Last Friday, I initiated contact via several email boxes at NCSoft; an "operation carpet bombing", if you will. I was hoping at least one would get through, or that I would annoy NCSoft enough that a real person would contact me asking me to stop; at which point I would initiate contact with, and negotiate with, that person. Rather than an offer for a buyout, I offered NCSoft the chance to license City of Heroes, so they hold on to the value of the IP, and earn a percentage of the profits, without having to pay the costs of operation. Of course, they ignored me.
So today, I have initiated contact with Nexon. I'm actually asking for Nexon's help; they are not the enemy. Therefore, I'm leaving the exact content of the email private for now, until I get a reply from them.
I have one more plan I'm currently working on, but I'm keeping that quiet for now because I learned my lesson about posting info about things that I'm not quite fully invested in yet. :)
More info to come...I hope.
Today I began sending the PDF of the media story nicely put together about the substitution of Boobs and Shame for CoX to feminist bloggers.
This could be amusing.
And this is why I am grateful for this board full of people so much cleverer than I. I would not have thought of sending it there, and yet it seems so obvious in retrospect. Thanks, VV!
TheManga, when you say you sent them this offer, did you do it as an individual or as a representative of a specific group or as a general "Please try something like this!" suggestion? I ask because I'm curious what has and has not been tried, and because I'd like to consider ways to help bolster your effort based on what your plan is should NCSoft actually respond.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 13, 2012, 01:39:59 AM
Today I began sending the PDF of the media story nicely put together about the substitution of Boobs and Shame for CoX to feminist bloggers.
This could be amusing.
Please tell me you sent one to Gail Simone!
Who exactly do you represent that you could make them an offer?
Also, as many of us have gone over in other threads, NCsoft will be more receptive to offers after their fiscal year ends when they can write off the Shutdown. Provided, between then and now, that someone doesn't kick up a shitstorm in the media about them that actually makes an impact on their stance, anyway.
Quote from: Segev on October 13, 2012, 05:22:49 AMTheManga, when you say you sent them this offer, did you do it as an individual or as a representative of a specific group or as a general "Please try something like this!" suggestion? I ask because I'm curious what has and has not been tried, and because I'd like to consider ways to help bolster your effort based on what your plan is should NCSoft actually respond.
I have access to a software company and a development studio (both LLC's), so I sent the email representing those. I did not mention the Titan network yet, though, because I assumed TonyV contacted them already - I wanted this to appear as a totally new offer to minimize its already high chance of being ignored.
The plan, I mentioned once before. If they respond positively and agree, obtain a license to operate CoH, get the "keys to the city" so to speak, and then form a new Paragon Studios (this is mostly for tax and investment capital reasons, not just to avoid using an existing company) which would actually manage and run the game. And then there may be some fundraising involved, or requests for volunteers to handle some of the transition work, because for the first few months, the game would have to operate and make a lot of changes without any previous financial backing. But it would be a lot less funding needed than if the IP were bought out instead.
Anyway, it's a moot point so far since they haven't contacted me back. I suppose they still could. Who knows, miracles can happen.
I did PM TonyV saying I was going to take a shot at it after he posted that his own attempts to contact NCSoft weren't working, so he knew I was going to try. He also knows my next step and why I'm contacting Nexon, but I need to keep that part quiet until I hear back from them. :)
Quote from: LunaEclypse on October 13, 2012, 11:36:50 AM
Who exactly do you represent that you could make them an offer?
Also, as many of us have gone over in other threads, NCsoft will be more receptive to offers after their fiscal year ends when they can write off the Shutdown. Provided, between then and now, that someone doesn't kick up a shitstorm in the media about them that actually makes an impact on their stance, anyway.
As noted above, I have access to both an small, active software company and a development studio. I can only represent them for now - though I told TonyV I would be making an attempt, I don't really represent the Titan community.
NCSoft will not be more receptive once the game is shut down, that's an incorrect rumor. They can write off the cost of licensing the IP and/or selling the game regardless, so they're better off selling or licensing it now while they can get more for it - especially since the shitstorm is already well in progress, and handing off CoH would stop it.
I would like to just see if anyone contacts you at all. They way they are conducting themselves in this matter is atrocious.
Quote from: HEATSTROKE on October 13, 2012, 04:14:15 PM
They way they are conducting themselves in this matter is atrocious.
Oh, on the contrary... ;)
(https://i.imgur.com/Hgmmb.jpg)
If a legitimate offered is ignored by a corporation, those behind the offer have the right to approach the stockholders of that corporation. I can name three different occasions this happened, and none of them turned out well for the CEO.
