  I was one of the AE authors who actually cared deeply for AE's potential, creating some wonderfully fun stuff, including one at 8 p.m. Eastern the night the servers went down.  I'd be more than up to the challenge of writing more AE stuff if it meant having to rely on that for future story development in-game.

This ^

I wrote a long response last night but apparently got distracted and closed the tab.

I think AE would pretty much take over everything if content completely stopped. It was a great tool, it just wasn't needed as much when nobody ever ran out of content in the first place. I don't know what other game could survive longer in maintenance mode then CoH with AE.

Tahliah

  • Lieutenant
  • ***
  • Posts: 83
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #24 on: May 28, 2013, 12:47:26 AM »
I'd be so on board with COH in maintenance mode.  I never got around to so much new content that I could have played quite happily with COH as it was for years and still had more left to do.  I didn't get all the badges I could have, for instance, on my badge.  I didn't do all of the end content (New DA or that much of it, at all, actually, and only bits of First Ward).  I didn't do all the incarnate trials, and who knows I may never have done them.  But I also never got a chance to get some of my "new" favorite toons to 50 (water blaster, nature affinity toons--had a troll, dom, and mastermind, and others).  Well, I say I didn't have the chance or get around to it, but I guess I thought I had all the time in the world, that I could lazily level these toons, explore "new" content (some that had been around for a couple a years, I never got around to doing), etc.

If i24 was a part of it even better; I was SO excited about getting some blaster love.  But even if it was at i23, I'd still be all over it.  I never really understood why the community seemed so angry all the time about this little thing or that (I know they weren't little things to the posters, but it seemed extreme to threaten to /ragequit because you couldn't do "X" to your sg base or whatever); I know that it's the player base passion for the game, but looking back now . . . yeah, I'd be thrilled beyond imagining if I could play COH in maintenance mode, no new updates, costumes, powersets, anything . . . forever.

eviella

  • Minion
  • **
  • Posts: 30
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #25 on: May 28, 2013, 04:38:52 AM »
I know there is a TON of stuff I could keep myself entertained with on CoH in maintenance mode.  Tons of alts to play with, AE, and there was some stuff I had never actually done.


Little David

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 149
    • The Ad Ultimum Network
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #26 on: May 28, 2013, 12:11:49 PM »
Maintenance mode compared to shutdown? Yes. Very yes. Heck, keep the cash shop open so the game continues to draw in some income to pay for its own upkeep.

Some MMOs can stay busy for years on their own inertia. I'm a long-time player of the legitimate international Ragnarok Online servers, and I've noticed that the guild-based PVP and territory control event, War of Emperium, has been a big factor in why the game's population has remained stable. When Gravity KR introduced a content update called Renewal that shook the game up at its basic levels (core game mechanics, content, etc.), it messed with the flow of WoE on iRO so much that a lot of people stopped playing on the "premium" servers. In response, Gravity LLC released a "Classic" server that brought back the state of the game as it was pre-Renewal, and it's seen a steady population since.

If City of Heroes ever had supergroup base raids working, combined with an upgrade to Mission Architect so that it would give players the same level of control over mission making that the devs had (and maybe turn over the Developer's Choice Awards system to the community so that new story arcs could be promoted), I think those would have been more than enough to keep CoH on autopilot.

Just a thought... is it possible that CoX could not have existed in maintenance mode, because of the lawsuit requiring them to actively hunt for copyright offenders?

Didn't Marvel settle the lawsuit after it was revealed that their employees were playing CoH with Marvel knockoffs?

Segev

  • Plan Z: Interim Producer
  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,573
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #27 on: May 28, 2013, 12:43:46 PM »
Honestly, the cynical side of me that understands PR to the limited extent that I do would marvel at NCSoft's canniness...if they'd announced a cancellation (but kept on a maintenance staff) and then, after the firestorm of fan protests, magnanimously announced that they would instead continue it in maintenance mode, perhaps with a single last-ditch fund-raiser to support a temporary dev and debugging staff to implement i24 if it reached a certain threshold.

