CoH #1! ...as if we didn't already know...

[LadyVamp]

Well, Sleepy Wonder, if that's the way you feel then I guess we should wish you well and say good luck in your future endeavors.

I agree with Ironwolf.  We ARE heroes.  Here we are 5 months later and we're still together.  Sure we are in the dark and out in the cold but we will prevail.  If it takes 2 years, let it.  The important thing is we do not give up.  Heroes don't give up.  Heroes don't quit.

We will survive and we will emerge stronger so long as we don't roll over and die.  I refuse to give up and neither should you.

Together, we are making a difference.

Tankers will tank again.  Scrappers will scrap again.  Healers will heal (and curse the scrapper out for running off on her own).  trollers will control.  And, hellions will be quaking in fear.

[Nyx Nought Nothing]

Tankers will tank again.  Scrappers will scrap again.  Healers will heal (and curse the scrapper out for running off on her own).  trollers will control.  And, hellions will be quaking in fear.

And buffers and debuffers (especially in groups) will crush everything in their path again.

That said, i never expected CoH to be back in less than six months at best once the shutdown finally happened. Large corporations move at glacial speeds with regards to anything not part of their core operations and even if NCsoft decides to sell the game it would most likely take months to finalize the deal and more months to get everything going.

So even if NCsoft had decided to sell off CoH the month after they shut it down (always extremely unlikely), the earliest i would've expected to see the game back up would've been around now. My most optimistic guess would be that it would take at least four months from the moment NCsoft actually seriously does something with CoH for it to return. Which even by most standards isn't long at all. By any sort of longer term viewpoint it's barely an eyeblink.

Edit: Added the missing "sell".

[Sleepy Wonder]

It still amazes me how people expected things like Task Force Hail Mary to work within days or weeks. Am I alone in thinking we should've adopted the calling card of our former developers, and just said Soon(tm)?

I don't know where you got the idea that I expected TFHM to "work" within days or weeks or months, or if ever. For the record, I do not expect it to work at all, period. That is my opinion (of which I am entitled) if I had to bet a miniscule amount of money on.

Do I want it to work? Absolutely. Would it be awesome if it did? Absolutely. Do I, personally, expect it to? NO. I don't. I never did. Expecting and wanting are two different things.

What I do expect from people is common sense, honesty and integrity. Especially from certain people in leadership positions around here. There are a lot of misinformed people on these boards due to the result of a lack of all three. Revealing this information would accomplish nothing and only serve to bring about more harm than good.

I don't choose to lower my expectations because I'm "giving up" or "moving on". I've already moved on, but that doesn't mean I can't still be here to see how things are progressing in the event they work out, or to support something I think would make a difference.

I have my reasons for these low expectations, and if you want to continue on with a narrow minded view, be my guest. I choose to continue on with real facts. Facts determine how I feel and what I act on, not a false sense of hope or faith.

A lot of people have been pushed off these boards by people who can't handle a dose of reality every now and again (speaking to the last few responders). I get you're passionate about getting this game back, but getting upset at people because they think differently will accomplish nothing but diminish the pool of active supporters of the ultimate goal everyone is here for.

[Illusionss]

I've also lost some drive due to the incessant wait time with the Hail Mary CTA. There are reasons given for it's delay that while might appease most people who don't know otherwise, I have certain information I can't divulge that I believe to be one of the causes of its delay and I'm not really happy about it.

Ah, the infamous Mysterious Information That The World Is Not Yet Ready To Know.

I call bullhockey. Make with said Mysterious Information aka as "real facts," or forever be written off as just someone else trying to make trouble [and failing]. I won't hold my breath waiting.

[MakoMako]

Ah, the infamous Mysterious Information That The World Is Not Yet Ready To Know.

I call bullhockey. Make with said Mysterious Information aka as "real facts," or forever be written off as just someone else trying to make trouble [and failing]. I won't hold my breath waiting.

Calm down. For how long have we been buying that very same quote of "inside information" from Tony and Mercedes? You dismiss it here so easily just to discredit someone that you don't agree with, yet it's a-okay from people you do?

