Assume some publisher/developer (let's call them X) acquires the rights to CoH and re-opens the doors with all previous data intact.
Wonderful!
But ...
What about the ongoing projects to create CoH-like worlds? Do they just shutter themselves, with all the work into them disappearing?
I speculate that the best possible outcome is for X to also acquire those projects, and interview those who had put significant work into them for positions on the new CoH team. (I mean, X will need new blood anyway, right?) Good ideas and code from the other projects might be incorporated into future issues.
I imagine City of Titans will still keep on truckin'. They've come too far to stop now (think of all the money they acquired through the Kickstarter and all), but I don't think they'll just forget about CoH either.
No, they keep going. Then, we will have choices. Although, my first choice would be City of Heroes.
Good luck to all of them! :)
depends on if the new owner will add more content to the game latter on or put the game itself into maintenance mode. you be able to play coh but nothing new will be added to the game.
For now I think everybody would be happy to see the game again, even if they game won't be getting any updates anymore. I also think there are alot of player out there who haven't even got the max out of COH, so there would be plenty of stuff to do!
Even with all the new projects out there...they have yet to prove themselves, so City of Heroes would be my first choice as well.
For City of Titans, or whatever its name will be finalized as, it's already too late for them to turn back regardless of whether CoH comes back or not, and for one simple reason. As soon as they held their Kickstarter, they essentially promissed that they would make and release a finished game to all who donated to their funding.
To back out now, they'd have to pay back all the money they raised to everyone who donated, which is probably very unlikely since I'm sure by this point they've spent quite a bit of that money on tools and software licenses for developing their game. They can't pay back money they no longer have, so it's either finish the game, or face legal action from those who donated funds, because coming up with that money on the spot for a refund at this stage would be very difficult.
Long story short, they're going to have to finish developing the game either way, because the alternative is not that appealing.
If it happens...Well.
Let's just bring up something..
Here's city of heroes.
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=mygaming.co.za%2Fnews%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2012%2F03%2FcityOfHeroes.jpg)
Here's one of the latest generation of video games, Grand Theft Auto V.
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=media1.gameinformer.com%2Fimagefeed%2Fscreenshots%2FGrandTheftAutoV%2FRSG_GTAV_Screenshot_030.jpg)
Even if COH comes back, it's been left light years in the dust with regards to graphics, game dynamics, storyline and overall detail. It will always hold a special place in our hearts, but without a complete overhaul it won't be able to compete.
Quote from: LadyShin on February 26, 2014, 06:00:30 PM
If it happens...Well.
Let's just bring up something..
Here's city of heroes.
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=mygaming.co.za%2Fnews%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2012%2F03%2FcityOfHeroes.jpg)
Here's one of the latest generation of video games, Grand Theft Auto V.
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=media1.gameinformer.com%2Fimagefeed%2Fscreenshots%2FGrandTheftAutoV%2FRSG_GTAV_Screenshot_030.jpg)
Even if COH comes back, it's been left light years in the dust with regards to graphics, game dynamics, storyline and overall detail. It will always hold a special place in our hearts, but without a complete overhaul it won't be able to compete.
Two things; first that screenshot of Atlas Park looks to either be pre-Ultra Mode or with Ultra Mode graphics turned down, either way the graphics of the game got a big facelift already and some areas are actually quite detailed. Second, any real gamer worth their salt knows that there's more needed for a game to be a success than flashy graphics. I've lost count of how many "visually appealing but horrible games" I've seen publishers throw away money on(and I can usually spot these at a glance and avoid them). Just because it's not as graphically amazing doesn't mean it won't get attention.
Seriously, take a look at a lot of the indie games being made, they're all relatively cheap graphics wise, but they still make pretty good money. Why? Simple, good marketing, and good gameplay(the former of which CoH always lacked, which is probably a big contributor to its own premature downfall).
I imagine I'd give a returned COH a try if it made it back, but I do think the relative age of the graphics is an issue that it'd be facing in terms of getting new fans, and at this point I don't know how many of the old ones would return.
