Author Topic: Flash Season 2  (Read 68073 times)

Vee

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #340 on: May 25, 2016, 05:52:36 AM »
Spoiler for Hidden:
I suppose we shoulda known they'd go with another Geoff Johns arc for next season.

I can't decide if my favorite part was them not bargaining for the prisoner in the first place or the bit where they told Barry that the racing itself would power up the machine but he for some reason thought that would only happen if zoom won.

Nos482

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #341 on: May 25, 2016, 09:06:38 AM »
So I guess next season will deal with the
Spoiler for Hidden:
Flashpoint Paradox.
I really hope Snart shows up there and gives him a What the Hell, Hero?
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Tenzhi

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #342 on: May 25, 2016, 12:53:12 PM »
The only thing I really liked about that episode was the real Jay Garrick.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Dev7on

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #343 on: May 25, 2016, 04:54:19 PM »
So I guess next season will deal with the
Spoiler for Hidden:
Flashpoint Paradox.
I really hope Snart shows up there and gives him a What the Hell, Hero?

Yeah baby! I'm so looking forward for next season!  ;D That's my favorite story plot out of all The Flash comics.

hurple

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #344 on: May 25, 2016, 05:35:54 PM »
Seriously?

Ugh.

Personally, I think Flashpoint is the single story that completely *ruined* DC comics.  Hopefully, Rebirth will reverse course and fix things.

Unfortunately, they can't do the best Flash story ever... "The Return of Barry Allen."  The story that finally made Wally THE Flash!

 
« Last Edit: May 26, 2016, 01:51:47 PM by hurple »

Tenzhi

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #345 on: May 25, 2016, 05:42:05 PM »
Yeah, I certainly wouldn't want this Wally to be the Flash.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Super Firebug

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #346 on: May 27, 2016, 01:12:47 AM »
Seeing Barry's dad in profile, I had an idea for a new TV series: a buddy-cop show, co-starring John Wesley Shipp and Bruce Campbell, with Jay Leno as their captain, called "The Chin Squad".
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Vee

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #347 on: May 27, 2016, 01:33:00 AM »
Seeing Barry's dad in profile, I had an idea for a new TV series: a buddy-cop show, co-starring John Wesley Shipp and Bruce Campbell, with Jay Leno as their captain, called "The Chin Squad".

CHiNS? California Highway Narcotics Squad?

Nos482

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #348 on: May 27, 2016, 09:02:14 AM »
I'd watch that.
I'm bad and that's good.
I'll never be good and that's not bad.
There's no one I'd rather be than me.

...unless I could be Batman, of course. Everybody wants to be Batman.

Super Firebug

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #349 on: May 27, 2016, 11:45:15 PM »
Barry, you don't have to reset the timeline every time you kiss Iris. If you're that afraid of commitment, just stop kissing her! ;)
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Vee

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #350 on: May 27, 2016, 11:51:46 PM »
Yep. Timeline resets should be saved for pregnancies.

Super Firebug

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #351 on: May 29, 2016, 05:22:24 AM »
Going back to episode 22, "Invincible": Black Siren's statement, that all dopplegangers are mirror images of themselves, is nonsense. If Cisco is right-handed here, and left-handed on Earth-2, then what hand does he use on Earth-3? Earth-60? Earth-117? Sure, there'd be Earths out there where he'd be left-handed (since parallel universes are where events played out differently than they did here, and there are infinite parallel universes), but, since all parallel-universe Ciscos are dopplegangers of our Cisco, they'd ALL have to be left-handed. :/ BUT... they're also dopplegangers of each other, as well.
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doc7924

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #352 on: May 29, 2016, 01:18:11 PM »
Well Henry told Barry his mother's maiden name was Garrick. That was said for a reason. So the Jay Garrick of Earth 2 could still be him (the actor) just he has a different name. So maybe on E2 he was named Jay and not Henry and maybe he kept his mother's maiden name for some reason, and his son Barry used Allen.

Zoom said to Barry "You wouldn't believe me if I told you." when Barry asked him who was under the mask.

So that's my guess. Jay Garrick is somehow the E2 counterpart of Henry Allen.

I called this on the 22nd. Was off by one Earth.

I am sure we will see him again. And Harry of course.

My question is how did Jay get his speed? An E3 particle accelerator or maybe the old comics origin.

Now it makes sense why last year his other self warned him off.
I bet after he screwed up the future, when he goes back to fix it, his other self will tell him not too.

And I am also sure we haven't seen the last of Zoom either.


doc7924

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #353 on: May 29, 2016, 01:19:50 PM »
Going back to episode 22, "Invincible": Black Siren's statement, that all dopplegangers are mirror images of themselves, is nonsense. If Cisco is right-handed here, and left-handed on Earth-2, then what hand does he use on Earth-3? Earth-60? Earth-117? Sure, there'd be Earths out there where he'd be left-handed (since parallel universes are where events played out differently than they did here, and there are infinite parallel universes), but, since all parallel-universe Ciscos are dopplegangers of our Cisco, they'd ALL have to be left-handed. :/ BUT... they're also dopplegangers of each other, as well.