Quote from: downix on October 13, 2012, 05:49:15 PM
If a legitimate offered is ignored by a corporation, those behind the offer have the right to approach the stockholders of that corporation. I can name three different occasions this happened, and none of them turned out well for the CEO.
That's some good advice, Downix.
Not just for TheManga to pursue, but possibly also for Paragon Studios and any other interested parties there may be out there.
Quote from: Knightslayer on October 13, 2012, 05:55:08 PM
That's some good advice, Downix.
Not just for TheManga to pursue, but possibly also for Paragon Studios and any other interested parties there may be out there.
That may be why I'm contacting Nexon. :)
Quote from: TheManga on October 14, 2012, 01:18:44 AM
That may be why I'm contacting Nexon. :)
Yeah, as their biggest shareholder it's a smart move. ;D
*crosses fingers* Here's to hoping they are more communicative than NCSoft has proven to be.
Godspeed, Manga.
Quote from: TheManga on October 14, 2012, 01:18:44 AM
That may be why I'm contacting Nexon. :)
May the gods lend you the clout you need!
We await your return in the trenches Manga...may it be with even a glimmer of good news
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 13, 2012, 01:39:59 AM
Today I began sending the PDF of the media story nicely put together about the substitution of Boobs and Shame for CoX to feminist bloggers.
This could be amusing.
Send me a copy when your done with that. My friend is a feminist and shes in a group. She can distribute it. I can let you know what their resposes were. I'll have her type something so i can copy paste for ya.
Quote from: downix on October 13, 2012, 05:49:15 PM
If a legitimate offered is ignored by a corporation, those behind the offer have the right to approach the stockholders of that corporation. I can name three different occasions this happened, and none of them turned out well for the CEO.
Really now, well this is helpful info. I hope it works.
Aye, wow. And even if this doesn't get us to the table, maybe we'll at least get an answer that makes sense.
Quote from: Moonfyire101 on October 14, 2012, 04:32:51 PM
Send me a copy when your done with that. My friend is a feminist and shes in a group. She can distribute it. I can let you know what their resposes were. I'll have her type something so i can copy paste for ya.
I could be mistaken, but I believe VV was referring to this: http://stormlord.us/NCSoft%20Realignment.pdf
Oh Lord...and you released this to feminist bloggers? This could get way out of control...which I suppose might well be amusing, VV. But I hope you are mentally prepared to accept the long term consequences of your actions. It won't end with CoH - those gals never do things by halves.
Quote from: The White Rager on October 14, 2012, 08:51:10 PM
Oh Lord...and you released this to feminist bloggers? This could get way out of control...which I suppose might well be amusing, VV. But I hope you are mentally prepared to accept the long term consequences of your actions. It won't end with CoH - those gals never do things by halves.
What, you mean in that war will be declared on the entire gaming industry?
Yes, I was referring to Segev's press release, Moonfyire. Although I would direct your friend to this as well:
http://gomakemeasandwich.wordpress.com/2011/09/21/blade-and-soul-youre-doing-it-wrong/ (http://gomakemeasandwich.wordpress.com/2011/09/21/blade-and-soul-youre-doing-it-wrong/)
I've been sticking with femgeek bloggers, at least for now. Pretty much ones that game themselves. I've not yet resorted to taking it outside that group (which is kind of dauntingly huge, actually). Since they are gamers, it's a more friendly audience. I'm using Segev's original release (hey, guys can be feminists too!) with his contact information because I sure as hell am not comfortable with claiming I wrote something that well put together.
Quote from: TheManga on October 14, 2012, 01:18:44 AM
That may be why I'm contacting Nexon. :)
May not be a bad idea.. Considering
"There is a general atmosphere among the game community that Nexon is a business, not a game developer," said an industry official in condition of anonymity. "
https://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/tech/2012/09/129_117086.html
Yes indeed, Nexon's history as a developer is less than stellar, but their history as a company that buys up other developers and then markets those other folks' games is somewhat more successful. Which is why I find the collaboration of Nexon and NCSoft...interesting.
(Oh, one thing btw - I've noticed the Korea Times site has a habit of listing article links as https:// which can make some browsers throw a wobbler - I know it makes Firefox cry incorrectly about "untrusted connections". Usually if you just remove the 's' from the https it displays the page fine)
QuoteWhat, you mean in that war will be declared on the entire gaming industry?