If Paragon Studio had been able to buy the game from NcSoft and spun off to be an independent company then I'd have more faith and loyalty, but right now you're hypothetically asking me to trust a hypothetical company would have the know-how to run COH's spaghetti code AND not pull the rug out from under me like NcSoft did.
At this point, I find that doubtful.
I'm hoping that City of Titans and/or Heroes and Villains and Valiance Online can bring back something of the gameplay I lost when COH shutdown.
im hoping all 3 choices we will have will be successful. i personally cant wait to try all of them when they release.
i do agree with shenku about the graphics. graphics dont make a game. it is the storytelling and the lore imo that can make a good game.
Nothing would make me happier than to have CoH back. It was such a wonderful part of eight years of my life for so many reasons. I'd want it back as it was the day of sunset....I'd find comfort in the familiarity. I am also pulling for the other projects to succeed beyond all expectations, and would gladly give them a go. CoH will always be my favorite and most loved game for me. I hope everyday that we can all go 'home' someday.
[Even if COH comes back, it's been left light years in the dust with regards to graphics, game dynamics, storyline and overall detail. It will always hold a special place in our hearts, but without a complete overhaul it won't be able to compete.]
Graphics are not that bad... first, a lot of players have computers that couldn't handle the full graphics of the newer games and would have to drop down. Second, CoH has better graphics available if you turn up the graphics, and most likely you would end up meeting in the middle, with new games turned down and CoH graphics turned up, to the point where they are a lot closer than those two pictures.
Game dynamics... CoH is missing some ideas, but it still has excellent dynamics and movement. Some are a bit clunky, but is it really a major deal if the way you jump in and out of mission doors is a bit lame?
A new game could certainly be an improvement, but could also certainly be worse. CoH had a good design and played well, and new stories could easily be added.
Quote from: Shenku on February 26, 2014, 06:26:41 PM
Two things; first that screenshot of Atlas Park looks to either be pre-Ultra Mode or with Ultra Mode graphics turned down, either way the graphics of the game got a big facelift already and some areas are actually quite detailed. Second, any real gamer worth their salt knows that there's more needed for a game to be a success than flashy graphics. I've lost count of how many "visually appealing but horrible games" I've seen publishers throw away money on(and I can usually spot these at a glance and avoid them). Just because it's not as graphically amazing doesn't mean it won't get attention.
Seriously, take a look at a lot of the indie games being made, they're all relatively cheap graphics wise, but they still make pretty good money. Why? Simple, good marketing, and good gameplay(the former of which CoH always lacked, which is probably a big contributor to its own premature downfall).
It's a lot easier to show a screenshot showing high graphic detail than it is to show quality game content. I'm not ripping COH in any way, it was one of the greatest of its time - but the fact is that, detailed as it was, it's been gathering dust, and not just on the shelf. MMO's succeed because they are able to evolve ahead of the expectations of gamers. COH, if it was suddenly brought back in the form it was in when it shut down, could struggle a great deal to keep up. NCSoft burned its bridges with fans, former employees and business associates, including the bestselling authors that made COH legendary.
Quote from: Shenku on February 26, 2014, 03:54:27 PM
For City of Titans, or whatever its name will be finalized as, it's already too late for them to turn back regardless of whether CoH comes back or not, and for one simple reason. As soon as they held their Kickstarter, they essentially promissed that they would make and release a finished game to all who donated to their funding.
To back out now, they'd have to pay back all the money they raised to everyone who donated, which is probably very unlikely since I'm sure by this point they've spent quite a bit of that money on tools and software licenses for developing their game. They can't pay back money they no longer have, so it's either finish the game, or face legal action from those who donated funds, because coming up with that money on the spot for a refund at this stage would be very difficult.
Long story short, they're going to have to finish developing the game either way, because the alternative is not that appealing.
Actually, with Kickstarter, the person running the Kickstart isn't obligated to deliver a damn thing.
Now people CAN try to sue. The reality is, such a lawsuit would be more expensive and time consuming than most people could deal with.
And, as I mentioned, because they're not contractually obligated to actually DELIVER anything as part of the Kickstart process, you'd lose regardless.