Why would I marvel? Because I would doubt they'd ever intended to really shut it down unless it clearly had no fan support at all, but that they'd always intended a maintenance mode and now are getting a last burst of profit out of the waning fan support.

Why would I think they'd initiate such deception? Because announcing a game going into maintenance mode will make fans gripe about it being ignored, dying, etc., and generally overall be met with what is easily perceived as grudging ingratitude. No, I'm not denigrating fans, here; it's human nature. They are losing something and being given a consolation prize that isn't quite what they'd hoped for.

But announce the complete closure, and then turn around and respond to the fan uprising with the same consolation prize (plus a bonus if a fund-raiser reaches a certain target goal)? How many of us - be honest - would be singing NCSoft's praises for listening to the fans, and would be truly relieved and grateful if Nov. 30th had been the day they announced a continued maintenance mode to go on as long as the game earned enough to keep itself from actively costing them money? How many of us would be scrambling to shove money at NCSoft to reach whatever goal they'd set in a simple donation fund-raiser to hire a debugging team and implement i24 within two Quarters of the goal being reached?

Suddenly, fan irritation becomes fan gratitude, because what NCSoft was going to do all along was presented as "listening to the fans" and as if it was returning something to them, rather than taking something away.

Illusionss

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 690
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #28 on: May 28, 2013, 03:57:31 PM »
In a truly perfect world, Issue 24 and all the content in development at the time would've been released, and the final patch before going into maintenence mode would've been an upgrade to the mission architect to let us do some or all of those cool things people wanted for years. Sadly, we live in a very imperfect world.

Yup.

Champions Online has been in maintenance mode for years. Its a matter of when, not if, the plug is going to be pulled on that game. Perhaps Perfect World will be kinder Gaming Overlords and allow it to limp on with no oversight or new input, but I doubt it. Gaming companies seem to be all about the "we'll do what we want to, to you and you will love it because we say you will" mission statement.

TonyV

  • Titan Staff
  • Elite Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 2,175
    • Paragon Wiki
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #29 on: May 28, 2013, 04:17:25 PM »
How is that different from movies or TV series?  Has to have big numbers on the opening weekend or it's a failure.  Must have huge ratings within the first two weeks or it's canceled.

Once the box sales drop off it's all about the monthly income stream, whether it's subscription, cash shop or both.  How many people pay for that next month and the month after?  How many buy something off the store?

First, to answer your question, the traditional television model is quite a bit different in that networks only have so many hours of programming they can support.  If they want to launch a new show that they feel will be very popular, they must make room for it somewhere on the schedule.  This isn't like games.  Sure, you can glut the market, but practically speaking, no matter how many games are out there, you don't have to kill one off to make room for a new one, especially in this age of digital distribution.  (Incidentally, this is why I get excited over developments such as Felicia Day's Geek & Sundry network; they are not bound by such time limitations and there's a good chance that this is ultimately the future of entertainment as companies like Netflix and Amazon jump on the bandwagon.)

Plus, who says that networks killing off shows with steady followings is a good thing?  How many times have you been invested in a show for a year or two just to have it canceled because, although it was doing okay in the ratings, apparently some network executive didn't feel it was doing well enough?  I know that drives me bonkers, to the point where I hardly ever watch any television any more, and when I do, it's usually some show that already has a year or two under its belt so that I won't get sucked into something that's unproven and may be canceled at any given time.

Last, I have to say that I really do miss the good ol' days of gaming when the industry was run by developers, not publishers.  I mean, we've had publishers around for decades, but they generally had a hands-off approach, serving primarily as support for the developers in things like marketing and distribution, not directly in actually running the games.  Nowadays, with gaming being a multibillion dollar business, it's all about the bottom line.  Decisions are rarely made based on the artistic merit of games or the loyalty of their communities, and when they are, it's almost always out of an independent studio.  It's just churn out a blockbuster, monetize it quickly into the ground, then churn out another.