What's actually making me very sad as to where this topic has gone, is that Sleepy Wonder isn't even a nay-sayer nor troll. And yet there's already passive aggressive attacks and dismissal of his very stance on here. Anyone notice this? Sleepy did not, even once, say we shouldn't be doing anything nor is he advocating that everyone should follow him. All he's done is explain why he's lost a great deal of hope and while he -hopes- for the best, he is expecting the worst. As far as I'm concerned, that's a-okay, and I'm sure he would be very happy to be wrong.

The "inside information" he speaks of is genuine and is actually very much -known- among many people here. It doesn't bear repeating publically. I -don't- agree with Sleepy's opinion on the matter, for the record, and for the sake of everyone involved in that project and this topic, I think it's a really good idea if this thread be locked or if we drop that quote entirely and move on. This isn't a good way to keep civil, people.

[Lightslinger]

Calm down. For how long have we been buying that very same quote of "inside information" from Tony and Mercedes? You dismiss it here so easily just to discredit someone that you don't agree with, yet it's a-okay from people you do?

What's actually making me very sad as to where this topic has gone, is that Sleepy Wonder isn't even a nay-sayer nor unicorn. And yet there's already passive aggressive attacks and dismissal of his very stance on here. Anyone notice this? Sleepy did not, even once, say we shouldn't be doing anything nor is he advocating that everyone should follow him. All he's done is explain why he's lost a great deal of hope and while he -hopes- for the best, he is expecting the worst. As far as I'm concerned, that's a-okay, and I'm sure he would be very happy to be wrong.

The "inside information" he speaks of is genuine and is actually very much -known- among many people here. It doesn't bear repeating publically. I -don't- agree with Sleepy's opinion on the matter, for the record, and for the sake of everyone involved in that project and this topic, I think it's a really good idea if this thread be locked or if we drop that quote entirely and move on. This isn't a good way to keep civil, people.

It's all delivery and tone, I believe had Sleepy's point been made in a...different way, it probably would have went unnoticed.

I think as a community we DO need to take a stock of where we're at. If people want to stay dedicated to efforts like #SaveCoH and TF Hail Mary, that's perfectly fine. On the other hand, those of us who believe time has come and gone for those efforts, that's ok too.

This is where I'm at, I personally believe "legitimate" efforts to save City of Heroes are pretty much over. NCsoft has CoH cemented right where they want it and that's that.

I have faith our community will get us back in our City again. I believe we will have our own server someday, and I have hope that one of the Plan Z's will create something new. When it comes to anything that requires NCsoft's participation, for this player I have moved on.

[MakoMako]

Maybe I'm just more calloused than the average person, but I didn't find anything acidic in the way he spoke. It was blunt, yes. But nothing in there was directly insulting to anyone. But fair enough, delivery could've easily been what did it.

I've not moved on. I'm stubborn. So hopelessly stubborn in every way. I hate losing. But I also believe in the prospect that whenever someone pops up saying "This is going to fail" that, to me, sounds like something we should prove wrong to mutual benefit. Not freak out and call bullshit and overall proving to be the bigger troll.

I don't agree with Sleepy Wonder. But but these differences are what makes us a diverse community. And that's what I want to preserve.

[Segev]

Once again, I remind everybody here that we're all on the same side. If some of us are feeling down, out, or losing hope, it should not be with the firebrands of the Bolsheviks that we greet them, as if their show of insufficient zeal were a mortal betrayal. Instead, it is as wounded comrades in arms, injured in the line of duty in this emotional war of attrition. Stand with and support them; help them back from the front lines to recover. Support them however we can. If they nay-say, do not rebuke, but gently encourage.

[Lightslinger]

Once again, I remind everybody here that we're all on the same side. If some of us are feeling down, out, or losing hope, it should not be with the firebrands of the Bolsheviks that we greet them, as if their show of insufficient zeal were a mortal betrayal. Instead, it is as wounded comrades in arms, injured in the line of duty in this emotional war of attrition. Stand with and support them; help them back from the front lines to recover. Support them however we can. If they nay-say, do not rebuke, but gently encourage.