I don't know
what I mean, exactly. I just know that once enough momentum gets going, there's no way to predict what's gonna happen next. These people can be scary :-[
Hmm, reading that article, makes it sound as if buying CoH and promoting it would be exactly in Nexon's style. Very interesting. We do have proven success, done with little or no advertising. I've played games owned by Nexon and my impression has been good.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 14, 2012, 11:36:01 PM
Yes, I was referring to Segev's press release, Moonfyire. Although I would direct your friend to this as well:
http://gomakemeasandwich.wordpress.com/2011/09/21/blade-and-soul-youre-doing-it-wrong/ (http://gomakemeasandwich.wordpress.com/2011/09/21/blade-and-soul-youre-doing-it-wrong/)
I've been sticking with femgeek bloggers, at least for now. Pretty much ones that game themselves. I've not yet resorted to taking it outside that group (which is kind of dauntingly huge, actually). Since they are gamers, it's a more friendly audience. I'm using Segev's original release (hey, guys can be feminists too!) with his contact information because I sure as hell am not comfortable with claiming I wrote something that well put together.
Aw... shucks. :-[ (pretend that's smiling instead of frowning, darn it)
That's awfully high praise, considering the source. (And all I did was use Word to paste pictures in and publish to .pdf. ^^; But seriously, thanks for the praise.)
Quote from: The White Rager on October 15, 2012, 02:06:38 AM
I don't know what I mean, exactly. I just know that once enough momentum gets going, there's no way to predict what's gonna happen next. These people can be scary :-[
Don't be afraid sonny. Granny Feminist won't hurt you....
I dunno...well, I'm out of the line of fire myself. I'll stick with being amused. It's certainly a great way to start a new angle that is sure to bit NCSoft hard. This sort of thing takes off and keeps going. There will be serious pain over this.
However...I do want to remind everyone of our original goals of keeping our nose clean with NCSoft. Lately we have been getting dangerously close to launching some serious smear style campaigns. We have a style and a hero face we've tried hard to maintain since this started, but I'm seeing it start to fall off here. Let's please stay on target, keep the original attitude. It's not over yet. It's not time to go into revenge mode. Don't forget that.
We're not yet into revenge mode; we're moving a bit into "we also have a stick, not just a carrot" mode, though. "Here's why what you're doing is a BAD BUSINESS DECISION."
It's not "playing nice" anymore, but we are still in "draw attention and make them feel it" mode rather than any sort of "scorched earth" campaign.
Quote from: The White Rager on October 15, 2012, 03:16:56 PMHowever...I do want to remind everyone of our original goals of keeping our nose clean with NCSoft. Lately we have been getting dangerously close to launching some serious smear style campaigns. We have a style and a hero face we've tried hard to maintain since this started, but I'm seeing it start to fall off here. Let's please stay on target, keep the original attitude. It's not over yet. It's not time to go into revenge mode. Don't forget that.
Hmm, I don't think 'revenge' is where we're at yet, and 'smear' is an awfully subjective expression. What constitutes a smear? Saying something about someone when what you're saying is the truth? Or would the message have to be an outright lie to qualify as a 'smear'?
Seems to me all we're currently doing is pointing out flaws in our game's corporate patron that we'd previously been kind enough to overlook. Flaws like a complete lack of communication, a history of killing MMOs, and the notion that closing a 100% western themed game in a western market and replacing it with a 100% Korean themed game is a good piece of marketing ;)
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 15, 2012, 09:34:15 AM
Don't be afraid sonny. Granny Feminist won't hurt you....
Unless you want her to...
"What constitutes a smear?"
As you say, undefined term, legally. If you say bad things about others that are false, that's slander. Print it, it's libel. True and verifiable things you can say all you want; it's called journalism.
"I do want to remind everyone of our original goals of keeping our nose clean with NCSoft. Lately we have been getting dangerously close to launching some serious smear style campaigns."
To be honest, I've kinda accepted that NCSoftcore fully intends to shut the servers down as planned, and there's nothin' we can do about it. I've been in revenge mode for weeks. And I'm pretty sure the damage has already been done: NCSoftcore and Nexon won't be able to do business with Western gamers for the foreseeable future unless they change their ways. Now we just translate all the journalism into Korean.
I can't afford revenge, sadly. Either I fight to save CoH, or I fight to market a replacement. Revenge just taints all of those and makes my job harder.
I'm with TheManga, here. Much as I occasionally have private revenge fantasies, it's almost never worth even trying to follow through. Best to focus on doing something to improve yourself than to tear somebody else down.
