Speculation: Could CoH go to Nexon?

[Lucretia MacEvil]

Admittedly, all I know about NCsoft and Nexon comes from playing CoH and reading these boards (and various linked articles).

From what I've read, Nexon is much more invested in western markets, has more of a focus on marketing, doesn't develop its own games much, and has a business association (partnership of sorts?) with NCsoft.  I've also read that the larger part of NCsoft's "realignment of company focus" is focusing much more on the eastern market. 

Assuming these facts are correct, why the heck wouldn't all parties involved consider it a good idea for the CoH IP to be sold to Nexon?

From Nexon's point of view:  The game is well developed already.  With a little marketing, it could be really big, since superheros are popular due to Hollywood.  It's primarily a western game, so it's our type, plus we're already familiar with current owner NCsoft, so it shouldn't be too hard to find out what they want and negotiate with them.

From NCsoft's point of view:  We could get some extra funds for further game development.  We're mostly pulling out of the western market anyway, and not selling the IP would hurt even our limited future in the western market.  On the other hand, allowing the game to continue under Nexon (with whom we are associated) would remove any further costs of game development and help our PR tremendously, along with further cementing positive relations between our businesses.

From the Community's point of view:  We get to keep the game!!!  It gets advertised now!!!!  Nexon actually cares about the western market!!!  Awesomeness!!! 

Again, this assumes my facts are correct.  Any and all ruthless fact-checking would be greatly appreciated.

[Omega Mark V]

Not to mention Valve is somewhat associated with Nexon, through games like Vindictus and such. Maplestory being on Steam, etc.

I've been hoping something like what you've stated would happen. Only time will tell.

... Maybe we should start emailing Nexon?

[QuantumHero]

Admittedly, all I know about NCsoft and Nexon comes from playing CoH and reading these boards (and various linked articles).

From what I've read, Nexon is much more invested in western markets, has more of a focus on marketing, doesn't develop its own games much, and has a business association (partnership of sorts?) with NCsoft.  I've also read that the larger part of NCsoft's "realignment of company focus" is focusing much more on the eastern market. 

Assuming these facts are correct, why the heck wouldn't all parties involved consider it a good idea for the CoH IP to be sold to Nexon?

From Nexon's point of view:  The game is well developed already.  With a little marketing, it could be really big, since superheros are popular due to Hollywood.  It's primarily a western game, so it's our type, plus we're already familiar with current owner NCsoft, so it shouldn't be too hard to find out what they want and negotiate with them.

From NCsoft's point of view:  We could get some extra funds for further game development.  We're mostly pulling out of the western market anyway, and not selling the IP would hurt even our limited future in the western market.  On the other hand, allowing the game to continue under Nexon (with whom we are associated) would remove any further costs of game development and help our PR tremendously, along with further cementing positive relations between our businesses.

From the Community's point of view:  We get to keep the game!!!  It gets advertised now!!!!  Nexon actually cares about the western market!!!  Awesomeness!!! 

Again, this assumes my facts are correct.  Any and all ruthless fact-checking would be greatly appreciated.

NCsoft should *take* the "face-saving" opportunity to do this.  I would find it hard to believe this was the original intention but this game is the casual gamer's MMO...Nexxon does casual gaming, make a phone or tablet tie in or even a simplified tablet version of coh and actually advertise a little and we could really go places...then launch an actual COH2. 

I don't think this was ever the original intent but if Nexon were to partner with what remains of paragon, the community, or maybe their own people (big shoes to fill and still feeling bad for our devs) I would be willing to maintain my VIP subscription and see where things went.

It would be difficult to justify buying any paragon points but I would stay subscribed and give them a chance to earn my trust back.

[JaguarX]

Admittedly, all I know about NCsoft and Nexon comes from playing CoH and reading these boards (and various linked articles).

From what I've read, Nexon is much more invested in western markets, has more of a focus on marketing, doesn't develop its own games much, and has a business association (partnership of sorts?) with NCsoft.  I've also read that the larger part of NCsoft's "realignment of company focus" is focusing much more on the eastern market. 

Assuming these facts are correct, why the heck wouldn't all parties involved consider it a good idea for the CoH IP to be sold to Nexon?

From Nexon's point of view:  The game is well developed already.  With a little marketing, it could be really big, since superheros are popular due to Hollywood.  It's primarily a western game, so it's our type, plus we're already familiar with current owner NCsoft, so it shouldn't be too hard to find out what they want and negotiate with them.