I appreciate the sentiment, but is it not OK for me to say "I'm not feeling down or wounded, I'm not losing hope. I've just come to the most realistic, for myself, conclusion and now my attention, love and support is elsewhere now."

I no longer believe #SaveCoH and TF Hail Mary's attempts to legitimately bring back CoH will work. Not for a lack of trying, it's the fact that NCsoft will not budge. That does not mean I'm in some way wounded or I've lost hope. I still have hope, its just in things where I've determined have a better chance of success.

Despite that I support anyone's efforts here to help our cause, be they with TF Hail Mary, #SaveCoH, Plan Z, Server Projects, whatever. I'm still here I just believe there are times and seasons for everything, what we do included.

[healix]

Keep the torches lit and held high, everyone......

[Segev]

I appreciate the sentiment, but is it not OK for me to say "I'm not feeling down or wounded, I'm not losing hope. I've just come to the most realistic, for myself, conclusion and now my attention, love and support is elsewhere now."

Then by all means, put that energy, attention, love, and support where you think it will best fit. Since you're still here, I do believe you when you say you still have hope for something.

I would encourage you to share that for which you do have hope, rather than focusing on what you no longer believe in. Not because it's wrong to have shifted your focus, but just because positive reasons to be excited are more what we need, in life in general as well as as a community, than negativity.

And yes, I would still say, let us not be turning on each other. We are not in this for some sort of ideological purity; we're here because we're a community. If people have found something over which to be joyful, even if it's not a direct pursuit of the community's collective stated goals, we should celebrate with them. Shared joy becomes greater.

[CG]

I have no objection to someone honestly thinking that the game won't come back.  However...

What I do expect from people is common sense, honesty and integrity. Especially from certain people in leadership positions around here. There are a lot of misinformed people on these boards due to the result of a lack of all three. Revealing this information would accomplish nothing and only serve to bring about more harm than good.

Accusations like this are damaging to the community.  Either talk to the people in question and convince them to speak up, or speak up yourself.  Casting aspersions and claiming nebulous 'secret information' is how you plant doubts.  Doubts lead to suspicion and that can be toxic.

Since either the accusations aren't true and can't be refuted or the people supposedly keeping the secrets won't speak up to refute them (because they're secret), there won't be a response. 

Please point your tin foil hat at NC Soft unless you have something concrete to bring forth about the leadership here.

[Lightslinger]

And I have in fact shared what I believe in, a lot actually. I believe the best chance at getting CoH back is in the private server initiative(s). As a person who can't code there's not a lot I can do, but in the event a server ever gets to the point where any other kind of help is needed, I'll be there.

And the Plan Z projects get my support as well. Being objective I definitely have my concerns about if its even possible to do what they're attempting, but I support the effort however I can.

[JaguarX]

Speaking of which, I hear murmors about a lot of "emulators" and or private servers" being worked on. Now, many say they are perfectly legal, and some say it's gray. It's mostly irrelevant but have a bit of relevancy in the upcoming question. Why are these so secret that even the people that it seemed to be made for have no idea who what when and where these "emulators" and or private servers are located, well that is besides SEGS which dont seem anywhere near finished yet? I mean if that is truely the best way, and I think it would be nice to have COX back even if it is in emulator and or private server or any other termed used to describe it, but what is the point if none know of their existance. Or is it something just made up to rile up the people that some view as naysayers?

I understand that some things might be or just said to be have to stay under wraps but it seem to be getting to a point where Everything is under wraps or relegated to unsubstantiated rumors that someone that know someone that know someone that know someone's uncle that know this guy in Russia that knows this Canadian that knows someone that might know something that he heard about in passing at an airport in Egypt from this guy that said he know someone's cousin that know someone dog sitter that knows someone in New York that may be working on something.

