The Shot Heard Around Paragon City - SCORE Public Release

[ChaosMatrix]

Folks a flowchart was kept on who invited who and a leak would get you and all those in your cells - banned.

This was not an Alpha testing environment - it was a secret server. It has even been modified to have new power sets. You say testing for stability - for 6 years? I am not holding them up as heroes - just humans. Instead of coming to the community - they cowered in fear. They lived for 6 years in fear - the brave dies but once and the coward every day. I probaby let too much info out when I was trying and these folks let too little out.

I can't help but wonder - did the game purchase die because someone gave them the code? The way it completely went silent - I have to wonder did these folks get the software and say - well why buy the cow we can get the milk for free?

It is my understanding that Leandros received everything he needed to get the server working up to the point it was before it closed. If anything any bug fixes and added content was just over what already existed in the game prior to its demise. I find it hard to believe that it took them 6 years to have it "in working order" for the public.

[TheBeatnik]

This may be a worthless post, as there is really nothing of substance that I can add to the conversation. I'm as stunned as everyone by the recent news, and, probably like everyone else,
am still processing my feelings as I race to catch up on the story and the conversation.

What I do feel, right now, is sadness.
It hit me as I reread my previous activity on this forum, just 22 posts, all within a year or so of shutdown.
I was *so* hopeful back then. Even now, rereading the plans we made, I get a tangible sense that we felt
the possibility of doing something amazing, something ridiculously against all odds.

And I think that's what hurts now. Seven years ago, we were, all of us, heroes together.
And today, seven years seems an eternity away.

What pushes me past the sadness is the faith, foolish or not, that the community of CoH players is not yet over. We may be scattered,
in the wilderness, divided, but better days are ahead. Ship of Heroes has announced an end of the year beta, City of Titans continues to progress,
and Paragon Chat continues to be available when I absolutely have to go home.
Until then, I think I'll go back to lurking, and to appreciating a community that is, quite a lot of the time, far more knowledgeable and
eloquent than I could ever hope to be.

Regards,
The Beatnik

[Taceus Jiwede]

I really do think something good is going to come of all of this.

I don't want to jinx anything, but I'm feeling shockingly optimistic? Which is a pretty new sensation for me. I'm, like... excited? Everyone is so busy fighting, and I'm over here just doing a happy dance that the game is still alive somewhere, somehow.

*knocks on wood*

Well I am happy that you are happy :)

[Eiko-chan]

I agree that it may well prove that the secrecy was unnecessary, but NCSoft has a bad record in this area, at best, and I somehow doubt they're very happy that someone else has account data. Had you been in the room, would you not have taken all possible measures to ensure that NCSoft never laid a hand on this data?

Character data isn't account data. And NCSoft already has its hands on account data, so your question doesn't even make sense.

NCSoft are petty bastards, but your assessment of their litigiousness requires evidence. Tabula Rasa does not a rule make.

[TonyV]

I can't help but wonder - did the game purchase die because someone gave them the code?

No. The two teams working on these two efforts were completely separate. As far as I know, there were no members in common between the two, except possibly short, technical advisory conversations.

[Taceus Jiwede]

I would have to imagine even if Downix knew about the Private Server he probably knew how bad it would look for City of Titans and the purchase attempt if he was found anywhere near it.

[Ironwolf]

No. The two teams working on these two efforts were completely separate. As far as I know, there were no members in common between the two, except possibly short, technical advisory conversations.

So, then the logical question follows - did the SCoRE team approach the potential buyers and say - hey we got the code - just try and buy the rights - never mind the software? You see once they had purchased the rights to the game - if they got a running copy of it - how they did it would be moot. This is just so shady at this point with people saying - nope I never knew - then saying - well I did know but didn't play. Others saying well I played but felt bad and quit and so on trying to deflect.

[Ironwolf]

I would have to imagine even if Downix knew about the Private Server he probably knew how bad it would look for City of Titans and the purchase attempt if he was found anywhere near it.

Well Downix did bail on it and distance himself from it. He was working on Titan and only worked the first part to introduce people to the NCSoft folks. On the second purchase attempt.

[ABagOfCandy]

I've been lurking on this forum for years hoping the game would come back and I find out this morning it was around all along!? Not gonna lie, I'm bummed more that my lack of activity on forums about this could have been the main reason I haven't been able to play it. Not saying I'm thrilled that it was super exclusive, but I get it. Fingers crossed something more than a total shutdown comes out of this. I want nothing more than to play that freakin game again XD I haven't been able to find a game I WANT to play recently and my hopes are crushed by games I was excited for.

[Crimsanotic]

That doesn't sound like "nope, never gonna happen, sorry lol gottem". Could SCoRE have turned to evil over time? I suppose it's possible, though I don't really believe it myself. But to suggest it began with evil intent as far back as a month after the closing is disingenuous.

You're also taking the word of people who lied to you as if it were truth.

[Taceus Jiwede]

Well Downix did bail on it and distance himself from it. He was working on Titan and only worked the first part to introduce people to the NCSoft folks. On the second purchase attempt.