From NCsoft's point of view:  We could get some extra funds for further game development.  We're mostly pulling out of the western market anyway, and not selling the IP would hurt even our limited future in the western market.  On the other hand, allowing the game to continue under Nexon (with whom we are associated) would remove any further costs of game development and help our PR tremendously, along with further cementing positive relations between our businesses.

From the Community's point of view:  We get to keep the game!!!  It gets advertised now!!!!  Nexon actually cares about the western market!!!  Awesomeness!!! 

Again, this assumes my facts are correct.  Any and all ruthless fact-checking would be greatly appreciated.

Maybe it's just me but I find it hard to believe that Nexon didnt know about the shutdown and may have or may have not jumped to try and get the IP. Then again, without all the details, who knows. It might make perfect sense if we had even 10% of the details. But we dont, and we must go by the information we do have.

"Only thing that is more annoying than a hurtful truth or a lie is silence."-a friend.

[zybron]

Another way to look at this series of events could be that Nexon is planning on doing something superhero related and had it's good buddy NCSoft shut down their primary competition before their product comes to market.

[Lucretia MacEvil]

Another way to look at this series of events could be that Nexon is planning on doing something superhero related and had it's good buddy NCSoft shut down their primary competition before their product comes to market.

But why do all that work when there's already a well-developed game with a dedicated fan base?

[zybron]

Because they aren't the same company. There's not even a partnership between them. However, if one could convince the other to ditch a potential competing product without doing anything more drastic than investing in the other, that seems like a valuable investment. It's just as much speculation as the OP, of course, so neither scenario could be anywhere close to reality.

[Turjan]

Point for:
Nexon do look like a logical choice to take over the running of CoH (they run Maple Story, they're pioneers of the F2P system, etc etc...), and their involvement would, of course, also nicely explain why NCSoft don't seem interested in offers from outside for the CoH IP - as Nexon and NCSoft are buddies now, NCSoft could just cold shoulder any offer then *ping!* just effectively hand over the IP to Nexon and claim Nexon had "made the offer that promised the most for the future direction of both companies" or some other such corporate waffle.

Point against:
Timing. When you close an MMO, there's always a legal wind down thing - the 'sunsetting' period. Fine, if you're closing the game for good, but not clever if your intention is to close it just so it can be immediately reopened again. This is because as the 'sunset' time is ticking away, NCSoft is losing players to other games, and alienating the ones who remain by their continued silence and fluff statements. Why close the game at all? Cryptic's Star Trek Online used to be run by Atari, but they hoofed the operation over to Perfect World to run instead, and the game never skipped a beat.

Closing with a view to developing CoH2 makes even less sense - look at Guild Wars.
When CoH was shut down, Guild Wars was bringing in less money for NCSoft than CoH was...but there was no way they'd close GW when GW2 was due out - that would tick off the GW community pretty badly. The fact that they didn't give a stuff about offending the CoH community speaks volumes about their regard both for the IP and the playerbase I think.

Could the CoH IP be sold to Nexon so they could develop CoH2?
Not likely - remember, of the two companies, it's NCSoft that is the more successful developer, so why get the weaker of the two partners to develop a sequel? Better for NCSoft to keep the IP, develop CoH2, then have Nexon market and run it...but if that was the plan, it would be more logical to maintain player interest by keeping the original going until such a sequel was released. Just like Guild Wars.

No, basically I think that while the question of Nexon running CoH is a very sensible and valid one, the answer is moot because the only logical time to get Nexon in to run CoH was while the game was still running. If you wait til after the game is closed (or even after you've announced that the game is closing), you've already lost far more than you could claw back by keeping CoH alive under new management.

[JaguarX]

Point for:
Nexon do look like a logical choice to take over the running of CoH (they run Maple Story, they're pioneers of the F2P system, etc etc...), and their involvement would, of course, also nicely explain why NCSoft don't seem interested in offers from outside for the CoH IP - as Nexon and NCSoft are buddies now, NCSoft could just cold shoulder any offer then *ping!* just effectively hand over the IP to Nexon and claim Nexon had "made the offer that promised the most for the future direction of both companies" or some other such corporate waffle.