[LadyVamp]

I feel the need to address a few things here:

• Hope and Faith are what keep me going.  Without them, I would be terribly depressed about the loss of our great game.  And if that helps me, then let me be and don't try to convince me that I'm a fool.  All your doing is test your own patience.
• I hold no ill will towards anyone here.  This is clearly a very emotional subject for many here.  Let's respect each other here.
• To me, all are welcome.  Even those who think I'm a fool for having hope that our game will return in one form or another.  But if you think I'm a fool, let me live in my ignorance and I'll leave you to yours.
• The "smarter" part of me knows CoH will likely never be up again.  The "wiser" part tells me not to be so hasty in my judgment.
• And while we're on the subject of respect, keep in mind you read with YOUR emotions and not the emotions of the poster.  Please that in mind if no other thing I've said has touched base with you.

Now, all of that being said, Sleepy Wonder, it sounded to me like you were choosing to walk away.  I can't speak for anyone else here, but you're welcome to stay.

I do ask one favor of everyone here.  Clearly we're interested in getting our game back.  It is the driving force here.  Let's think about how we can succeed.  It's what our toons would do if they were flesh and blood.  So the ideas we've had so far either haven't worked or grew much bigger than we thought.  CoH wasn't built in one day and any major undertaking we do will be a mountain.  But if we stop looking at the mountain and start taking at each step one in turn, we will get there.  It will take us a long time.  Frankly, some of us won't survive the trip.  But, we will make it so long as we don't give up.

[Twisted Toon]

I feel the need to address a few things here:

• Hope and Faith are what keep me going.  Without them, I would be terribly depressed about the loss of our great game.  And if that helps me, then let me be and don't try to convince me that I'm a fool.  All your doing is test your own patience.
• I hold no ill will towards anyone here.  This is clearly a very emotional subject for many here.  Let's respect each other here.
• To me, all are welcome.  Even those who think I'm a fool for having hope that our game will return in one form or another.  But if you think I'm a fool, let me live in my ignorance and I'll leave you to yours.
• The "smarter" part of me knows CoH will likely never be up again.  The "wiser" part tells me not to be so hasty in my judgment.
• And while we're on the subject of respect, keep in mind you read with YOUR emotions and not the emotions of the poster.  Please that in mind if no other thing I've said has touched base with you.

Now, all of that being said, Sleepy Wonder, it sounded to me like you were choosing to walk away.  I can't speak for anyone else here, but you're welcome to stay.

I do ask one favor of everyone here.  Clearly we're interested in getting our game back.  It is the driving force here.  Let's think about how we can succeed.  It's what our toons would do if they were flesh and blood.  So the ideas we've had so far either haven't worked or grew much bigger than we thought.  CoH wasn't built in one day and any major undertaking we do will be a mountain.  But if we stop looking at the mountain and start taking at each step one in turn, we will get there.  It will take us a long time.  Frankly, some of us won't survive the trip.  But, we will make it so long as we don't give up.

I agree with all of this 100%.

In my life, I have seen and experienced things that others would say, "the chances of that happening are so remote as to be unpossible." Yet, miracles happen. Those memories of past miracles provides the foundation for my hope of future miracles. Its why I get right back up after the Universe slaps me down. While I have breath, I hope.

I get knocked down. but I get up again. You're never going to keep me down.

[Taceus Jiwede]

Calm down. For how long have we been buying that very same quote of "inside information" from Tony and Mercedes? You dismiss it here so easily just to discredit someone that you don't agree with, yet it's a-okay from people you do?

What's actually making me very sad as to where this topic has gone, is that Sleepy Wonder isn't even a nay-sayer nor unicorn. And yet there's already passive aggressive attacks and dismissal of his very stance on here. Anyone notice this? Sleepy did not, even once, say we shouldn't be doing anything nor is he advocating that everyone should follow him. All he's done is explain why he's lost a great deal of hope and while he -hopes- for the best, he is expecting the worst. As far as I'm concerned, that's a-okay, and I'm sure he would be very happy to be wrong.

The "inside information" he speaks of is genuine and is actually very much -known- among many people here. It doesn't bear repeating publically. I -don't- agree with Sleepy's opinion on the matter, for the record, and for the sake of everyone involved in that project and this topic, I think it's a really good idea if this thread be locked or if we drop that quote entirely and move on. This isn't a good way to keep civil, people.

