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Plan Z: General => Plan Z: General Discussion => Topic started by: Consultant on November 27, 2016, 05:09:02 PM
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Um ... I applaud the idea but wouldn't NCSoft just be able to sue you out of existence if you tied yourself into the City of Heroes franchise?
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Whatever you do, don't fall into the "repair your gear" trap.
That's the most annoying aspect of many games.
I'd much rather replacement my enhancements as I level up than be continuously running somewhere for a gear repair.
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Where does 'ship' come into this?
Be Well!
Fireheart
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Where does 'ship' come into this?
Well, there's this from the front page of the site: "Imagine a universe where the City of Heroes defends the Star Trek Federation." Guessing it has something to do with Spaaaaaace!!
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Um ... I applaud the idea but wouldn't NCSoft just be able to sue you out of existence if you tied yourself into the City of Heroes franchise?
This is my sentiment as well. It is one thing to mention City of. as lore or something of the like. It is quite different, to use copy righted material. Just from looking at the web site, it is obvious that you ripped a lot from City of. I would recommend that if this new attempt was going to make a successor, change the names of the ats, and the character creator. The only reason I listed these two, is because anyone whoever played City of. will look at these two, and say the same thing as me.
I genially like your idea, however, it should be your idea and not ripped from another game.
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We appreciate the feedback. As the game evolves, we can make changes to things like the names of archetypes if that seems appropriate.
But Ship of Heroes is a successor game, not a re-make. It's a new vision of a game, taking the best ideas we can think of to make a fun game.
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Looks awesome I hope it happens
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We appreciate the feedback. As the game evolves, we can make changes to things like the names of archetypes if that seems appropriate.
But Ship of Heroes is a successor game, not a re-make. It's a new vision of a game, taking the best ideas we can think of to make a fun game.
I can understand where you are coming from. Just was listing a few things that might cause Nc. to take a look at your game. I do have high hopes for this game, I think the outline you listed, is very interesting. Where aliens could be enemies or friendly, is very interesting.
Question, will there be planets to go to? If so, will they be level locked?
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That's cool. Hope we get to strike back at the Rikti on their own turf. Looking forward to hearing great things about Ship of Heroes.
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We are really excited about Ship of Heroes, so we're glad you are too.
Right now, we don't think the planets should be level-locked, although making a new alt and jumping down to the planet might be difficult since a new alt has so few powers. In some ways it might be analogous to going to the Rikti Warzone in COH -- you could do it at level 1, but you'd have more fun at a higher level.
One of the fun things we have planned for Ship of Heroes is an increased opportunity to join raids. Aliens are raiding our ship and we can counter-raid on their ships. Enabling pick-up-groups to participate and succeed in defensive and offensive raiding is another cool element, which will also help make the social side of the game fun.
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I don't think the class names should be a problem. I know the other games are avoiding using CoH's AT names, but words like "scrapper" and "mastermind" long predate CoH. You may have problems with using "Star Trek", even just as a mention, because Paramount/CBS is uppity about their IP.
Right now, the thing that's most worrying on the website is that the image of what is supposedly your character creator is clearly just the CoH character creator with a few small edits, and that is something that NCSoft will almost certainly crack down on.
(That said... still excited. I still miss The City after all these years. Let's see what you got)
Edit: Oh, you might also have issues with the company name, as there's already a Heroic Games, making their own superhero-themed RPG (but not a MMORPG): http://www.hmd-game.com/press/
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Good luck.
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Right now, the thing that's most worrying on the website is that the image of what is supposedly your character creator is clearly just the CoH character creator with a few small edits, and that is something that NCSoft will almost certainly crack down on.
It looks like a slightly awkward mashup of CoH and CO graphics. The timeline seems somewhat unrealistically short to me since based on the images i've seen so far it seems like there isn't even a concept artist/designer on board at this point. Starting from basically zero right now i'd expect the playable alpha to be ready in the mid 2020s at the earliest barring the involvement of an already established game studio or the funding to start up a full time, full size studio from scratch. Just using Hello Games and No Man's Sky as an example, it took a team of 17 even without any sort of netcode or multiplayer, and that ended up being disappointingly lacking in depth and variety even with the procedural generation gimmick. So, at best i'm a little dubious, but i hope it works out regardless.