Point against:
Timing. When you close an MMO, there's always a legal wind down thing - the 'sunsetting' period. Fine, if you're closing the game for good, but not clever if your intention is to close it just so it can be immediately reopened again. This is because as the 'sunset' time is ticking away, NCSoft is losing players to other games, and alienating the ones who remain by their continued silence and fluff statements. Why close the game at all? Cryptic's Star Trek Online used to be run by Atari, but they hoofed the operation over to Perfect World to run instead, and the game never skipped a beat.

Closing with a view to developing CoH2 makes even less sense - look at Guild Wars.
When CoH was shut down, Guild Wars was bringing in less money for NCSoft than CoH was...but there was no way they'd close GW when GW2 was due out - that would tick off the GW community pretty badly. The fact that they didn't give a stuff about offending the CoH community speaks volumes about their regard both for the IP and the playerbase I think.

Could the CoH IP be sold to Nexon so they could develop CoH2?
Not likely - remember, of the two companies, it's NCSoft that is the more successful developer, so why get the weaker of the two partners to develop a sequel? Better for NCSoft to keep the IP, develop CoH2, then have Nexon market and run it...but if that was the plan, it would be more logical to maintain player interest by keeping the original going until such a sequel was released. Just like Guild Wars.

No, basically I think that while the question of Nexon running CoH is a very sensible and valid one, the answer is moot because the only logical time to get Nexon in to run CoH was while the game was still running. If you wait til after the game is closed (or even after you've announced that the game is closing), you've already lost far more than you could claw back by keeping CoH alive under new management.

Maybe they are trying to use the GM- Camaro strategy. Remember in the early 2000s, they discontinued the Camaro and man, were alot of people pissed. Many of the people usually buy the Camaro each year went to the Mustang, who's sales went from very good to great during the time in the absence of the Camaro. Then the new style Camaro brought back the name, although die hard Trans-AM fans was left hanging due to the demise of Pontiac as a whole. While the new Camaro turned out popular and started to outsell the Mustang, some say that it wouldnt even be a close race in sales if the Camaro wasnt discontinued in the first place when many switched to Mustang. Many returned, many people who never bought a Camaor in the past found the new one pleasing, but some ex-Camaro buyers ended up sticking with the Mustang.

Maybe NCSoft is trying to pull the same tactic.

[Victoria Victrix]

But more likely they are vultures that refuse to get off the rotting corpses of the games they kill.

They have not brought back ONE SINGLE GAME they have killed.

[SkyStreak]

But more likely they are vultures that refuse to get off the rotting corpses of the games they kill.

They have not brought back ONE SINGLE GAME they have killed.

That's true, but CoH is the first game they killed that wasn't already at risk of dying. 

[Quinch]

That's true, but CoH is the first game they killed that wasn't already at risk of dying.

Wasn't Tabula Rasa working in the black? It hadn't paid off the development costs when they pulled the pen, but I'm not sure how many MMOs do right off the bat.

[downix]

Wasn't Tabula Rasa working in the black? It hadn't paid off the development costs when they pulled the pen, but I'm not sure how many MMOs do right off the bat.

It was pulling in about $6 mil annual. The problem with TR was the whole fiasco of RG. I know I held off purchase when that went down, it smelled fishy.

[Kaiser Tarantula]

But more likely they are vultures that refuse to get off the rotting corpses of the games they kill.

They have not brought back ONE SINGLE GAME they have killed.

This is my sentiments exactly.  NC's never done anything but squat on the IPs they've discontinued development or publishing on.

We've seen no evidence of them doing anything differently this time; in fact, we've seen plenty of evidence that they're doing the exact same thing again.  Stone-wall silence and impenetrable customer relations (please pardon my loose usage of the term) until everyone forgets about it and moves on.  We are being treated to classic NCsoft closure behavior here.

The difference between us and the patrons of all the other games they've killed is that we're snarlier about it and harder to shake off.

As for the Richard Garriott/Tabula Rasa debacle, NC brought that on themselves by trying to forge statements of resignation from RG.  They deserved the legal kick-in-the-pants they got on account of that.  A shame, really, 'cuz Tabula Rasa looked like it might've been the game that beat Anarchy Online in my books as "best ground sci-fi MMORPG."

[Rotten Luck]

Makes me wonder if the Phoenix Project works.  Should we try other titles.  But of course that's a Very Very long way off.  Five years at least from my mental reckoning.