This might just be me, but I think Cryptic is working on City of 2. Why I say this the producer of star trek online has been moved to making a new mmo. I have a feeling it is going to be the aforementioned City of 2. And I have learned to trust my feelings.
Quote from: Angel Phoenix77 on February 28, 2014, 03:37:33 AM
This might just be me, but I think Cryptic is working on City of 2. Why I say this the producer of star trek online has been moved to making a new mmo. I have a feeling it is going to be the aforementioned City of 2. And I have learned to trust my feelings.
I dunno about that.
City doesn't belong to Cryptic anymore. And they've already got their own CO (which ain't doing so great). Not to mention they're owned, lock stock and two smoking fire tanks, by an NCSoft competitor.
Quote from: Hyperstrike on February 28, 2014, 12:51:26 AM
Actually, with Kickstarter, the person running the Kickstart isn't obligated to deliver a damn thing.
Now people CAN try to sue. The reality is, such a lawsuit would be more expensive and time consuming than most people could deal with.
And, as I mentioned, because they're not contractually obligated to actually DELIVER anything as part of the Kickstart process, you'd lose regardless.
Wrong.
Kickstarter creators are legally rerquired to fulfill all rewards of their project or refund any backer whose reward they do not or cannot fulfill. The terms are crafted to create a legal requirement for creators to follow through on their projects, and to give backers a recourse if they don't.
This is basic kickstarter 101 stuff - https://www.kickstarter.com/help/faq/kickstarter%20basics . Please stop spreading this myth that creators are not accountable.
I'm not doubting the difficulty of pressing a lawsuit, especially with only small pledges, and projects that are low budget. And a kick starter may not be successful (different to taking money and running), kick starters have inherent risk. But it is total BS that creators don't have to try and fulfill their obligations.
If NCSoft (or anyone else) ever brought City of Heroes back. I'd /em dance in RL for along time.
I'd still play the other three projects when they came out to. Just not as much if City of Heroes was live again.
Quote from: Hyperstrike on February 28, 2014, 06:50:20 AM
I dunno about that.
City doesn't belong to Cryptic anymore. And they've already got their own CO (which ain't doing so great). Not to mention they're owned, lock stock and two smoking fire tanks, by an NCSoft competitor.
Champions is not getting the kind of attention and support that STO and Neverwinter get, but in the last year or so it has gotten more attention than it had for about a year prior. Barring a major investment by Cryptic and Perfect World, it's never going to reach its full potential, but per Trailturtle they are pleased with the success that it does have. It's also the one game Cryptic owns outright, and I think that's going to keep it around as much as anything else.
I wouldn't be displeased if Cryptic came up with a game closer in style to COH than CO, but I like both playing styles so I'd play both. :D
Quote from: cohRock on February 24, 2014, 01:06:12 PM
Assume some publisher/developer (let's call them X) acquires the rights to CoH and re-opens the doors with all previous data intact.
Wonderful!
But ...
What about the ongoing projects to create CoH-like worlds? Do they just shutter themselves, with all the work into them disappearing?
I speculate that the best possible outcome is for X to also acquire those projects, and interview those who had put significant work into them for positions on the new CoH team. (I mean, X will need new blood anyway, right?) Good ideas and code from the other projects might be incorporated into future issues.
the obvious master plan lets call it plan AOmega is to aquire CoX and update it's character designer and initial enemy characters models to have more features such as faces that aren't just textres and hands and feet, for this a blend of the new art thats been done would be handy, new city areas? blend them into the story as new zones. ETC. Over all; blend the titan projects into CoX with CoX as the master atmosphere to conform to.
Quote from: Angel Phoenix77 on February 28, 2014, 03:37:33 AM
This might just be me, but I think Cryptic is working on City of 2. Why I say this the producer of star trek online has been moved to making a new mmo. I have a feeling it is going to be the aforementioned City of 2. And I have learned to trust my feelings.