MMORPGs in particular really require a commitment on the part of the publisher and developer.  Without that commitment, not only does an individual game suffer, but the genre as a whole suffers because unlike a television show or movie where you've probably blown a bunch of time and maybe $20 on a ticket and some popcorn, people tend to invest years and hundreds, maybe thousands, of dollars into MMORPGs.  When a publisher like NCsoft yanks one out from under its community, it poisons the well for other MMORPGs.  How many of you who had been loyal 8+ year subscribers to City of Heroes were ready, upon its shutdown, to go out and invest that kind of time and money into another game?

Is automating a game preferable to shutting it down?  Of course.  But in an ideal world, when you have a community and development studio like Paragon Studios that remains passionate about their work, neither should be an option.  There was no reason in the world why NCsoft shouldn't have spun off Paragon Studios as an independent development studio, sold them the rights to the game, and let it continue running as long as the developers and the community cared about the game.  Eventually it would have wound down naturally.  Even at that point, the developers could have taken steps to sell, for example, a "server lite" version of the game to allow avid supporters of the game to continue playing in single-player or small-party mode with friends.  10 or 20 years from now if I still want to fire up the game and play some of my beloved characters, there should be no reason why I couldn't.

Ironwolf

  • Stubborn as a
  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,503
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #30 on: May 28, 2013, 06:34:55 PM »
Shutdown or Maintenance mode?

This site should tell you all you need to know: gog.com - games that are ancient and yet still played and for sale.

FatherXmas

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,646
  • You think the holidays are bad for you ...
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #31 on: May 28, 2013, 06:49:27 PM »
First, to answer your question, the traditional television model is quite a bit different in that networks only have so many hours of programming they can support.  If they want to launch a new show that they feel will be very popular, they must make room for it somewhere on the schedule.  This isn't like games.

First the question was rhetorical but there are parallels that can be drawn.  Like a TV series or movies, games have an up front development cost that need to be recouped first before it's considered profitable.  Games are primarily sold in retail and there is limit shelf space.  If a game doesn't sell well quickly, it's off the shelves as there is a constant stream of new games demanding that space.  The analogy here is retail stores shelf space is like a TV network's limited number of time slots.  While on line distribution though services like Steam can keep a game visible, the die is already cast if it was considered a success or failure by it's publisher in those first few weeks and if there is a online service that goes with the game, don't expect any long term support from the publisher if it's not the "hit" it was expected to be.

Yes, in the old days when games were self-financed rather than financed by a "friendly" publisher who attached strings and hard deadlines.  But trying to take a bank loan for developing a game is like taking a bank loan to make a movie, it's much to risky for most banks.  So we end up with developers who will sell out to publishers to finance their project.  There are only a few (I can only think of one really) large developer who is still their own beast and that's Valve.

I disagree with your assertion that a game doesn't need to be "kill one off to make room for a new one".  There is a limited support budget (I include marketing, manufacturing in with proper support), priorities have to be made.  It took GOG to resurrect some great old titles because they were willing to deal with low price, limited support that the big publishers didn't know how to deal with.

In the end it's all about cash flow.  It's always about cash flow.  Older games simply don't bring in the money needed to support new development.  New games do.  Just like movie studios.  You have a big pile of cash you use to make the next round of movies and that pile hopefully is refilled by the movies now out, plus a bit for profit.  If you can't do that you end up like MGM and we end up with Bond delayed and getting Cabin in the Woods 3 years after it was made.

As an aside I love the programming on Geek and Sundry.  It is what G4 should have been.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2013, 06:56:34 PM by FatherXmas »
Tempus unum hominem manet

Twitter - AtomicSamuraiRobot@NukeSamuraiBot

Cinnder

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 246
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #32 on: May 28, 2013, 07:04:53 PM »
Last, I have to say that I really do miss the good ol' days of gaming when the industry was run by developers, not publishers.  I mean, we've had publishers around for decades, but they generally had a hands-off approach, serving primarily as support for the developers in things like marketing and distribution, not directly in actually running the games.  Nowadays, with gaming being a multibillion dollar business, it's all about the bottom line.  Decisions are rarely made based on the artistic merit of games or the loyalty of their communities, and when they are, it's almost always out of an independent studio.  It's just churn out a blockbuster, monetize it quickly into the ground, then churn out another.