[therain93]

Maybe they are trying to use the GM- Camaro strategy. Remember in the early 2000s, they discontinued the Camaro and man, were alot of people pissed. Many of the people usually buy the Camaro each year went to the Mustang, who's sales went from very good to great during the time in the absence of the Camaro. Then the new style Camaro brought back the name, although die hard Trans-AM fans was left hanging due to the demise of Pontiac as a whole. While the new Camaro turned out popular and started to outsell the Mustang, some say that it wouldnt even be a close race in sales if the Camaro wasnt discontinued in the first place when many switched to Mustang. Many returned, many people who never bought a Camaor in the past found the new one pleasing, but some ex-Camaro buyers ended up sticking with the Mustang.

Maybe NCSoft is trying to pull the same tactic.

I think you give them way too much credit to be planning that, sorry.

[BryanSnowden]

Well, I found this
http://www.thisisgame.com/en/2012/08/01/ncsoft-formed-a-strategic-partnership-with-gree
While digging around last night this morning...

NCsoft signed on MOU agreement with GREE to develop/service mobile games by using IP from NCsoft such as Lineage. According to the report, Lineage mobile will be available within the year through Gree platform.

NCsoft expects co-developing great games by combining famous IP from NCsoft and mobile social game knowhow from Gree. Gree expects cooperating with NCsoft at the global market in the future as well.

emphasis on "famous IP" = mine 

Although, I also found http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-09-21-gree-looks-to-the-future

GREE: "The traditional PC will disappear"

And several more saying "Nuh-uha" (in more words)...

The best example of a real demand for PC gaming I've seen lately is this:
 http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-10-18-chris-roberts-star-citizen-goes-kickstarter

Not so much that article = but the whole Roberts Space Industries idea games(s) overall,
With the Kickstarter article being a great way to show a concrete demand for a genre that was long thought to be a dead "niche game" too expensive & not popular enough to risk making...  Although we're taking about Chris Roberts
AKA = ("Sir"/(or "Dr."?) Wing Commander) here!

And, IIRC from watching the long video "pitch" - he *has* had some degree of 'more traditional' private investments, but He gave the general feeling that he wasn't going to have his project "owned" by someone else = It's gonna be "HIS" baby/ then to a lesser extent the players = "ours", but not any "Shareholders" expecting profit/dividends coming their way.

[Rotten Luck]

Hmm wonder if they be willing to join forces.  Both games funded by Crowd and Gamer driven.

The way I see it is this.  Hand helds are for the quick game for a little time on break, that time when you are riding a bus or on a plane.  The games are like the classic games quick easy fun and addictive.  But not engaging.

The PC games like one other poster said are becoming big time things.  Interactive stories spanning perhaps multiple issues.  (Mass Effect 1,2,3 and the Halo franchise) Big huge production High end powerful graphics.  No matter how powerful a hand held is they would never meet that level of output with out getting so hot it burning.  Now I see Mult-platform games.  Games that have the Core in a PC, hand held mini-games that affect the Core (WOW Done this I believe with an app that lets you buy and sell in the action house.)  Perhaps even involve that old TV thing I never watch.  Play an epic raid with friends and watch a Cinematic version of that same Raid on a Replay on the T.V. 

Then you have those who's T.V. collecting dust because I do all my show watching stream or download on the PC.  True that can be done on handheld but then what do I use to eat popcorn with?

Those that say it's the death of the PC have a very narrow mind of what a PC is today and evolving into. 

[JaguarX]

I think you give them way too much credit to be planning that, sorry.

probably

[BryanSnowden]

So I found this today:
http://www.joystiq.com/2012/10/23/rumor-zynga-boston-austin-chicago-closing-down/

I love it... all this "Death of PC Gaming" is once again, much like it was when they said 'Consoles are going to Kill PC Gaming' - STILL complete B.S. - And, I know B.S. = Hell, I am "B.S." - so to speak...   

I'm betting it's a fad & when most people get sick of playing super-simple games (when they're supposed to be working/studying/?) People are going to slowly go back and start using their phones for phone calls & maybe for listening to mp3s *maybe*.
 And using their iPads, and Tablets for... IDK? = web surfing (once Flash or whatever replaces it runs reliably), Google-ing stuff,  things they need to be online to look up but don't want to fire up a PC, or get charged for stupid web-ads against a data-plan limit/contract = googling on their smartphones.
Like, Checking what movies are showing at the theater, & at what time, maybe reserving/pre-purchasing tickets?  OR maybe watching movies via Netflix or the like = Skipping the theater all together?