It is interesting to see that there is coh.com, which leads to the well known: http://www.coh.com/en/sunset.php
But it seems like coh2.com and coh3.com also link to that page. Wonder what their intention was for those domain names. (both created 5 years after the original coh.com)
Quote from: Kaos Arcanna on February 28, 2014, 11:50:42 AM
Champions is not getting the kind of attention and support that STO and Neverwinter get, but in the last year or so it has gotten more attention than it had for about a year prior. Barring a major investment by Cryptic and Perfect World, it's never going to reach its full potential, but per Trailturtle they are pleased with the success that it does have. It's also the one game Cryptic owns outright, and I think that's going to keep it around as much as anything else.
I wouldn't be displeased if Cryptic came up with a game closer in style to COH than CO, but I like both playing styles so I'd play both. :D
It doesn't get the attention because the IP is self-owned. So there's no license holder standing behind them with a club, pushing them to perform.
There's also the fact that Champions just isn't a huge name. Even in the PnP gaming. They're well known and well capitalized. But they're just not "huge". Now something like Catan? THAT is huge. I don't really "get" the appeal of Catan, but it's still massive.
Quote from: LadyShin on February 26, 2014, 06:00:30 PM
If it happens...Well.
Let's just bring up something..
Here's city of heroes.
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=mygaming.co.za%2Fnews%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2012%2F03%2FcityOfHeroes.jpg)
Here's one of the latest generation of video games, Grand Theft Auto V.
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=media1.gameinformer.com%2Fimagefeed%2Fscreenshots%2FGrandTheftAutoV%2FRSG_GTAV_Screenshot_030.jpg)
Even if COH comes back, it's been left light years in the dust with regards to graphics, game dynamics, storyline and overall detail. It will always hold a special place in our hearts, but without a complete overhaul it won't be able to compete.
Me, I am greedy. I want all that CoX was, AND ALSO new and improved souped-up graphics that will make us fall in love all over again. I keep reminding myself that setting the bar too high means inevitable disappointment. Baby steps.
I think what all of us need is something to keep us busy. Once CoT rolls out, we'll be very busy and this will make the wait for the inevitable underground server a lot more bearable.
Graphics-wise, chasing ultra-realism is pointless for MMOs, as they need too much post-launch investment to keep them looking up to date - which is why so many MMOs use a more stylized look, as it extends the shelf-life of the graphics.
That's why WoW has only just started getting around to updating its character models, and why Wildstar and EQN are taking a similar stylize route for their looks.
Ultra-realism also isn't suitable for a comic book game, as it's too far from the source material - when CoH updated its graphics, they simply added more detail rather than changing the style, which was well-suited to a comic book game.
Should I throw out my 80's music because it is 'dated'?...Minecraft looks like old school Nintendo but it seems popular.
CoH, the way it was, updated or not, is my game of choice. Graphics don't capture the sense of community we had....most GTA players I know, play awhile and drop off.
MaidMercury, you nailed it.
Though you have to admit, it would be kind of cool seeing what City of Heroes would be like with one of the GTA engines ...
Alas, Rockstar and NCSoft would make it rain blood if someone ever tried that.
Quote from: MaidMercury on March 05, 2014, 04:39:29 AM
Should I throw out my 80's music because it is 'dated'?...Minecraft looks like old school Nintendo but it seems popular.
CoH, the way it was, updated or not, is my game of choice. Graphics don't capture the sense of community we had....most GTA players I know, play awhile and drop off.
Spot On!
Quote from: MaidMercury on March 05, 2014, 04:39:29 AM
Should I throw out my 80's music because it is 'dated'?...Minecraft looks like old school Nintendo but it seems popular.
CoH, the way it was, updated or not, is my game of choice. Graphics don't capture the sense of community we had....most GTA players I know, play awhile and drop off.
Exactly! 80's music rocks (a lot of it anyway), and even with the parts I don't like, Minecraft is still my second favorite video game of all time. So I completely agree that "new and shiny" definitely does not beat "tested and proven".
Plus, in Minecraft's case, it uses newer graphics technology all over the place; it just
looks like it's an older style. It was a design choice to give it a charming, classic appearance. A choice which seems to have been embraced very well, considering that Minecraft is currently the third best selling PC game (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_PC_games) with over 14 million copies sold.
See, there's something you have to remember about people who only look for the "best" graphics.