Quote from: Segev on October 15, 2012, 06:47:54 PM
I'm with TheManga, here. Much as I occasionally have private revenge fantasies, it's almost never worth even trying to follow through. Best to focus on doing something to improve yourself than to tear somebody else down.
True, but there are some circumstances where lighting candles only goes so far. There are definitely certain companies, for example, that the gaming industry would be much better off without. The biggest one being EA, which has been in serious trouble recently. NCsoft seems to be interested in stealing the title from EA. Karma may or may not be real, but it probably at least partially is inspired by the reality of cause&effect. You can only push so much before you get pushed back, and NC has reached that point.
We've been keeping the flame lit for over a month now and the darkness isn't wavering. Sometimes you just have to cast magic missile and attack the darkness head on. ;)
Ah, but that's not revenge. Revenge is bending your efforts towards retaliation. What we're doing is called "persuasion." How heavy the scare-quotes are depends on who's saying it and how.
Also, some things that may seem "revenge" serve a purpose.
If, once CoH closes, NCSoft finds that consumer reviews regularly 1-star their products because of the parent company's "history of unreliable community support." That's not revenge. That's making sure that people are able to make informed purchasing decisions while simultaneously making sure that NCSoft learns the true costs of some of its business practices. Perhaps, then, they may learn of more community-friendly methods to separate themselves from a property.
Gail Simone is going to say something supportive on her blog...and if I know her, she's going to have a LOT that ISN'T supportive about Boobs and Shame to say after the video I just sent her.
If you thought the one you saw before was bad? Get a load of this. (Ladies, please take a tranq before viewing). This is their "dance" emote for the female. And oh, yeah, that little black "Victoria's Secret" number she's wearing is one of the standard costumes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM5rgsmtO4k (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM5rgsmtO4k)
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 16, 2012, 12:00:33 AM
Gail Simone is going to say something supportive on her blog...and if I know her, she's going to have a LOT that ISN'T supportive about Boobs and Shame to say after the video I just sent her.
If you thought the one you saw before was bad? Get a load of this. (Ladies, please take a tranq before viewing). This is their "dance" emote for the female. And oh, yeah, that little black "Victoria's Secret" number she's wearing is one of the standard costumes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM5rgsmtO4k (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM5rgsmtO4k)
O.O
Okay, that's even worse than it first appeared!
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=cdn2.sbnation.com%2Fimported_assets%2F363627%2Fthird-party-facepalm_medium.jpg)
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 16, 2012, 12:00:33 AMIf you thought the one you saw before was bad? Get a load of this. (Ladies, please take a tranq before viewing). This is their "dance" emote for the female. And oh, yeah, that little black "Victoria's Secret" number she's wearing is one of the standard costumes.
I...really want you to be kidding right now. Or I want this to be from the wrong game, or...
I fully admit, even from a male point of view that is just...
ok, is there a word for that?
Sleazy?
Skanky?
Embarassing?
I think the word sad sums it up for me.
Words fail me......
It's not even sexy, not just because it's trying too hard, but because OMG THAT FACE. :o
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 16, 2012, 12:00:33 AM
Gail Simone is going to say something supportive on her blog...and if I know her, she's going to have a LOT that ISN'T supportive about Boobs and Shame to say after the video I just sent her.
If you thought the one you saw before was bad? Get a load of this. (Ladies, please take a tranq before viewing). This is their "dance" emote for the female. And oh, yeah, that little black "Victoria's Secret" number she's wearing is one of the standard costumes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM5rgsmtO4k (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM5rgsmtO4k)
WOW, um, uh, gasp...WTF. There are just no words to describe the complete and utter WASTE of what could have been a nice game.
The play control, backgrounds, smoothness of animation, and overall character detail appear incredible....and what they decided to *use* it to emphasize and promote make me want to absolutely vomit....WHY are the wasting what could have been a quality game (even if *FAR* from original) by turning it into a cheap porno flick. Beautiful textures and backgrounds with the most explotive piece of garbage I have ever seen attempt to masquarade as a game.
That is just utterly degrading to women and gamers in general. By all means court the lowest common demoninator, the guys who are so stupid and desperate to wack off to over exagerated female *objects* that will be controled by other male players. I anticipate a high female toon population and a painfully low female player population
Not that I have *anything* against people who are actually gay or trans, I want to be clear....but the idea of the likely homophobic morons, who will play this, wacking off to other guys masquarading as women...It would serve them right. And then when boobs & sluts is shuttered by ncsoft, using whatever lame excuse they use this time we have to accept *that* crowd among the honored dead of real games <ugh>. We can at least hold torches in the air. For them shafts of wood, I do hope they get splinters.