Heh, I hear ya.  For years we compained that no one was taking gaming seriously enough, that they looked at it as just some sort of geek hobby.  Now they take it seriously, and too late we see what the consequences of that attention truly are.   :(

Little David

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 149
    • The Ad Ultimum Network
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #33 on: May 29, 2013, 09:54:13 AM »
I don't know, that mentality among publishers has been around for a while. Electronic Arts was doing it as far back as the late 90's.

I still miss Origin. (The developer studio, mind you, not the Steam wannabe.)

The Fifth Horseman

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 961
  • Outside known realities.
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #34 on: May 29, 2013, 10:41:10 AM »
This site should tell you all you need to know: gog.com - games that are ancient and yet still played and for sale.
The irony is that many of those games were out of print for years before GOG got the license to re-release them. I've seen copies of Arcanum sold for as much as $150 on Amazon Marketplace.
We were heroes. We were villains. At the end of the world we all fought as one. It's what we did that defines us.
The end occurred pretty much as we predicted: all servers redlining until midnight... and then no servers to go around.

Somewhere beyond time and space, if you look hard you might find a flash of silver trailing crimson: a lone lost Spartan on his way home.

Captain Electric

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 674
  • Crime doesn't pay, evildoers!
    • CoH Faces Profile
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #35 on: May 30, 2013, 05:18:39 AM »
I have spent quite a bit of money at GOG. Mostly to buy games I already owned but GOG's versions all run better. I have all of the Ultima games and Master of Orion I and II on there, various other games too.  :)

Also if you like point and click adventure games, a GOG account comes free with a few of those, including the classic Beneath a Steel Sky.

Sugoi

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 224
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #36 on: May 30, 2013, 06:08:41 AM »
I dont read the same comic over and over.

AE would have been a possible solution, but highest ranking mission had hundreds of goons swarming me and killing me instant. That was it for me with AE.

Lydia Frost MM

I don't play the same mission the same way when I run a different AT or one with different Power Selections.... That was one of the brilliant things about CoH... So many ways to play the game.

As far as AE, sounds like you hit one of those Farming Runs that people who can withstand massive amounts of damage would solo with a team soaking up XP in the front room.  Sorry that's all you experienced with it. 

I used it shortly after it came out to make a COH-flavored episode of my favorite Anime show, where a lot of the characters got captured by some toy robots, but when freed, they stuck around to help with the rest.  (The characters involved in the run included Electric , Fire and Energy Blasters, A Bot MM, and an Ice Controller, just like they were in the Anime series.)  There was so much more that could be done with AE besides Farming to 50 in 2 days.

Illusionss

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 690
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #37 on: May 30, 2013, 06:09:44 AM »
AE would have been a possible solution, but highest ranking mission had hundreds of goons swarming me and killing me instant. That was it for me with AE.

I remember two cool AE missions: just two.

One was called "Zombies like Tequila" and it was hilariously great. You did get mobbed by zombies in the end, but it was still a blast. The second one took place on that same map used at the end of that Faultline arc that culminated in fighting that annoying putz, Captain Castillo - the Frieda of CoH. [Frieda from Peanuts. It was a wonder he wasn't going on about his "naturally curly hair" as he used every dirty trick in the book to fight you.]

This second one was using that map, it was dark and it was full of ghosts. It was pretty cool. But agreed, most AE missions were not just bad, they were horrible. I think most of them were supposed to be farms. Ah, mito farms.... those were the only good thing that ever came out of AE.

Captain Castillo:


Styrj

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 154
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #38 on: May 30, 2013, 11:04:02 PM »
I have spent quite a bit of money at GOG. Mostly to buy games I already owned but GOG's versions all run better. I have all of the Ultima games and Master of Orion I and II on there, various other games too.  :)

Also if you like point and click adventure games, a GOG account comes free with a few of those, including the classic Beneath a Steel Sky.