That was like the DS9 mirror universe stories - Rom trying to figure out how everything was opposite.

doc7924

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #354 on: May 29, 2016, 04:20:47 PM »
Also forgot to say excellent COIOE homage as Barry dies stopping the machine.

Plus the highlight of the episode for me: it wasn't Caitlin asking "What's a Pulsar?".

So apparently she knows what a Pulsar is but not a Singularity.

Mandu

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #355 on: May 29, 2016, 06:10:16 PM »

And Harry of course.

My question is how did Jay get his speed? An E3 particle accelerator or maybe the old comics origin.


Information has already been released that Tom Cavanagh is back next season so we will definitely have some version of Wells as a regular.

And I'm certain that Jay got his speed via the classic comic method.  I don't think all the hard water stuff was just thrown in as an easter egg but was actual information Zoom got from Jay.

I am going to miss Teddy.  Both good and evil versions of him (ok, so he only pretended to be good) were much more charismatic and likable than Henry, Wally, or Jesse.

doc7924

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #356 on: May 29, 2016, 07:49:53 PM »
Information has already been released that Tom Cavanagh is back next season so we will definitely have some version of Wells as a regular.

And I'm certain that Jay got his speed via the classic comic method.  I don't think all the hard water stuff was just thrown in as an easter egg but was actual information Zoom got from Jay.

I am going to miss Teddy.  Both good and evil versions of him (ok, so he only pretended to be good) were much more charismatic and likable than Henry, Wally, or Jesse.

He actually made a good Jay (Teddy). Was sorry to see he wasn't the real deal.

Nos482

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #357 on: May 30, 2016, 11:39:55 PM »
Going back to episode 22, "Invincible": Black Siren's statement, that all dopplegangers are mirror images of themselves, is nonsense. If Cisco is right-handed here, and left-handed on Earth-2, then what hand does he use on Earth-3? Earth-60? Earth-117? Sure, there'd be Earths out there where he'd be left-handed (since parallel universes are where events played out differently than they did here, and there are infinite parallel universes), but, since all parallel-universe Ciscos are dopplegangers of our Cisco, they'd ALL have to be left-handed. :/ BUT... they're also dopplegangers of each other, as well.
My guess is, she just wanted to see how Cisco would react. Reverb would've instantly called her out on that, Vibe's confusion and stammering was quite a dead give-away.
Or well, yeah, lousy writing ;)

Now it makes sense why last year his other self warned him off.
I bet after he screwed up the future, when he goes back to fix it, his other self will tell him not too.
So far we have one child Barry in the house, one who removed child Barry, one who watched, one who warned the watcher not to intervene and one who stopped the Reverse Flash.
Isn't it getting a bit crowded in there? Especially since at some point in season 3 there will be one  Barry to stop the one who stopped Thawne and who will then possibly become the one who warned himself earlier :o
How many Flashes did Joe and Cisco see in the mirror, in season 1?

And I am also sure we haven't seen the last of Zoom either.
He looked quite a lot like the Black Racer, when he was getting dragged into the Speed Force/Time Stream/whatever.

Information has already been released that Tom Cavanagh is back next season so we will definitely have some version of Wells as a regular.
Barry defeated Thawne (did he kill him? If not, what could he do with him?), who then had no reason to kill and impersonate Wells to fabricate the particle accelerator explosion a decade earlier than it would've originally happened.
And once Flashpoint is resolved, Harry will decide that Earth-2 is boring and he had way more fun on Earth-1. So he'll have Cisco pull him over... or it will be because of something Grodd related, who too is currently on E-2.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2016, 12:00:42 AM by Nos482 »
I'm bad and that's good.
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There's no one I'd rather be than me.

...unless I could be Batman, of course. Everybody wants to be Batman.

CG

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #358 on: May 31, 2016, 01:26:02 PM »
So far we have one child Barry in the house, one who removed child Barry, one who watched, one who warned the watcher not to intervene and one who stopped the Reverse Flash.
Isn't it getting a bit crowded in there? Especially since at some point in season 3 there will be one  Barry to stop the one who stopped Thawne and who will then possibly become the one who warned himself earlier :o

I'm going to enumerate the Flashes that are in the room and their roles so that we can maybe make sense of this.  Kevin Smith on his podcast said he couldn't wait until the final season where there are 87 Barry's in the room.  ;)

YB - Young Barry who is native to this point in time
S1B - Season 1 Barry who's hiding in the other room after travelling back from the S1E23 Finale
S2B - Season 2 Barry who stopped the Reverse Flash (RF) from killing his Mom in S2E23 Finale
S3B - Season 3 Barry who will have to go back at some point in S3 to fix the mess S2B made.
SXB - Season X Barry who chased the RF back in time.  He has a bright red costume instead of a maroon one.  He appears to be from the farthest in the future.