Okay I'm done with my little snark fest...but dear lord that is simply awful. :roll: ??? :o :-[ >:(
And it's not the only dance either, like WoW, each race and gender gets their own dance:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KV2UPa44w8&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KV2UPa44w8&feature=related)
Watching them... the legs keep driving me batty. They look bolted on, not part of the body at all. Game-experience breaker for me.
Maybe they're just trying to encourage fitness?
http://www.cnn.com/video/?hpt=hp_c3#/video/bestoftv/2012/07/31/ac-ridiculist-exercise-equipment.cnn
Quote from: downix on October 16, 2012, 01:30:39 AM
And it's not the only dance either, like WoW, each race and gender gets their own dance:
But the "adult female" dances are all universally modeled after stripper moves.
Quote from: downix on October 16, 2012, 01:30:39 AM
Watching them... the legs keep driving me batty. They look bolted on, not part of the body at all. Game-experience breaker for me.
The legs are also way too big around and way way way too long. Also, apparently the chicks have vaginas of epic sizes because there's like gaping chasms between their legs.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 16, 2012, 01:41:08 AM
But the "adult female" dances are all universally modeled after stripper moves.
Really? Of the ones in the montage of all the dance moves, only two of them looked overtly sexual to me. And only the one that you linked, VV, looked like it couldn't be anything BUT sexual. (And I agree with codewalker; it was
not sexy. It was just...
not. Nothing alluring about it, and frankly, the oversexualization and the CGI makes the ones trying to be sexy fall into Uncanny Valley very, very hard.)
Quotehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM5rgsmtO4k
There's sexy, and there's trying way, way too hard. This is the latter.
>:(
Quotehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KV2UPa44w8&feature=related
That female dancing at 1:56... what is WRONG WITH HER LIMBS?!
:gonk:
My right eye and the left corner of my mouth is twitching and I'm not sure why. I think this is... rage? Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's rage.
I'm a guy, and I love a bit of sex appeal in games. But... this is just... ugh. I wanna take these characters by the shoulders and shake them violently, yelling "HAVE YOU NO DIGNITY?!"
All of this beautiful texture and modelwork, gone to waste.
Quote from: Segev on October 16, 2012, 01:53:02 AM
Really? Of the ones in the montage of all the dance moves, only two of them looked overtly sexual to me. And only the one that you linked, VV, looked like it couldn't be anything BUT sexual. (And I agree with codewalker; it was not sexy. It was just...not. Nothing alluring about it, and frankly, the oversexualization and the CGI makes the ones trying to be sexy fall into Uncanny Valley very, very hard.)
I guess I hung out with strippers too much in my misspent youth (disclaimer: I could sew, I needed money, and they needed "costumes"). I pretty much watched all the "adult female" dance emotes and saw my former customers trying out their gear.
I want to take out an ad on Korean TV:
Women of Korea! This is what NCSoft wants the world to think you are like!
I thought strippers were supposed to be sexy. Alluring. This...isn't.
...sorry, it's bugging me that they'd put so much effort into something this overtly sexual that is supposed to be a "fun" aspect of your character (and I'll admit that there is a target audience for "sexy" == "fun")...and have it FAIL AT BEING SEXY. It's just plain unattractive.
Quote from: Segev on October 16, 2012, 02:05:36 AM
I thought strippers were supposed to be sexy. Alluring. This...isn't.
...sorry, it's bugging me that they'd put so much effort into something this overtly sexual that is supposed to be a "fun" aspect of your character (and I'll admit that there is a target audience for "sexy" == "fun")...and have it FAIL AT BEING SEXY. It's just plain unattractive.
They could have put the same amount of work into ballet moves or modern dance. Or floor gymnastics.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 16, 2012, 02:12:23 AM
They could have put the same amount of work into ballet moves or modern dance. Or floor gymnastics.
Absolutely.
And a fair number of the two that I didn't think looked overtly sexual were not disturbing to watch. The funny little kid dance with the running motions made me chuckle.
But even worse than WHAT they chose to do with the "sexy" dances is that the
failed in what was obviously their goal. So they made it offensive and repulsive on all levels, not just the moral and feminist outrage ones.
It's not really attractive at all. I've been in a strip club (friend's bachelor party) and those gals danced a whole lot better and more alluringly than that. Frankly after a bit I started checking out the pretty background art. They did do a good job on that at least. A pity it's being wasted on a porno game.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 16, 2012, 12:00:33 AM
If you thought the one you saw before was bad? Get a load of this. (Ladies, please take a tranq before viewing). This is their "dance" emote for the female. And oh, yeah, that little black "Victoria's Secret" number she's wearing is one of the standard costumes.