Cap, I too have spent my share of dollars (and still am) at GoG.com, in addition, the games are DRM free, which means you can install them on all your PCs plus no CD swapping.  I just picked up Wizardry 6, 7 & 8, HoMM 3 Complete, and Master of Magic (a classic).
If it ain't broke, don't fix it!  Infinity Server...

Empyrean

  • Lieutenant
  • ***
  • Posts: 71
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #39 on: May 31, 2013, 11:45:12 AM »
For City of Heroes, maintenance mode would have been great due to Mission Architect and the fact that it was a fully developed, mature game--but MAN I wanted that last issue with Ancillary Power customization!!!

The reason maintenance mode is so bad on Champions is that Champions is a younger game that never got even close to half as much development as CoH, so it's like the difference between maintaining a nice, big, well made classic amusement park vs maintaining a half-built amusement park.

But, to me, the big issue is that I strongly prefer a well built, mature, fully fleshed out and developed older game over a new shiny thing, but it's obvious that the industry thinks that the money is in the next new shiny.  And you know what?  They're probably right.  That seems to be what most people want.

Unfortunately, taste and intelligence are not common, and, just as in movies and music, the MMORPG industry is learning that it is not necessary to produce good movies/games/music to make money, just to dangle shiny things in front of the masses who will then throw money at them for it and then immediately look around for the next.

You CAN make big money with genuinely good movies/music/games, but you can also just as easily make big money by churning out an endless supply of disposable new shinys, so there is little incentive to companies to put forth the effort to produce good, much less truly great, stuff.

If I sound bitter, it's because I am.  And the worst part is, I'm probably right.  But, rare gems, like City of Heroes, The Avengers, and the White Stripes still come along in spite of the industrial pressure towards insipidness, so I do have a faint hope.  But I also try not to get my hopes up so that I'm pleasantly surprised rather than disappointed.

OzonePrime

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 376
  • Never Give Up! Never Surrender!
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #40 on: May 31, 2013, 01:24:40 PM »
Would be tickled with maintenance mode!
Beats running around by yourself, which is all we have now. I miss the chat channel humming. I miss seeing friends.

Sugoi

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 224
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #41 on: May 31, 2013, 03:17:39 PM »
Would be tickled with maintenance mode!
Beats running around by yourself, which is all we have now. I miss the chat channel humming. I miss seeing friends.

I agree with most of  what you stated above, but....

I was playing Champions Online and DC Universe Online occasionally just due to the fact that I could fly.... not because the game was good.

Thanks to Codewalker's efforts, we can fly again around the old neighborhood, bringing back so many memories.  Something we couldn't do a month ago.  Is it just me, or has Icon/CoH just gotten back into the 'electronic paper doll' stage so many people made fun of years ago?

And folks, 3AM East Coast time on 1 June is the 6 month memorial of the shutdown of the finest MMO to ever exist.  I will be staying up to give it the moment of respectful silence it is so obviously due.

therain93

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 574
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #42 on: May 31, 2013, 05:00:39 PM »
I agree with most of  what you stated above, but....

I was playing Champions Online and DC Universe Online occasionally just due to the fact that I could fly.... not because the game was good.

Thanks to Codewalker's efforts, we can fly again around the old neighborhood, bringing back so many memories.  Something we couldn't do a month ago.  Is it just me, or has Icon/CoH just gotten back into the 'electronic paper doll' stage so many people made fun of years ago?

And folks, 3AM East Coast time on 1 June is the 6 month memorial of the shutdown of the finest MMO to ever exist.  I will be staying up to give it the moment of respectful silence it is so obviously due.
Sounds like a short notice call to action ( ' ;
@Texarkana - March 5, 2004 - December 1, 2012 -- Imageshack |-| Youtube
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You don't know what it's like.... |-| Book One. Chapter one...

detour

  • Underling
  • *
  • Posts: 18
  • Baja Mercury: Accelerator
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #43 on: May 31, 2013, 09:10:29 PM »
Perpetual Maintence mode or no game at all???
 
