NCSoft Should Follow Example Set By EA Regarding Fan Loyalty

[TonyV]

I know what you are saying.  To me EA IS the Empire.  They pillaged Origin, Maxis, drive out the founders and creative souls of studios they buy, cheat their employees of bonuses, sequel to death any game they can and basically have a work culture of that's reminiscent of the Pharaohs of Egypt.

From what I understand, though, they have a hella awesome new Global Community Manager.

[JaguarX]

NCSoft Should Follow Example Set By EA Regarding Fan Loyalty.

To me *keywords* to me, it seems that NCSoft already been following EA's example for years. EA havent exhibited much loyalty to the fans nor employees or even to companies they aquire over the years and built an empire out of it. Compared to EA, NCSoft is an amatuer when it comes to lack of loyalty to anyone outside of themselves. 

[Osborn]

I might agree with the OP's general premise of being good to your fans, and let's be frank, I don't know enough about Ultima Online since last playing it in like 7th grade and stuff, to gauge the accuracy of how good they've been to their Ultima Online fans.

But EA is right out just as terrible as NCSoft as far as killing franchises and taking dumps all over their fans goes. Maybe they've been all kisses and hugs to their Ultima Online fans, but that's the exception for them then, not the rule.

So I might agree with your ideas there, I highly disagree with your choice of representation of those ideals.

Somehow, no matter how hard they try, I just can't see keyboards and web surfing becoming a console thing. Sure they can have the feature, but will anyone use it? As someone who has tried hooking up a PC to a big screen TV a couple of times, it feels very awkward. It's fine for reading text in video games with fonts and sizes that have been designed with couch potatoing in mind. But trying to read a website? Just, no. My eyes feel like they're bugging out trying to read an article on a screen that is 15 feet away. It's very unnatural.

And keyboards? Imagine trying to play CoH on a console. You can't very well put a mouse on your lap, so you'd need a handheld controller to actually play the game. But then everytime you want to send a message, you'd have to drop the controller and switch to the keyboard. Way, WAY too much trouble.

The difference between console and computer and between television and monitor are more or less over with now as it is, and will only continue to be that way. That's one of the reasons why when people are like "PC gaming is dead because of consoles!" and "Console gaming is dead because of PCs!", they're both 'right' and yet neither are.

As long as people like getting pre-packaged pre-baked hardware to play video games will, 'consoles' will be around, even if the next generation of them is basically just a pre-packaged computer that plugs into a 30+ inch monitor and a restrictive OS.

As for font size, people are gonna realize one day that just because you can make a clear letter the size of a gnat's nads doesn't mean that people can read it. Until then, you can use Control and + or - in most browsers to increase the size of text, and use 'medium' sized icons.

I actually have an easier time reading some things on PC games on a TV than consoles because many PC games have the ability to re size the GUI by 1.1 times or change the resolution or whatever. Something that console games have so far never gotten the hang of.

Console games might be 'designed' for 30 inch televisions 6 feet away from you, but console game designers seem to think we're all eagles that can read a 3 point anti-aliased font from that distance. And there's nothing you can do to change it. It's even worse if you're on a non HDTV, like I was when I first got my X-Box 360. But at least in MOST games on a PC on your TV you can make all that stuff bigger if you need to.

But I can't honestly say there's a realistic difference between my TV and any monitors I own anymore from a hardware standpoint, especially as I haven't cared about cable TV or over air TV programming for a decade now.

Give me a 3 dollar adapter and I could get even my 'Computer Only' monitors to display crisp television broadcasts anyways. I wouldn't even need that anymore as a lot of cable boxes now use HDMI.

[Triplash]

From what I understand, though, they have a hella awesome new Global Community Manager.

Yeah, I don't know about that guy... I heard he's got this weird thing for hats.

[Knight Light]

Somehow, no matter how hard they try, I just can't see keyboards and web surfing becoming a console thing. Sure they can have the feature, but will anyone use it? As someone who has tried hooking up a PC to a big screen TV a couple of times, it feels very awkward. It's fine for reading text in video games with fonts and sizes that have been designed with couch potatoing in mind. But trying to read a website? Just, no. My eyes feel like they're bugging out trying to read an article on a screen that is 15 feet away. It's very unnatural.