It is my understanding that SXB is the same one that tells S1B not to save his mom AND saved YB from the RF.  S2B travelling back undid the timeline and that's why S1B faded from existence.  I'm not exactly sure how you get a time remnant vs. getting erased from existence works.  Why S1B didn't disintegrate like Wells-RF isn't clear.  Maybe it depends on whether the timeline is changing as a result of your current actions? It's all a little Timey-Wimey.

I think we're in the middle of a self-correcting paradox and it will eventually stabilize when Barry stops going back in time to this point.  I think SXB is the final trip from the farthest in the future.  I suspect that S3B will go back and stop S2B (in the street, maybe), thereby restoring the timeline, unless there are future seasons who are still making plans to come back here.

There must have been an original Flash that started this all, but I'm not sure how to reconcile him with the SXB who tells Barry not to change the timeline, assuming they're the same person.  Perhaps he learned from other experiences not to mess with events?  RF-Wells said that he just moved up the timeline of how the Flash was created so it must have happened with the original Wells at a later date.  This makes me think that we started the TV show in the middle of the Paradox and not with the "first" Flash.  The First Flash must have had both parents growing up and still got powers later on as a result of the particle accelerator explosion.

I wish the writers were a little more consistent with how their time travel works.  I get the impression that it's like magic to them, but even magic has rules; they're just very different.  You still need to be consistent in order to play fair with the audience. 




doc7924

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Re: Flash Season 2
« Reply #359 on: May 31, 2016, 03:43:33 PM »
I'm going to enumerate the Flashes that are in the room and their roles so that we can maybe make sense of this.  Kevin Smith on his podcast said he couldn't wait until the final season where there are 87 Barry's in the room.  ;)

YB - Young Barry who is native to this point in time
S1B - Season 1 Barry who's hiding in the other room after travelling back from the S1E23 Finale
S2B - Season 2 Barry who stopped the Reverse Flash (RF) from killing his Mom in S2E23 Finale
S3B - Season 3 Barry who will have to go back at some point in S3 to fix the mess S2B made.
SXB - Season X Barry who chased the RF back in time.  He has a bright red costume instead of a maroon one.  He appears to be from the farthest in the future.

It is my understanding that SXB is the same one that tells S1B not to save his mom AND saved YB from the RF.  S2B travelling back undid the timeline and that's why S1B faded from existence.  I'm not exactly sure how you get a time remnant vs. getting erased from existence works.  Why S1B didn't disintegrate like Wells-RF isn't clear.  Maybe it depends on whether the timeline is changing as a result of your current actions? It's all a little Timey-Wimey.

I think we're in the middle of a self-correcting paradox and it will eventually stabilize when Barry stops going back in time to this point.  I think SXB is the final trip from the farthest in the future.  I suspect that S3B will go back and stop S2B (in the street, maybe), thereby restoring the timeline, unless there are future seasons who are still making plans to come back here.

There must have been an original Flash that started this all, but I'm not sure how to reconcile him with the SXB who tells Barry not to change the timeline, assuming they're the same person.  Perhaps he learned from other experiences not to mess with events?  RF-Wells said that he just moved up the timeline of how the Flash was created so it must have happened with the original Wells at a later date.  This makes me think that we started the TV show in the middle of the Paradox and not with the "first" Flash.  The First Flash must have had both parents growing up and still got powers later on as a result of the particle accelerator explosion.

I wish the writers were a little more consistent with how their time travel works.  I get the impression that it's like magic to them, but even magic has rules; they're just very different.  You still need to be consistent in order to play fair with the audience.

Yikes!

But as you say - we still have never seen the ORIGINAL timeline at all. Or the original Flash either.

The Flash in the bright red is the same as the one from the future newspaper. Assumedly this is the Flash that was created originally by the real Harrison Wells in 2020 or whatever.

He is the one that is supposed to have this long history with Thawne, which is why Thawne went back in time to kill him.

But we have and probably will never know the original reason they become enemies since that Flash doesn't seem to exist anymore. being replaced by 'our' Flash of 2014.

The other problem I have is they realty don't stay consistent with their time travel stuff.

If Eddie is killed in the past - Thawne is never born. So the entire history of all that first season should have been erased.
But it wasn't - everyone still remembered Thawne and everything that happened. What makes it worse is that in this finale they got it right - Barry changes the past so his other self is wiped from existence.

Even if they use the logic that it takes time for 'time' to change - Eoabard vanishes as soon as Eddie dies - it took no time at all for the past to catch up to him.

I guess we have to see what they do with this - hopefully they don't do whole Flashpoint arc where Barry tries to get his powers back like in the comic - they just did that.

Still one of the best super hero shows ever done, wonky time travel logic and all.