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So you have some polls, one of which I will quote:
SOH will have enhancements to powers that do not affect appearance at all, as in COH. Which option do you prefer?
- Similar to COH. Max of 6 enhancements per power.
- Let me go up to 8 or 9 per power
- Give each power the same number of slots.
- Something different from COH enhancements (future poll subject if this wins)
- No limits! Let me put all my enhancements into a couple of favorite powers.
It seems crazy to me be polling about this, or the level that team play drops should be boosted, when there's no actual info about game mechanics whatsoever.
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Again, we appreciate the feedback. A couple of thoughts: we're a small team, and we started with mock-ups and concept art -- that's what you see on our website. A few days ago we posted some screenshots from inside the game for the first time, in the Latest News section. We intend to update this section as we finish items in order to flesh out the game. So you can see the good and the bad. It certainly takes years to make an MMORPG, and we know that. There's a balance that we need to strike between letting people know that we're working on a game, but not promising too much too soon. So we have gone ahead and published a set of milestones we want to achieve by next April, including the announcement of the game last month, the first in-game screenshots in this month (December), a demo video of a working character creator in January, etc. From our point of view, fulfilling these milestones illustrates what we are creating and demonstrates steady, predictable progress.
What we try not to do is to over-promise. We do not promise a totally finished first ship level this month, or a million costume pieces in the character creator next month. But we will be showing what we have, and letting the community give us feedback. We think the City of Heroes community still exists, more than four years after the game officially closed, because we are passionate about the experience we had in the original game. I know I am. So over-promising to a passionate crowd would be a disaster.
It's actually a bit complicated to let the community know that we exist, and to react to all of the feedback. And we've had a lot of feedback. :)
Please keep us in mind. We're going to be revealing some very interesting stuff over the next few months. And as I said at the start, we really do appreciate the feedback, even if it takes us a little time to react.
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Apotheosis City? That's too long of a name to type in chat. Hmmmm... I know! I'll just call it AP. XD
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Well i certainly don't have any objections to more groups trying to make an homage game, and i hope it succeeds despite all the obvious obstacles. It's worth noting that CoH did not start out as a big budget MMO either, but then prior to WoW a big budget MMO was a very relative term and not the norm. At this stage it's the more the merrier and we'll see how it all settles out later.
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We agree. A small fun game can grow big if the community embraces it.
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New dev: "hey guys, here's a new city of heroes spin off were working on"
Me: Awesome can't wait!
Spin off / emulator haters: Hey aren't you worried that you'll get sued for that?
Me: *shakes head*
Ignore the usual legal experts here and keep working on your project. We'll never get anywhere without risks.
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Keep up the good work. Welcome aboard to Plan Z, plenty of room for a fresh take and new ideas.
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Thank you very much!
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New dev: "hey guys, here's a new city of heroes spin off were working on"
Me: Awesome can't wait!
Spin off / emulator haters: Hey aren't you worried that you'll get sued for that?
Me: *shakes head*
Ignore the usual legal experts here and keep working on your project. We'll never get anywhere without risks.
??? I don't see anybody here "hating" on this, just pointing out some very real concerns with how closely this game seems to want to mimic CoH, right down to the costume creator and seemingly even the IP (unless "move the storyline ahead 500 years" doesn't literally mean "same timeline, same history"), which you just can't do. Like, I'm no legal expert, but when you're directly setting out to imitate and extend another person's property as your stated goal without permission, you're just begging for trouble. Even the other successor project that is plainly little more than CoH with the numbers filed off (you know the one I mean) is more subtle about it than this.
That said, nobody's telling them to stop either, so cool ya jets. I'm a little skeptical about the prospect of a sci-fi spaceship/traditional comic book superhero mashup, but it could definitely be cool if it were done well without being litigated into oblivion. The main thing that comes to mind for me is the Star Trek/X-Men crossovers of the late 90s, and the recent Green Lantern/Abramstrek crossover. The two settings just don't fit well together, even with the space-faring nature of the Lanterns and the Shi'ar. Not impossible, but it's a tough balance to strike.