Good lord. I'm mildly tasteless about this sort of thing, and that still registers as insanely over the top, even to me.
Not to totally derail the original intent of this thread, but I really hope that part of the feminist message is strong representation of women in CoH (even though there is the option to go the stereotypical comic way..and the same can be done with men).
Actually, TR93, one of the strongest messages City offers is positive empowerment and equality for women.
Think about it for a moment. If we leave the players aside for a moment, every female character we see in the game is strong (some physically like Doc Delilah), confident (except Flambeaux), competant (some, like Lady Grey, very much so), rarely need rescuing (with one notable exception), and are more than capable of competing with the male characters in the game.
Women in City are not objectified. Yes, they may be somewhat lacking in fashion sense (Silver Mantis) but they are not there solely to be eye candy. They are there because they have goals and ambitions and plots all of their own. And some of those storylines have become absolute favorites (how many times have you replayed 'O Wretched Man'?)
Now lets add the players back into this arguement. Some of the most respected members of our community are women. We do not respect them because of their sex, we respect them because they are skilled players and active members of our community. They post regularly on the forums (quite often more intelligently than the men) offering reasonable advice and holding their own in debates. They are some of our greatest artists, bringing us pictures and videos, stuffed dolls and t-shirts, and stories of their adventures (not to mention rumors of a certain famous author who might be a player ...)
In short, we love the women of our game. Not because of their looks, but because of their character. And if that isn't a positive message for women, I don't know what is.
I watched the video. Everything about it was terrible. The dances were terrible, the body structure of the characters AND the bones/joints are all wrong (from a 3D character perspective). Speaking of perspective, that's wrong too. And the clothing is basically pajamas. Who goes fighting in pajamas?
Wait, I take that last part back. Groucho Marx shot an elephant in his pajamas. What that elephant was doing in his pajamas is anyone's guess.
GREAT use of a Marx Brothers quote there TheManga ;D
I often find the ferocity with which feminists and similar liberals pursue their agendas off-putting...but there are some causes that demand exception, where I'm glad someone is willing to get fierce about it. Blade and Soul is one of them, and I thought so before you showed us that video VV (I keep having to resist the urge to call you Misty. I read your Valdemar books back in high school long before I ever heard of this game, let alone your involvement in it). I question the sanity and/or initiative of any women who is not absolutely furious with it's existence. I question the taste of any men who enjoy it. There, see, no virtues at all.
Lord. And my search for some kind of game, somewhere, that I can possibly enjoy after having played CoH is still going absolutely nowhere. Is there no other light in the MMO universe at all? Everything may depend on that Plan Z, ultimately. In the meantime, maybe I'll just get more done in terms of homework. It's a good thing...really....*not convinced*.
I saw one of the dance videos from one of the links posted above, is this their new version of playboy channel? Instead of paying $30 a night, you can pay $15 a month and you watch and play all night? Umm......ewwwwwwww!!
Quote from: downix on October 13, 2012, 05:49:15 PM
If a legitimate offered is ignored by a corporation, those behind the offer have the right to approach the stockholders of that corporation. I can name three different occasions this happened, and none of them turned out well for the CEO.
Downix, I have a question for you, because I'm not knowledgeable in this area. Where did these different occasions take place? Generally meaning: which country? Can this instance be applied to a Korean company, if these occasions did not take place here? Or does Korea have a different set of rules, in general? Yes I know what most, if not all, think of NCSoft and that is a given. I am more curious about the country business style as a whole.
Quote from: Stormy Weathermaker on October 16, 2012, 10:12:40 PM
I saw one of the dance videos from one of the links posted above, is this their new version of playboy channel? Instead of paying $30 a night, you can pay $15 a month and you watch and play all night? Umm......ewwwwwwww!!
Downix, I have a question for you, because I'm not knowledgeable in this area. Where did these different occasions take place? Generally meaning: which country? Can this instance be applied to a Korean company, if these occasions did not take place here? Or does Korea have a different set of rules, in general? Yes I know what most, if not all, think of NCSoft and that is a given. I am more curious about the country business style as a whole.
One I do not know if it was in their home country or NCSoft's, the other I know of as happening within the US.
Korea until 15 years ago had shareholder rights, but the culture had few of them exercising that right. That all changed in 1998 with the successful lawsuit against Samsung by Jang Hasung. As a result of the litigation against large corporations, there is a general concern among Korean shareholders on their vested interest. It is a situation of cultural change.