No contest.

This.
Baja Mercury:  Accelerator.

Thunder Glove

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 992
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #44 on: June 01, 2013, 08:24:05 PM »
If it had gone into Perpetual Maintenance Mode, it would have been likely that they would have let Paragon finish I24 before doing so.   Perpetual I24 would have been so much preferable to the current situation of not having a "home".

Hyperstrike

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 477
  • SaveCoH!
    • So Super It Hurts
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #45 on: June 01, 2013, 08:50:30 PM »
Would I take CoH more or less on maintenace mode?

IN AN *RIKTI TRANSLATION FAILED* HEARTBEAT!

The game had a few bugs here and there, but by and large, it was very VERY well maintained.

Plus, with AE, there was always the ability to put new content in.  Even if the devs never laid another finger on it.

Contrast this with CO.

Ugly hack on top of ugly hack.  And not "ugly" from a code perspective.  I'm sure there were parts of the CoH code that'd drive most programmers into convulsions.  But ugly from a user's perspective too.
Things breaking left and right and just never being fixed.
Events that and additions that, if they're tested at all, are tested only minimally before going live and breaking horribly, to be abandoned shortly thereafter.
NO provisions for user-generated content.

Had CoH dropped to the level of support that CO has currently, the game would still be COMPLETELY playable (with a few exceptions, like to always-crashing Tyrant personal mission).
Whereas whole swaths of CO barely function and are gradually getting more and more unstable over time.

Now add to that, the fact that CoH was, quite literally, ten times the size of CO.

CO has SIX regular zones and five temporary crisis zones that you lose once you outlevel/complete them.
CoH has SIXTY regular zones.

Yes, this spread the population out more.  But it gave people a broader swath of things to do.
With CO, you run 2-3 characters with minor alterations in where you go and you've pretty much done EVERYTHING in the game.

With CoH, people griped about things like Radios always being the same 20-25 maps.
With CO, the Alerts are always the same 10 or so.

And NCSoft's support division isn't one group per unit, it's not as if they incur significant extra costs in doing GM duty for CoH.

Granted, I'd HATE losing the guys at Paragon.  Hate it like poison.  They deserved a LOT better than what they got for the work they did.

But if the community stayed in CoH, I'd be there.  I solo a lot, but being able to jump on with a few hundred of my best friends and gab while I'm beating someone's face in is a pleasant way to spend an evening.

TheMindfulFool

  • Underling
  • *
  • Posts: 10
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #46 on: June 01, 2013, 10:48:20 PM »
If you would have asked me a few months ago, I would have said I'd rather have closure than an automation system. However, after spending these months without a game, I think maybe I was wrong.

The thing I would have been worried about was that CoH most alluring feature was its constant updates. Every Friday, something was happening. Either a small thing was being released or news was being shown -- I loved it. And to know that wasn't going to happen again would have been a real downer.

That being said, this is worse. Not having a home to fly around in is awful. I've tried a few games and they just lack in a lot of ways. So, maybe I wouldn't have wanted an automated system forever, but I think an automated system would have allowed for our voices to be heard more. We would have had the ability to show people that people -still- played the game, and maybe get NCSoft to hand it over to someone after awhile.

Or maybe that's just a pipe dream, who knows.

But the short version of this talk is I think I would have been wrong to want the game to close instead of doing an automated system. I think CoH's most amazing attribute was the fans and their creativity, not the constant additions done by the devs.

JennSpace

  • Lieutenant
  • ***
  • Posts: 77
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #47 on: June 03, 2013, 04:38:50 PM »
To answer your question, No Doubt*!  :P I would have played and kept my City of Heroes account live forever, EVEN if they'd have put CoH in maintenance mode. I'm a comics fan and this game allowed me to be the superheroine I could never be, as an alternative to you know ...dress as SuperGirl and jump off from my window and try to go touch the sky! XDDDD 
Missed in action in the Rikti War Zone, almost 2 years ago.