Gaming on these things will *once again* mostly be people playing the latest "Angry Birds" game, or remakes of Tetris, Solitaire/FreeCell, Mahjong, Scrabble, whatever... is simple and free - while trying to pass the time waiting on _you name it_ , traveling/commuting, etc.
Most People, won't be paying to play anything on Mobile Platforms/OS'es - Heck, there are a bunch of people already balking at Windows 8 -> Testers = young & old, Software Devs, and people that just got used to Windows 7 - if that...

Some folks are still fine/happy with XP & have the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" attitude about OS'es & their Comic-Book Super Hero/Villain/Rogue MMO's = we don't want "the new one" = from whoever, Not everyone is all about the "Latest and Greatest" Game/Program/Hardware/Etc.
And all the people they conned into believing that this phenomena is/was a 'truism' are gonna 'lose their shirts' investment-wise...
  *I'm seeing crowds w/ Pitchforks & Torches in their futures!* 

[Turjan]

Indeed, it's all a matter of "Ooh, the shiny is SO shiny it blinds!" as is so often the case whenever new tech comes along.

The explosion of smartphone use is huge, so understandably the games companies have all jumped on that bandwagon. And because 90% of their attention is taken up with the world of their current projects and target market, it's also understandable that we keep hearing this mantra of "PC games are dead!" over and over, like a schoolkid who's dizzy-crazy with a new toy who thinks all their previous toys are now trash.

When the first home consoles arrived in the 1980s, the same folk of the day said "You can't play games on a PC!". And then when PC games really took off, the same folk said "Consoles? Bah, you can't upgrade them like PCs, consoles are yesterday!". And when the Xbox 360 and PS3 came along, yes, the same folk said "PC gaming is dead, man!". So big shock - when it becomes apparent that smartphones have the capacity to play games, the modern incarnations of that same voice are bawling "PC gaming is dead, dude!"

The truth of PC gaming today is that the reason it's reached the plateau it has is because it physically can't get any higher without starting a colony on the Moon or somesuch. The market is 100% saturated. To say "Look, it's not going up, it must be stagnant! The end of PC games is nigh!" is crazy talk.

But talking crazy is what shiny-obsessed companies do. And when this latest shiny wears off, they'll no doubt be chanting "Smartphones are shallow man, if you want a real game it's gotta be PC!"

[Victoria Victrix]

Here is where I relate the "graying of America" talk Larry and I had.

Us old farts can't SEE what's on the phone screen half the time.  No, seriously, why would we want to give ourselves a headache to have alleged fun?  Tetris good.  Sidescrollers bad.  Free good.  Pay for a headache bad.

Us old farts are buying BIG monitors so we can sit way back from them in a recliner with a keyboard on our laps.  Think I'm kidding?  That's my office setup.  Zero-g recliner, keyboard on my lap, two big monitors, one for work/games, the other for chat programs.

Us old farts grew up with comic books and the very first video games.  I was 22 when Pong came out, and it was a bar sensation.  It is a well known fact that once you get over 50, nostalgia for the stuff you did when you were younger hits you, and you want to recollect all those toys you had, and recreate the memories you had.  We are only just starting to see those people come back to the PC games they played in their 20s.  Why do you think the emulators for the old standalone games are so popular?  It's not just because the games are free or cheap.  I actually predict a surge in users of Everquest and Ultima, and watch the "old" games cascade from there as people go back to their favorite games again.

Us old farts are losing our hand/eye coordination.  A lot of us can't play the newest console games, nor even the twitchier PC games.  But we want to play.

Us old farts have a lot more free time, especially those of us who are retired.  But we're on budgets.  Even a $15/month subscription is cheaper than cable with all the channels, and there's way less crap.

Us old farts have friends and family scattered around the country, and what with the economy being what it is, gas prices being what they are, the kids needing to work two jobs or both parents working, we don't get to physically see the kids and grandkids.  But having family-friendly PC games we can play with the grandkids at least--maybe the whole family and a couple friends on the same team?  That's a no-brainer.  And it's harder for us old farts to do that with console games than it is with PC games (hand/eye thing, and the TV is a lot farther away than the monitor is).

[houtex]

37" monitor and a microfiber reclining office chair here, myself, VV.  But who's nit-pickin'.

/I'm not old... in my head.  My body, unfortunately, has other ideas, and I associate with a lot of that post.
//Dammit.  Truthiness sucks sometimes.