Why didn't I think of this sooner. Contacting Mr. Hasung?
Sent an email. Cannot hurt.
Quote from: The White Rager on October 16, 2012, 09:29:01 PM
GREAT use of a Marx Brothers quote there TheManga ;D
I often find the ferocity with which feminists and similar liberals pursue their agendas off-putting...but there are some causes that demand exception, where I'm glad someone is willing to get fierce about it. Blade and Soul is one of them, and I thought so before you showed us that video VV (I keep having to resist the urge to call you Misty. I read your Valdemar books back in high school long before I ever heard of this game, let alone your involvement in it). I question the sanity and/or initiative of any women who is not absolutely furious with it's existence. I question the taste of any men who enjoy it. There, see, no virtues at all.
Lord. And my search for some kind of game, somewhere, that I can possibly enjoy after having played CoH is still going absolutely nowhere. Is there no other light in the MMO universe at all? Everything may depend on that Plan Z, ultimately. In the meantime, maybe I'll just get more done in terms of homework. It's a good thing...really....*not convinced*.
Oh some feminists (and I do consider myself a feminist) scare me too. But the depiction of women in Boobs and Shame sent my blood pressure up about fifty points, and I am perfectly willing to unleash the Kindly Ones on the perpetrators of that sad excuse for soft core porn.
I've had the same lack of luck finding a substitute MMO, or even a substitute solo game.
I cannot use twitch (console) controls. I've been stuck in the early levels of Portal for that reason ("Here!" said a friend, "Try this, it's relaxing and fun!" Uh, no. Spending three hours trying and failing to get the timing right on a move is neither relaxing nor fun. I do NOT have the hand/eye coordination for it and at 62 said hand/eye coordination is probably no longer possible to acquire.)
I loath grinds. I don't care how pretty they are. When in order to have a decently equipped character that doesn't faceplant on the first Lt or group of 3 minions you have to kill ten million rats (or pay a gold farmer), that is by definition, a grind. I'm looking at you, LotR and WoW.
I require good story. Without good story, it's just another grind.
I am not an accountant, and a game that requires me to spend half or more of my gaming time sorting through equipment, crafting equipment, farming for equipment, and trading equipment is not a game, it's a glorified accounting program. I'm looking at you, LotR and WoW.
I refuse to play a game where you can't be
good. Sorry, I got over "edgy anti-hero" a long time ago. I'm looking at you, Secret World (and you also fail on twitch controls).
So far, every single game I have looked at fails on one or more of those.
This won't be a permanent substitute and is entirely a different game feel, but I'm with you on a lot of those concerns re: videogames, and one game I really enjoyed that manages to be very casual and fun is "Plants vs. Zombies."
Another one unusual for how much I played it (I actually beat it!) is Psychonauts, but it IS a platformer and DOES require some twitch reflexes. I'm not a good twitch gamer, but I don't know how well you'd compare to me on it.
Quote from: Segev on October 17, 2012, 03:27:32 AM
This won't be a permanent substitute and is entirely a different game feel, but I'm with you on a lot of those concerns re: videogames, and one game I really enjoyed that manages to be very casual and fun is "Plants vs. Zombies."
Another one unusual for how much I played it (I actually beat it!) is Psychonauts, but it IS a platformer and DOES require some twitch reflexes. I'm not a good twitch gamer, but I don't know how well you'd compare to me on it.
I'm stuck in the lower levels on Psychonauts too. The Bouncy Ball section. I suck.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 17, 2012, 03:45:38 AM
I'm stuck in the lower levels on Psychonauts too. The Bouncy Ball section. I suck.
...accursed bouncy balls...
/me shakes fist
the game i been playing lately is borderlands 2, great story which very well ties to the first game and at the end allows for further room to expand
the only drawback is that you need be good at a first person shooter to play it (its 99.9% PVE but its still set in first person perspective)
Larry loves Borderlands 1 and 2, looked at me and said, sadly, "It will only make you insanely frustrated."
No, I am no good at first person shooters either.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 17, 2012, 09:32:09 AM
Larry loves Borderlands 1 and 2, looked at me and said, sadly, "It will only make you insanely frustrated."
No, I am no good at first person shooters either.
Yeah, they tend to be the kings of twitch gaming =P
How about Xcom: Enemy Unknown? It's a turnbased strategy game.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 17, 2012, 03:45:38 AM
I'm stuck in the lower levels on Psychonauts too. The Bouncy Ball section. I suck.