And keyboards? Imagine trying to play CoH on a console. You can't very well put a mouse on your lap, so you'd need a handheld controller to actually play the game. But then everytime you want to send a message, you'd have to drop the controller and switch to the keyboard. Way, WAY too much trouble.

Not really, that's how I played CoH the whole time I lived in Paragon City.

A number of years ago, a pastry store went out of business and as a novelty, I  bought from them a marble cafe table that resembles this one.

http://www.frenchbistrofurniture.com/product/GC531-M28/28-Marble-Color-Top-French-Brasserie-Cafe-Table.html

I found a flatscreen tv I really liked that had every connection you could need(except HDMI as it was not yet standard) and I stopped using my corner desk for computer needs. I put the big screen tv on the corner desk, brought in the cafe table, put the small pc monitor and keyboard on that and picked up a 15$ tv tray table to set the mouse, drinks and snacks upon. Even found a footrest to fit in between the two tables so I can recline a little in my captain's chair.

http://www.manchesterwood.com/solid-wood-furniture-blog/the-tv-tray-table-at-manchester-wood/

I began using the big screen to play City of Heroes and I never had any issues reading even though I suffer from astigmatism(can't see from far). It's just a matter of finding the right resolution and dpi.

Except for my first week back in 2005, I played City of Heroes using a Playstation 2 gamepad to which I mapped every function necessary(flight controls, the map, friendly and foe targeting, Follow, tray switching, etc). The only thing I needed the mouse for in combat was Inspirations and clickies like glowies and doors. The cafe table offers space enough to cradle the PS2/PC gamepad if I was just hanging around chatting, using CoH as an Instant Messenger.

Holding the gamepad in one hand and going for the mouse with the other while the keyboard is in front of me was not immediately intuitive but I very quickly adapted to it and it became second nature to me. Typing while in the middle of a brawl was common for me without losing aggro or skipping a beat.

Just because you have not found a way to do it comfortably does not mean it cannot be done comfortably. When I come sit at my computer, I feel like James Kirk sitting in his chair, with full control of the Enterprise at my fingertips.

[TimtheEnchanter]

Knight Light well a desk is one thing, but I'm talking about the stereotypical console setup, which is a guy reclining on a couch across the room from the TV set. You'd theoretically need both the keyboard and the mouse on your lap while using the controller. A tray-table can help with that, but they tend to sit higher (or is it the couch is lower?) than what is considered a comfortable setup for computer use.

Console gaming tends more towards the "instant-gratification" category. The more trouble they have to go through to setup their gaming experience, the less likely you'll hold their attention.

On the Kirk thing... gawd, forever I've wanted to design a chair with movable arms that fall on my lap and can hold peripherals. I've played Battlefield, so I have a bit of a similar dilemma on my computer desk with that game. I've got the joystick sitting right next to the mouse pad. I spent half of my time flying in those games so I was switching between the mouse and joystick all the time. Fortunately it wasn't too much of a hassle because I only needed to do the switching with one hand. I think what I see as a big nuisance with the console scenario, is to be holding a 2-handed gamepad and have to actually put it down on the table every time I want to type something.

[Knight Light]

I think what I see as a big nuisance with the console scenario, is to be holding a 2-handed gamepad and have to actually put it down on the table every time I want to type something.

You don't really have to, my set up is only one option. Here's one for the couch potato;

http://www.everythingusb.com/veho-mimi-wireless-gamepad-keyboard-21003.html

Here's a couple for the PS3:

http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=M05812

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3093/2800796784_b7a629ccfb.jpg

This issue was even tackled back during the Gamecube's generation:

http://nintendo.wikia.com/wiki/ASCII_Keyboard_Controller

Options; YAY!

[johnrobey]

Regarding NCSoft's decision in not only shutting down the game, but closing Paragon studios, they've completely disinvested themselves in the western market, regardless of their use of 'Blade & Soul' to try to appeal to customers over here - which means they'll sit on their copyrights to City of Heroes till it expires - in which time the concept of City of Heroes will be buried in history, obsolete and forgotten.

(With apologies to LadyShin for cutting the rest of her fine post) Unless and until I succumb to Alzheimer's, coma or death, I shall NEVER forget City of Heroes, the Rogue Isles or Praetoria, nor the CoX community before and after "sunset."  (Bleh, i hate that euphemism.)  /em holdtorch

PS. Can we have an /em holdtorch added to the line of emoticons, please?