*Starts a slow clap*

Sleepy, can you actually PM this info?  I don't ask to disprove or anything I am just curious and would like to see it to decide for my self.  I wont go spreading chaos don't worry, for personal knowledge only.

[Lightslinger]

Speaking of which, I hear murmors about a lot of "emulators" and or private servers" being worked on. Now, many say they are perfectly legal, and some say it's gray. It's mostly irrelevant but have a bit of relevancy in the upcoming question. Why are these so secret that even the people that it seemed to be made for have no idea who what when and where these "emulators" and or private servers are located, well that is besides SEGS which dont seem anywhere near finished yet? I mean if that is truely the best way, and I think it would be nice to have COX back even if it is in emulator and or private server or any other termed used to describe it, but what is the point if none know of their existance. Or is it something just made up to rile up the people that some view as naysayers?

I understand that some things might be or just said to be have to stay under wraps but it seem to be getting to a point where Everything is under wraps or relegated to unsubstantiated rumors that someone that know someone that know someone that know someone's uncle that know this guy in Russia that knows this Canadian that knows someone that might know something that he heard about in passing at an airport in Egypt from this guy that said he know someone's cousin that know someone dog sitter that knows someone in New York that may be working on something.

I'd imagine, if an up to date emulator is indeed being worked on, the group working on it wants as little attention as possible while they get everything set up. Until they have something up and running, and in a way that a NCsoft C&D will be meaningless, they risk everything by letting the world at large know what they're doing.

You may not have meant it this way, but your post is tearing down the idea of a private server and mocking it. If its what I've chosen to support as what I see is the best path back to CoH why does it deserve making fun of? I've said a lot I'll no longer be throwing my energy behind some projects here but I didn't disrespect those efforts either. Facts, history and precedent no longer support the idea of getting CoH away from NCsoft, what people have in those projects if faith. My faith being placed in the idea of a Community Server is no less valid. If anything precedent and history (with other games) support my faith in a reverse engineered server.

If a private server happens it will be thanks to a LOT of hard work by talented volunteers, they will (potentially) deserve our thanks, not being made fun of while they toil behind the scenes.

Edit: Before any PMs start asking me if I'm in on any private server work...I wish, ha. I know nothing about anything but SEGS, just hopeful and I keep an eye out for any hints or news about a possible, i23/24 private server. Anything I've said regarding it is pure rumor and conjecture, but dammit its my favorite kind of rumor and conjecture 

[JaguarX]

Nope not making fun of them, but your statement towards the end proves my point to the teeth.

"Anything I've said regarding it is pure rumor and conjecture."

It's like no one really knows. And if even the people the game is being made for doesnt know and only heard through a multiple sources being filtered down with no semblence of tangible evidence besides someone knowing someone that may or may not be working on it, hard to suppoert that kind of thing in any way even if it's said and done, and one finally say, "I'm here!" there might be reluctance in who is this person, is this just a trap for information, and where have they been all this time. Especially when you have people who basically seem very sure that all this is legal and anyone that say otherwise they make sure to yell them down and use the t word. Not always here but this isnt the only site I read. Meaning outside looking in, if they are that sure to the point where it's stupiud in their eyes to say it might be illegal or even gray, then why the big secreacy and worry of a C&D? Rhetorical. I know that answer. It's because in reality they dont know. But one thing they are doing though is making these projects seem a bit more shady than they really are.


It makes sense that they keep it under wraps if it's gray area of legal thing. So I guess it keeping under wraps because of the legal aspects, and wanting to avoid C&Ds means they know they would be bending the rules? If that is the case, then yes it would be best not much detail is said about it until it's too late. And even then it's risky. Napster been up and running for ages, then it went down in multimillions. But of course others cropped up. I hope when it do assuming one is being worked one somewhere and it dont turn out to be empty rumors someone ran with, it stays beneath their notice.


And as I said, I'm not making fun of anyone and even you said it's behind the scenes, you dont know yourself who is working on the private servers, and is pure rumor and conjecture. That was the whole point of my posting. Do anyone know anything for sure?