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Darkgob, we appreciate your thoughts. Ship of Heroes is definitely the most different spiritual successor out there as we are not taking the story and moving it 500 years into the future, not extending with same characters and history, but rather providing a new story and setting. Our character creator, which has not been shown yet, is not the same as the prior one, and the rough mockup on our landing page is just illustrative as we've said before. We are a team making a game which is NOT a late 20-th century American city with cops and criminals, arsonists and firemen, supervillains and superheroes, banks and newspapers. This is definitely not Gotham, Metropolis or Paragon, or a close copy with the numbers filed off, as you said. This is new.
For a man or woman in the early 1500's in England, modern American life in Los Angeles or Houston would have been actually unimaginable. Humanity's actual future 500 years from now is likely unimaginable to us as well. But we're taking a crack at it. Stay tuned, I think you're going to like it.
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I am skeptical and waiting to see where it goes. Kind of like I am skeptical of heroes and villains.
I am honestly suspecting "Ship of heroes" is a temporary name, even. It may have a complete name change. All I know it could be CoH2 and "Ship of heroes" is a temporary name.
Edit: It's really, hard to say with it this early in production what it really is.
...And now I see someone here seems to be on the dev team. The whole thing does make me ponder things if it's a far future game.
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I've got one big question, is there any plans to eventually introduce the ability to play as a Villian? (And I don't mean like CO's crap)
If you all do have plans to eventually make it where we can play as Villians, maybe make it like the Villians are on a seperate ship (I'd say prisoner ship but that'd be really really similar to CoV :P ) that's going on a similar path as the Hero Ship, but not quite, thus causing new factions that are seperate from the Hero Ship to appear in the Villian Ship, and what not.
That's just my thought process, one of my absolute joys of playing CoH/CoV was being able to play as a Villian and being able to actually rob a Bank and then having to face off against a Hero at the end.
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Saw an update on their site today with a video of the Arch. Looks good for how early it is. Lots to be seen of course, but I always like seeing updates.
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Just noticed that they picked up Nicholas Esposito, the man who created CoT's own player model. Good choice, he does excellent work.
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I have to say, this game is coming along nicely :). One suggestion though, when I was looking at the health bars I see a 100% is there going to be option to just see the amount of hp. Such as character x has 100 hp out of 100.
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Please make some possible archetypes similar to Controllers or Masterminds.
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One thing I will say, and I feel it really needs to be said;
As long as support isn't all just healing, healing, more healing and actually has real buffs/debuffs/crowd control and respects them as viable playstyles. I shouldn't have to wait around all day for a person who only restores health points like they do in CO in later game content nore earlier game content. Teams should be dynamic like they were in CoH, as thats what really helped encouraged friends to just team up with one another rather than inviting someone for the class.
I read that people will be able to take powers with more freedom, so long as it's not like CO where everything gets nerfed for being combinable with something in a different set and then forgotten about know? CO was a complete disaster as it's freeform system ironicly shoe-horned people into very narrow builds thanks to the huge power differences we'd see in them, all the while buffs/debuffs/crowd control were largely neglected caused for a game which could have had some serious depth and replay-ability with options to explore to not really have any. If Ship of heroes is really focused on the journey a good balance and focus on non-trinity team abilities and whatnot to discourage cherry-picked holy trinity has to be key to :).
Now, I saw the person writing the article here; http://2p.com/47345154_1/Ship-of-Heroes-Could-This-Be-the-Next-City-of-Heroes-by-Nephthys.htm?fr=page-next
Now, I wasn't one of those who knew neph but, given what I saw about CO's forums reactions she wasn't anywhere in there.....so.....maybe I need to reassess that person some :).
From what I read though, they focus heavily on the community and story elements, which I am all for, I hate games without good story telling, and anyone who says mmorpgs shouldn't have any kind of story focus need to get there heads out of there behinds. Story and environment makes the world, when you have an environment without a story, it's just graphical effects. One needs a setting and both the story and environment make that. When a world has only the environment, all I see are boring buildings, with robots moving about. A castle with emotionless people in it is just a building made of crude stone bricks and a portcullis. A castle with lively characters who have differing, varying personality befitting a medieval environment to the miserable peasants and spoiled princes and stern kings is a legitimate medieval castle and a legitimate setting, and that applies to all kinds of settings :).