[TimtheEnchanter]

This issue was even tackled back during the Gamecube's generation:

http://nintendo.wikia.com/wiki/ASCII_Keyboard_Controller

I can't stand portables, so tiny keyboards with buttons half the size of my thumb drive me crazy. But I really like this Gamecube concept, and what that could easily be turned into if taken further. That thing is 'almost' a cockpit flight control layout, with a joystick/throttle on either side.

[LadyShin]

(With apologies to LadyShin for cutting the rest of her fine post) Unless and until I succumb to Alzheimer's, coma or death, I shall NEVER forget City of Heroes, the Rogue Isles or Praetoria, nor the CoX community before and after "sunset."  (Bleh, i hate that euphemism.)  /em holdtorch

PS. Can we have an /em holdtorch added to the line of emoticons, please?

I was quite partial to the /protest, myself.



Although, the morality icon would work great too!



(read the icon formation )

[johnrobey]

@>@  Thank you for the purdy pictures, LadyShin!!  Yes, I agree the Morality stances also fit this well as does /protest.  I personally dug /em holdtorch since it was the closest to a virtual candle light vigil, and besides the notion of "carrying a torch" for CoH resonated with me also.   

[LadyShin]

  I found something nifty in google, if you're looking for something that was posted in the City of Heroes forums originally, Google -MAY- have a cached "snapshot" of it. many pages I've seen (including my character pic) were posted there. Google had a "snapshot" of the page dated back to November, before the shutdown.

[Osborn]

Knight Light well a desk is one thing, but I'm talking about the stereotypical console setup, which is a guy reclining on a couch across the room from the TV set. You'd theoretically need both the keyboard and the mouse on your lap while using the controller. A tray-table can help with that, but they tend to sit higher (or is it the couch is lower?) than what is considered a comfortable setup for computer use.

With a wireless mouse and keyboard and a good foldable tray table, you can get a decent set up that can fold away when you don't need it. You can probably get something to swing over you like a breakfast in bed thing that you could set to the left or right of your chair. Though you'd want to sit up a bit anyways to play video games or to use the keyboard for ergonomic reasons either way.

If you got a PS3 controller, you can download the MotioninJoy DS3 tool to emulate drivers to make the computer think that your PS3 controller is a X-Box 360 controller. Or alternatively a X-Box 360 controller for Windows works just as well if you happen to have one of those. Takes a bit of time to get used to remembering that say, Triangle is Y, but after that, it works like a charm for most games that are controller compatible. MotioninJoy's DS3 tool is free.

Console gaming tends more towards the "instant-gratification" category. The more trouble they have to go through to setup their gaming experience, the less likely you'll hold their attention.

Eh, I somewhat disagree with this, or the idea that PC gaming is all high brow and Console gaming is just quick fart jokes and twitch games. That might had been true in 1991, but largely isn't now. For the most part, most games are available on many consoles and computer types equally, and I mostly just buy whichever version happens to be cheaper at the time.

On the Kirk thing... gawd, forever I've wanted to design a chair with movable arms that fall on my lap and can hold peripherals.

I'm absolutely certain you can buy one, and if not, it's really just a hinge.

I've played Battlefield, so I have a bit of a similar dilemma on my computer desk with that game. I've got the joystick sitting right next to the mouse pad. I spent half of my time flying in those games so I was switching between the mouse and joystick all the time. Fortunately it wasn't too much of a hassle because I only needed to do the switching with one hand. I think what I see as a big nuisance with the console scenario, is to be holding a 2-handed gamepad and have to actually put it down on the table every time I want to type something.

In most games there's voice chat anymore, so why would you need to type anything?

I mean, I guess you might be very shy. I can relate to that. That might make it more difficult.

That's part of why I liked CoH. There wasn't a lot of need for communication for a good team to function. Anybody with at least 5 hours of game play under their belt knew their roles and how to function at it.

[Taceus Jiwede]

Now, if I can watch videos, surf the web, do my online banking, etc, then maybe I'd be in.
But, until they do, I guess my old Madden will have to suffice.