Twisted Toon

  • New Efforts # 13,000!
  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 830
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #48 on: June 03, 2013, 06:09:21 PM »
To answer your question, No Doubt*!  :P I would have played and kept my City of Heroes account live forever, EVEN if they'd have put CoH in maintenance mode. I'm a comics fan and this game allowed me to be the superheroine I could never be, as an alternative to you know ...dress as SuperGirl and jump off from my window and try to go touch the sky! XDDDD
Better you dressing as Supergirl than me.  :D

I'd probably choose Green Lantern to dress up as though.
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms

OzonePrime

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 376
  • Never Give Up! Never Surrender!
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #49 on: June 03, 2013, 06:28:43 PM »
Would be tickled with maintenance mode!
Beats running around by yourself, which is all we have now. I miss the chat channel humming. I miss seeing friends.
I guess I should have said running/flying around by yourself. Have been flying. Have recreated all of my alts and have them saved. Even saying hello to the trashcans 'cause I'm just tickled to death with this little bit.
Thanks again, Codewalker!

JennSpace

  • Lieutenant
  • ***
  • Posts: 77
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #50 on: June 03, 2013, 07:41:07 PM »
Better you dressing as Supergirl than me.  :D

I'd probably choose Green Lantern to dress up as though.

XDDD, I'm not too fond on Green Lantern to be honest ^^ but yeah, he's a LITTLE more masculine than SuperGirl  ;)
Missed in action in the Rikti War Zone, almost 2 years ago.

Optimus Dex

  • Boss
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #51 on: June 03, 2013, 09:59:45 PM »
If it was still available to play I would still be paying. Maintenance mode - slowed development  whatever . Just so I could play. I liked the controls  I loved being able to fly or super jump. I just want to be able to play a super hero game.

Twisted Toon

  • New Efforts # 13,000!
  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 830
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #52 on: June 04, 2013, 04:49:37 AM »
XDDD, I'm not too fond on Green Lantern to be honest ^^ but yeah, he's a LITTLE more masculine than SuperGirl  ;)
I could make a very butch Supergirl.  Ok, maybe not all that butch, since I'm rather wiry...and stuff.

I like Green Lantern because his powers helps stretch the imagination.

I mean, can you imagine the interesting contests you could come up with catching the bad guys?  :o

But, to each, his (or her) own. :)
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms

Lycantropus

  • Elite Boss
  • *****
  • Posts: 255
Re: Massively: Is automation preferable to MMO closures?
« Reply #53 on: June 04, 2013, 06:16:00 AM »
Between the game being operational at all (with mission architect available to me) I'd gladly go with maintenance mode (without MA?) I'd gladly go with maintenance mode. (for the record, I never Unsubbed once I started- I never got bored or frustrated with it- just made a new alt with a new story- or wrote others with the MA- and kept going)

At least I'd have the option of when "I was tired" with Co* and when I (would inevitably) go back. Nothing has held my interest, my imagination, or my enjoyment of just playing a game, that CoX has, and fear it never will. If what @Codewalker is doing with Icon is any indication, I'll load it even if I don't have any evil to fight, and just fly around the places I love to explore like I used to.

Automation at least gives the players the option to keep playing (potentially subscribing with whatever benefits it came with) and making the most of whatever the game had going with it. Sunsetting is... nothing.

If anything, I'd keep playing with my SG which had more than 4-5 members, which is all it seems any MMO's support nowadays. We [HAVE] at least 6 regulars with a few more that show up from time to time. Most MMO's nowadays are... awkward with that number.

My son said you know you love a game when you can describe it in the most unappealing way to someone else and still want to play it.

City of Heroes had a lot of things I could dump on it on, and still I love it and want to play it... it's still better than anything else I can think of off the top of my head that I've played, even when I'm bitching about it.

I just want my City back. Nothing fits like Paragon did... warts and all.

Lyc~