Oh right.  Good point, the details have become a little hazy with time and I forgot he passed it off entirely to the "purchase team" and they are (as far as I know) completely anonymous to most of us.

I've been lurking on this forum for years hoping the game would come back and I find out this morning it was around all along!? Not gonna lie, I'm bummed more that my lack of activity on forums about this could have been the main reason I haven't been able to play it. Not saying I'm thrilled that it was super exclusive, but I get it. Fingers crossed something more than a total shutdown comes out of this. I want nothing more than to play that freakin game again XD I haven't been able to find a game I WANT to play recently and my hopes are crushed by games I was excited for.

I don't think Titan forums really were the secret breeding ground for this server.  I was pretty active here in the first few years after the shutdown and as the activity of the forum died down so did my visits.  I obviously didn't know any of the right people involved but I don't think they met through these forums(maybe one or two).  I would wager the people who visit this forum and also played, were already friends with someone in the "know" from pretty early on.

[therain93]

Character data isn't account data. And NCSoft already has its hands on account data, so your question doesn't even make sense.

NCSoft are petty bastards, but your assessment of their litigiousness requires evidence. Tabula Rasa does not a rule make.

https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/173882/general-ncsoft-tackles-illegal-servers

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2006/11/8258/

[Super Atom]

Why does my post explaining to Tony V why this block of text

An account/authentication server
Multiple chat server executables
A market server
A Paragon Store (microtransaction) server
A crapton of mapservers
Multiple DB servers

Is just tech fluff and not complicated or expensive keep disappearing? It's not insulting or attacking anyone. I'll simplify in hopes its not removed.

The only real costing item in that list is Mapservers. The rest is very basic and simple stuff, The idea that each one is an individual server is incorrect and misleading. Account server for example. is a thing that when you click login, it's a web server that takes that request that you've sent and goes is this person legit. It's like logging into a forum thats all an account server is. Even mapserver isn't that complicated to operate. You have to remember, most of this was targeted at 2003/4 hardware. We're lightyears ahead in terms of equipment and costs. Fitting thousands of people in one spot is extra work certainly, but we're talking about individual private servers here, that would probably not feature 1000+ people at a time.

[Super Atom]

https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/173882/general-ncsoft-tackles-illegal-servers

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2006/11/8258/

Did you seriously just cite 2006/2008?

[Eiko-chan]

Did you seriously just cite 2006/2008?

They also cited shutting down private servers of currently-running, legally available products.

[ABagOfCandy]

I don't think Titan forums really were the secret breeding ground for this server.  I was pretty active here in the first few years after the shutdown and as the activity of the forum died down so did my visits.  I obviously didn't know any of the right people involved but I don't think they met through these forums(maybe one or two).  I would wager the people who visit this forum and also played, were already friends with someone in the "know" from pretty early on.

Fair point, it was just such a shock my mind sorta just went straight to the "what if I..." mindset. So since the cat is out of the bag, I'm gonna finally be active for any sort of push that might come out of this :)

[Super Atom]

They also cited shutting down private servers of currently-running, legally available products.

Which again, lineage 2 (Still operational) Private servers that have openly ran without closure attempts for 3-4 years.

[Taceus Jiwede]

Could SCoRE have turned to evil over time? I suppose it's possible, though I don't really believe it myself. But to suggest it began with evil intent as far back as a month after the closing is disingenuous.

I think to say SCoRE is even evil now is totally unfair.  I am sure they would have released some kind of public version at some point.  Were they going to do it all at once or in small chunks?  IE: Paragon Chat and the small updates to it.  I also believe they would have, eventually, had the full game released in a way (as they claim) is not just an emulator server.  The part I find disingenuous is the "Oh it was just around the corner"

I believe ideally (for those involved)  this server would have never been let out.  Not because they didn't want people to be able to play, but because they didn't want them to know they have in fact been playing for several years.  It would have been far easier to (eventually) release something to us and say "Oh now we can all play on it" without ever revealing that they had a secret server for years.

I also believe what started out as Alpha-style testing for their work on the reverse engineering side of things, where they brought in a few friends at a time, slowly shifted to a full-blown, official secret server.

[Ironwolf]

I don't believe it would have ever been released a quote from the Reddit Mole:

The policy was in place from at least 2013. Please be careful about assigning malice to these policies. We are talking about people willing to risk their personal freedom to keep the world alive and maintaining strict secrecy with harsh consequences was just how it had to be done in their minds. I hope these answers satisfy for now.

They were justifying themselves for 6 years that it was the only way to keep "their" home - not OUR home.

[saipaman]

Here's a conspiracy theory for you.

There never was an unauthorized leak by an NCSOFT employee.  It was a sanctioned act with the intent to manipulate the SCORE team into rebuilding the game into something that could be legitimately released back onto the market.    No one inside SCORE need know that they were played.   No one need know if, or how many, of their fellow players were actually working for NCSOFT.

It would be a fantastic outcome.

Remember, you heard about it here first.