You can do all of those except online banking.  PS3 has a web surfing app, and consoles have been able to play videos from PS 1, most consoles these days you can actually use Youtube, Netflix, Hulu you name it.  If your phone can do it, current consoles can do it too with the exception of online banking apps, which you could just do with the web surfing app.  They have key boards for consoles already too, they are small like a wii controller so you can more or less "text" on them. 

For the OP: I have to agree with the mass here.  EA is in my book of "evil publishers" they tie for first with NCsoft.  The funny thing is in Game Informer 2012 Edition EA won best publisher of the year award and got 2nd the year before. 

[TimtheEnchanter]

In most games there's voice chat anymore, so why would you need to type anything?

I mean, I guess you might be very shy. I can relate to that. That might make it more difficult.

That's part of why I liked CoH. There wasn't a lot of need for communication for a good team to function. Anybody with at least 5 hours of game play under their belt knew their roles and how to function at it.

Well, there's still the inability to keep up with 5 conversations at once. There was the team channel, global, LFG, CapeRadio, etc. SWG had voice chat, and I used it, but I still needed to type for the other channels I was on.

[The Fifth Horseman]

There's a small but crucial difference here. NCSoft has shut down an active MMO with a thriving community. As I understand, many of the games EA has shut down servers for were primarily single-player titles and as such are still playable in single player mode.

I found something nifty in google, if you're looking for something that was posted in the City of Heroes forums originally, Google -MAY- have a cached "snapshot" of it. many pages I've seen (including my character pic) were posted there. Google had a "snapshot" of the page dated back to November, before the shutdown.

Watch out - they expire after some time, so you better grab the ones you want ASAP (also: Archive.org has a complete copy of the forums, just FYI)

[JaguarX]

There's a small but crucial difference here. NCSoft has shut down an active MMO with a thriving community. As I understand, many of the games EA has shut down servers for were primarily single-player titles and as such are still playable in single player mode.Watch out - they expire after some time, so you better grab the ones you want ASAP (also: Archive.org has a complete copy of the forums, just FYI)

yep but hard to keep the online community when it's offline and single player only. They will be doing what we are doing. steaming their own online community has been crushed. The difference being they can still play the single player. That difference isnt publishing but the nature of the two type of games they create. MMO, vs console.

[Taceus Jiwede]

Judging by UO though.  I would have to guess that EA probably wouldn't pull the plug on a MMO.  UO is a ghost town and just shadow on the wall of its old self.  But the servers still run, and expansions still come out.  DAoC is still running too and I believe EA own them.  They did kill off Earth & Beyond though.  So maybe not. I dunno. Sometimes I don't hear my self think.

[CraZboy]

I was a HUGE Ultima addict .. I mean .. I spent hours and hours .. playing on my Commodore 64 ..
But then, EA took over Origin, and for someone very loyal to a game, you can tell the difference.
With EAs takeover, I tried UO .. I lasted a day at most.

EA took over Westwood.  I was a average player of the CnC line .. but, again EA had to put their hands in the game,
... it never recovered

And of course, EAs closure of Earth and Beyond, my second MMO .. well, screw them.
These guys have no sence of business .. remember how many bands sued them because they "forgot" to get the rights to the music they used on their Football game?
EA is another company like NCSoft .. "SCREW THE PLAYERS .. lets just pretend that we are interested in their needs, and once we have all the money, we will piss them off and we will just sit here and laugh at them cause we have the control .. " or something like that .. they are motivated by $$$$$$

Westwood Studios, Origin, Paragon, and many other studios .. they should find the resources to publish their own stuff.  I know its expensive, but, these studios were all gamers making games for gamers .. and as soon as they get corporate support all hell breaks loose.

We don't play Guild Wars, or Aion.  Yeah we crap on those games, I do, and I do feel guilty.  These games are just published by NC .. there are hard people in studios similar to Westwood, or Paragon, working on trying to make their vision come to life.

City of Heroes had that .. with Cryptic Studios .. I believe that if Cryptic still owned City of Heroes, we would still be playing today.

EA sucks .. its always sucked, it will always suck!  My 2 cents

[Aggelakis]

City of Heroes had that .. with Cryptic Studios .. I believe that if Cryptic still owned City of Heroes, we would still be playing today.

I honestly, highly doubt that. And this is speaking as someone who admires Cryptic to a small degree.