But for a game to be a true rpg, imo, variety of playstyles have got to be supported equally. Making people all play either a healer/tank/damage when the original CoH let us take a few oddball powersets and find a way of making them work and explore them....would miss the ball. And part of that is also encouraging players to play other things, which CoH did supurbly.
What made storm summoning truely feel like it's own powerset, for example, was that inspite having one of the weakest healing powers in the game (o2 boost, which was more of a short-length buff than a heal), it was popular among players because of it's knockbacks, and how it's debuff effects meshed into everything. For instance freezing rain debuffed resistances and defenses of everything effected very heavily, enough to make a mob take over 30%+ damage(a number unheard of in other mmorpgs) and assured teammates attacking those mobs would hit. This was in addition to a -slow and constant knockdown from slipping/sliding. Hurricane shoved enemies, yes, but it was also made useful with a massive -30-50% to hit debuff, which effectively reduced mob chances to hit anything to near nothing for the moments they were in it, which combined with it's repel, made it a powerful spell/power to shove enemies into corners with or debuff archvillains even.
And it helped roleplaying, when powers prevented damage through very powerful crowd control effects, debuffs, buffs. It helped players become attached to those characters and for roleplayers, it helped those players come up with personalities for those characters. With some sets even supporting a few different styles of play it allowed for a wide variety of character personalities to roleplay. Something that you wouldn't see in run-of-the-mill mmorpgs. I mean I would rather talk to two storm summoners with differing personalities thanks to them using different tactics that developed, the aggressive "Offender" storm summoner and the more defensive "Defender" storm summoner, than two healers who are just gonna be "Oh, I heal you and i'm the reason everyone is alive, it's my job". The defender and "Offender" on the other hand as I sometimes saw, had differing opinions on how to do things and that combined with the sheer number of differing powersets? Well every man or woman had a golden character for them if they weren't roleplayers and roleplayers got to explore wide varieties of characters to, well, roleplay.
The journey ended up varied in CoH for that reason. No one set was alike, because buffs/debuffs/crowd control allowed them to not only feel super and useful but also useful without resorting to just more healing. Every new character I made was somewhat like a puzzle, in a sense. "How would energy/time woman solve this problem? I know staff/willpower guy smashed his way through these no problem but how would energy/time woman deal with it? She isn't invincible nore is she the most damaging, oh I know I can keep knocking them into the wall while time's juncture cripples them to miss on the few attacks they hit!".
Later, same situation, different character: "How would mind/force fields deal with this situation?" The process would repeat in that the player would look for how their character would deal with them, rather than generic mmo(aka like CO): "Ok, hold *(thats my power 2 key which I bound to my mouse), let two gun mow them down on gun guy" "Ok, keep pressing * and watch them drop with sword gal". "Ok, hold * again to electrocute them with electric gal." It's difficult to develop a unique personality for someone who plays and feels like another character, which is also where DCUO fails as well. Everyones always pressing left click or right click, or a combination, when fighting, so it feels like your playing the same person no matter what sets you pick at times.
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The Kickstarter is now up and I've just pledged. Of all the projects this one looks to have the greatest potential. Check out the videos and interviews.
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Here, I'll share a link for everyone.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1680249253/ship-of-heroes-a-space-hero-mmorpg?ref=hero_thanks
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Hrm, no Mac version at launch, no stretch goal for a Mac version (like CoT had)...
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Kickstarter drive ENGAGED!
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If I had the money I would sooooooo donate :(. If I was worried about this project before it all went away by looking at all of the games they worked on in the past.
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I'm in. I don't want to be overly optimistic, but it looks pretty shiny.
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I'm in.
Forget the "shiny", I like what the dev team is saying about building on the concepts that made CoH successful, and I like the priorities that they are focusing on.
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I am in :) Went with the Veteran pledge. I may up my pledge in a week or so... :) Very excited for this game. This is the first kickstarter I have donated to. The more I learn about SoH...the more I want it to be done so I can just login..for a weekend LOL!