http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/12/04/ncsoft-undergoing-realignment/ (http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/12/04/ncsoft-undergoing-realignment/)
Good news or bad? If they cut and run from the Western market, they might not care what results from CoH fallout.
Can't believe the word "realignment" got used again.
If we assume "realignment" means what it did the last time, then yeah, NCsoft West is closing. 8)
They keep using that word... I do not think it means what they think it means....
So... Good? Bad? Karma anyone?
Even though this is tragic and does not portend well for those left in Seattle, I am glad this topic was given its own thread. It is another piece of the puzzle which can be added to the ones like NCSoft selling off Aion EU and Lineage 2 EU to other publishers there, and of course all the NA/EU MMO closures over the years. Personally I've felt for over a year that NCSoft has been pulling out of the west, I just didn't think they'd do it so brutally with CoH.
What defies logic is how they can still think they'll be la-dee-da fine launching new grind fests like Blade & Soul and Wildstar here. Do they really think we can't see through their "quick money grab for the box fees they can't get in Asia" schtick? Do they really think anyone will expect anything after that other than lag, a permanent infestation of gold farmers, buggy, untested patches, an overpriced cash shop, then a closure when gamers least expect it?
Too bad this didn't happen sooner too. Maybe all the naysayers who were saying "CoH closed because it failed" would shut up about it. There's obviously more going on here. Sounds like they're just going to keep cutting things until they (hopefully) see black ink again.
Frankly, I've been expecting this since I heard that Paragon was being shut down.
Sucks for the employees in Seattle, but I really believe that NCSoft's strategy that they're "realigning" into involves shutting down all development and support outside of the corporate office. NC Interactive and its subsidiaries are the first target, maybe because of internal politics, maybe not. Any branches will be either closed or turned into skeleton publishing arms to support titles developed in Seoul. I'd expect Carbine to be next on the chopping block, probably in a year once Wildstar is out the door.
The only possible exception is ArenaNet, but I don't believe even they are completely safe.
Quote from: TimtheEnchanter on December 05, 2012, 12:55:39 AM
Too bad this didn't happen sooner too. Maybe all the naysayers who were saying "CoH closed because it failed" would shut up about it. There's obviously more going on here. Sounds like they're just going to keep cutting things until they (hopefully) see black ink again.
This. And: I honestly think the realignment is code for pulling out of the west, just as TimtheEnchanter said.
NCSoft isn't through 'realigning' that office. The realignment will likely continue with it's closure. They are exiting the American market, post haste. Those in that office left need to think seriously about what they're fighting for, as it's not their jobs, those are lost. Just a matter of when.
Were I working there, knowing what I know? I'd be bailing unless I was getting a very nice, up front bonus to stick around to the bitter end. Better to have a job hunting egg if I had to stick around to shut it down. Otherwise, I'm looking/leaving now.
Were I working there. I don't so...
/I'm serious... that ship is the Titanic, it's just a matter of when now.
Where's one of our artists? We need an editorial-style comic of a ship labelled "NCSOFT" and an iceberg labeled "COH Closure" with the CEO going "ALL AHEAD FULL!"
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=i.qkme.me%2F7c3w.jpg)
Go home, Tim. You're drunk. 8)
Quote from: dwturducken on December 05, 2012, 01:36:53 AMGo home, Tim. You're drunk. 8)
Am not! *falls off bar stool*
Quote from: cmgangrel on December 05, 2012, 01:19:44 AM
Arenanet, from what I can remember of Samuraiko/Dark Respite posting on the official boards before they were closed down, are far safer than we think. From what she said (and if i remember correctly), they have the ability to buy back the GW IP and go it themselves if NCsoft do try to shut them down...
ArenaNet owns the IP to Guild Wars, NCsoft handles the production side of things - or vice versa. But if NCsoft decided to shut down the game, ArenaNet has first crack at buying it back themselves.
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
Quote from: cmgangrel on December 05, 2012, 01:29:55 AM
Just to point out that Beastyle still has a job in that office (for now at least) according to @AbiterFabulous (https://twitter.com/ArbiterFabulous)
Surprised that no one asked about how he was doing on these boards though.
I had no idea he was still with NCsoft. I thought he had left for something different altogether.
Then again, I was not a close follower of the devs. I just knew him as the red ligerbearbull guy that hung out with the classy robot spreading cheer and talking in red text.
Quote from: TimtheEnchanter on December 05, 2012, 01:38:52 AM
Am not! *falls off bar stool*
*Picks Tim up and drapes him across the bar*
Tim??? Are you the same Tim that used to hang out on the planning boards for CoH?
Sounds to me like they are trying to dump America-based workers. They might bethinking that programmers and developers are a lot cheaper in Asia than here in the US.
Quote from: jlucifer on December 05, 2012, 04:20:28 AM
Sounds to me like they are trying to dump America-based workers. They might bethinking that programmers and developers are a lot cheaper in Asia than here in the US.
They and everyone else that needs tech talent.
Even Disney Interactive, the current pitch target for the ashes of COH, is starting to outsource, and not just drone skills. Creative talent, which was once considered "safe" from outsourcing.
http://blog.makingsense.com/2012/11/disney-outsourcing-latin-america/
I'd expect as Free to Play becomes the dominant model for gaming, the pressure for cheaper tech labor only intensifies.
I really need to win the lottery.
Then I could show (or at least attempt to) these two-bit wanna-bes that Integrity actually DOES mean something.