They're never going to be satisfied. No amount of technical improvement is ever going to be enough for them; they will always want the next step, and the next, and the next. Solid gameplay and fun storylines don't matter to them, or are very much secondary in their mind. If graphics are all they care about, then they will always - and I mean always - instantly move on to the next thing.
When gameplay is what matters to a player, or storyline, or a particular style, then they tend to stick with it even if the game has other aspects they don't really enjoy. But when the graphics are a game's strongest feature, even its biggest supporters will move on and not look back. Nostalgia for a game like that usually amounts to laughing at how much you used to like it, and wondering how you ever put up with all the flaws.
CoH managed to have a comic book art style without being hideous like CO.
Quote from: Golden Girl on March 07, 2014, 07:50:05 PM
CoH managed to have a comic book art style without being hideous like CO.
Dare you to do better, or do at all. :)
Quote from: Brou on March 08, 2014, 03:58:00 AM
Dare you to do better, or do at all. :)
... interesting dare.
Quote from: Brou on March 08, 2014, 03:58:00 AM
Dare you to do better, or do at all. :)
You do realize she's the head of www.heroes-and-villains.com right?
Quote from: Aggelakis on March 08, 2014, 04:51:54 AM
You do realize she's the head of www.heroes-and-villains.com right?
That's why I said it. :)
(https://i.imgur.com/i41Nsdt.png)
*hides*
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=www.portalprelude.com%2Fimages%2Fnews%2Fchallengers.jpg)
I was not disrespecting CoX's graphics, I'd just like to see what CoT does with an up-to-date engine. We could have both: old school AND new.
God knows I am worn out with the ugliness in CO. The male face [the ONE that they have] is so ugly that I cant force myself to roll a male alt there, and I notice that many of the male alts I do see are helmeted or heavily masked.
They have three dinky zones there. How many did CoX have, like... 29?!!! Little zones, big zones, giant zones, dark zones sunshiny zones space zones this that and the other. Many of them very beautiful. CO is to CoX as a newspaper ad insert is to The Complete Works of Shakespeare.
I imagine that if City of Heroes hadn't been killed off by NCSoft, we would be seeing more normal map tricks like they were starting to do with the Steampunk update, to try and improve the quality of the graphics without having to mess with the actual poly density too much. It really did help mask the fact that CoH's character meshes were of a poly density close to that of Quake 3 Arena's models.
I bring this up mainly as a counterpoint to the people who are saying that "City of Heroes didn't NEED a graphics update, it was perfect the way it was!" City of Heroes never had a stagnant level of graphics quality. Cryptic and Paragon were always trying to find ways to improve it as time went on. Newer zones looked better than older zones, and whenever they went back and revamped a zone, they wound up improving the quality of the graphics there.
It's true that graphics quality standards will be a never-ending treadmill for the foreseeable future, and you will get idiots who sneer at games in development as having the graphics from games five years ago. On the other hand, there's absolutely nothing wrong with wanting to see your favorite games get a visual facelift, to bring them closer to contemporary standards of graphics quality.
Half-Life 1 got it in the form of Black Mesa (http://www.blackmesasource.com/).
Command and Conquer: Renegade got it in the form of Renegade X (http://www.renegade-x.com/).
And you know what? I would still want to see what City of Heroes would be like if it used an engine like the ones in the Grand Theft Auto series. Not just because the newer engines have a lot more contemporary graphics technology available, but because the GTA engines would allow for all of Paragon City to be simulated, rather than as a collection of walled-off zones.
Quote from: MaidMercury on March 05, 2014, 04:39:29 AM
Should I throw out my 80's music because it is 'dated'?...Minecraft looks like old school Nintendo but it seems popular.
CoH, the way it was, updated or not, is my game of choice. Graphics don't capture the sense of community we had....most GTA players I know, play awhile and drop off.
Exactly - the graphics were great for what it was and certainly was improved on since 2004.
Even if we never got any updates ever I would take the game back in a heartbeat.
I think if it happened, all current projects would experience a "slight delay" in development, since all current developers would want to re-experience CoH for a bit before continuing with what they have... :)