Realignment means fire the western workers who get paid a lot.
Yeah, just saw this update on Gamespot.com...
First thought: "Realignment doesn't mean what we know it means."
Gotta love companies outside the US firing people here! /sarcasm
Quote from: Samuraiko on December 05, 2012, 02:14:59 AM
ArenaNet owns the IP to Guild Wars, NCsoft handles the production side of things - or vice versa. But if NCsoft decided to shut down the game, ArenaNet has first crack at buying it back themselves.
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
It is my understanding that NCSoft aquired ArenaNet last year. (http://www.gamezone.com/news/ncsoft_acquires_arenanet) They are as likely to be able to buy anything back and regain independence as Paragon Studios was. Actually... less. Guild Wars 2 was a huge success. There is absolute zero chance they will sell or license the GW1 IP to anyone as long as they decide to keep GW2 running.
If I'm missing somethinghere, I would love to know what it is.
Quote from: Starsman on December 05, 2012, 05:04:42 PM
It is my understanding that NCSoft aquired ArenaNet last year. (http://www.gamezone.com/news/ncsoft_acquires_arenanet) They are as likely to be able to buy anything back and regain independence as Paragon Studios was. Actually... less. Guild Wars 2 was a huge success. There is absolute zero chance they will sell or license the GW1 IP to anyone as long as they decide to keep GW2 running.
If I'm missing somethinghere, I would love to know what it is.
I've seen it stated a few times around here - without knowing for certain that the people making the statements are in fact correct - that Areanet has as part of its contract that governs NCSoft's acquisition of them that, should NCSoft wish to terminate its ownership of Areanet, Areanet has the right to buy itself - and all relevant IP - back from NCSoft.
Quote from: Codewalker on December 05, 2012, 12:59:40 AM
Frankly, I've been expecting this since I heard that Paragon was being shut down.
Sucks for the employees in Seattle, but I really believe that NCSoft's strategy that they're "realigning" into involves shutting down all development and support outside of the corporate office. NC Interactive and its subsidiaries are the first target, maybe because of internal politics, maybe not. Any branches will be either closed or turned into skeleton publishing arms to support titles developed in Seoul. I'd expect Carbine to be next on the chopping block, probably in a year once Wildstar is out the door.
The only possible exception is ArenaNet, but I don't believe even they are completely safe.
You know, I was thinking about this and to be devil's advocate (and lord I don't want to defend this company for any reason!) most MMO teams get heavily downsized either immediately after launch or a few months soon after once all big bugs and issues are addressed. Fact is you need a way smaller team to run an MMO than to start it up (unless you want to work into paid expansions ASAP.)
It happened to CoH after every expansion release and it has happened to almost every MMO out there. The only big difference is how it's managed. Usually a large chunk of the team gets reallocated to other projects or titles. NCSoft has a mess in the US, they have studios split all over. They never consolidated things neatly in a single state like SoE did, so moving team from one studio to the other is not trivial, and much cheaper to just hire local talent than paying relocation costs.
My immediate guess: they want a localization team working on B&S now, but can't afford hiring people, nor moving people over to the studio. They may also want to refocus some of the west branch budget into speeding up Wildstar's development. Since GW2 is done and stable, it's time to "realign focus"
Quote from: Segev on December 05, 2012, 05:13:00 PM
I've seen it stated a few times around here - without knowing for certain that the people making the statements are in fact correct - that Areanet has as part of its contract that governs NCSoft's acquisition of them that, should NCSoft wish to terminate its ownership of Areanet, Areanet has the right to buy itself - and all relevant IP - back from NCSoft.
I see. Would be interesting to see how that contract is worded, because there can be an insane number of loopholes, like "we are not terminating our ownership... we just want to relocate the studio to Korea, so you either come with us or you quit!"
Quote from: Segev on December 05, 2012, 05:13:00 PM
I've seen it stated a few times around here - without knowing for certain that the people making the statements are in fact correct - that Areanet has as part of its contract that governs NCSoft's acquisition of them that, should NCSoft wish to terminate its ownership of Areanet, Areanet has the right to buy itself - and all relevant IP - back from NCSoft.
The right to buy it won't automatically mean they can buy it, as we saw with our game.
Quote from: Segev on December 05, 2012, 05:13:00 PM
I've seen it stated a few times around here - without knowing for certain that the people making the statements are in fact correct - that Areanet has as part of its contract that governs NCSoft's acquisition of them that, should NCSoft wish to terminate its ownership of Areanet, Areanet has the right to buy itself - and all relevant IP - back from NCSoft.
I believe NCSoft *is* trying to remove its entire presence in North America, and centralize in Korea. I'm not sure what will happen to Guild Wars 2, but it's likely if you're a player of any of their games from the U.S., you'll have to look forward to almost no support (the support crew would be centralized in Korea too), servers located in Korea - creating connection problems for players of games like Aion and GW2, as well as weird maintenance windows - and slow future development, since Korean language versions would be released first.
The only positive to GW2 is it's relatively independent, and they can search for a new publisher, or go independent, if they don't like the new terms (very likely that all servers and support will be relocated to Korea). If they can't agree, though, we may see them disappear as well.
It would appear that the "realignment" involves the probability of NCSoft releasing marketing and PR for individual games back to the studios that produce those games, rather than handling all marketing for all games themselves.
This is, I think, a good sign for the individual studios.