That's not sucking! That's the first truly difficult level. (Though you should have seen how frustrated I got on the cube-shaped level before it...)
With the exception of the race at the end, the bouncy-ball dungeon is, ironically, best played with patience and care. There is precision required, but I found the way to achieve it was simply to allow yourself to fail in a different way each time until you get a good idea how the level is laid out, because it's a 3D
mess in there.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 17, 2012, 09:32:09 AM
No, I am no good at first person shooters either.
There is always the option of the annoyingly addicting Civilization series of games. Zero twitch, turn based, the computer is a cheating so-and -so, the ability to conquer the world ...
It's a thought.
Same here, I hate grinding, and I suck at jump and run stuff. I did play WOW, but I hated the grinding needed for good equip. Mostly I was just lucky that I was a good healer and people wanted me to come with them so they helped me. But when somebody wanted to give me stuff just because I´m a girl i denied. I wanted to at least try and earn it.
But I must agree, COH is still the only game that is purely fun for me. It is also the game where I met quite some playing girls beside myself, and i loved to have them to play and chat with. I like to play with guys, but sometimes it needs a girl to have a good chat. (of course while healing a group, and my husband always wondered how I could do that without letting everyone die.)
Oh, and, Victoria Victrix, I must say this now. I adore you, and your engagement here. You have a new fan now, even though I first met your name some time ago when I read all of Marion Zimmer Bradley´s Books that i could get my hands on.
Ok, I am at work and clicked on that youtube link and had to close it down after about 5 seconds. I would get in so much trouble at work with that playing on my computer. That is soooo inappropriate!!!!
Actually, a game I really enjoyed playing before coming to CoH was Mabinogi. I left because of the combat system - I actually intended to come back but just wanted someplace where I could play fast, fierce, and dramatic. CoH scratched not only that itch, but a dozen others I hadn't even known I had...to the point that when I heard about the shutdown, I abruptly realized I'd been sold on it entirely, and never wanted to have to give it up.
But...I do recommend Mabinogi. Yes, it's anime style animation, but the world is fairly realistic, beautiful, extensive. You have to buy a pet for decent travel but it's a permanent purchase and comes with other perks as well (storage space, and many are just plain cool - tigers and dragons for instance. And griffons, but those were timed only. I got one). And the storytelling is absolutely magnificent. People make new toons to replay the first storyline because of how much they loved it and have fond memories of it, but they are ALL good, intricate, fulfilling. You truly feel like the main character of a novel, except its happening - simply superb. Unfortunately translation is not always the best, but really, it rarely gets in the way. None of this equipment nonsense - pretty much all weapons perform equally, FROM THE BEGINNING. It's all in how you use it, what skills you take. No classes, you figure out your ideal hybrid (or pure) build, but different races do some things better. It's the combat itself that will make or break you on it. Yes, it's truly different, and I loved it at first, but timing is so important and a little lag means your skill doesn't load fast enough...but since I left, there was some kind of major combat system change, I don't really understand what it involved yet, but I've been meaning to go back and find out. It may or may no be relevant anymore. But it's a game I'd be happy to go back to. Long term, you really can create unique character looks - to the extent that they have fashion shows and contests. Really is worth trying.
There's also Vindictus, which is heavily associated with Mabinogi, and I believe the storytelling is on par. But I haven't really played it a lot. Also, little roleplaying leeway. Maybe it's more flexible now. But in Mabinogi at least, you definitely don't have the clones thing - you even have a pretty wide range of looks available. And Pets storage make keeping more than one suit more practical.
By the way...you should try googling 'NCSoft stock chart, and clicking the first link you get. Yahoo finance, it's nice and accurate and up to date, and pretty interesting...let's just say if they were hoping for recovery, it didn't work ;D
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 16, 2012, 10:58:18 PM
Oh some feminists (and I do consider myself a feminist) scare me too. But the depiction of women in Boobs and Shame sent my blood pressure up about fifty points, and I am perfectly willing to unleash the Kindly Ones on the perpetrators of that sad excuse for soft core porn.
I've had the same lack of luck finding a substitute MMO, or even a substitute solo game.
I cannot use twitch (console) controls. I've been stuck in the early levels of Portal for that reason ("Here!" said a friend, "Try this, it's relaxing and fun!" Uh, no. Spending three hours trying and failing to get the timing right on a move is neither relaxing nor fun. I do NOT have the hand/eye coordination for it and at 62 said hand/eye coordination is probably no longer possible to acquire.)
I loath grinds. I don't care how pretty they are. When in order to have a decently equipped character that doesn't faceplant on the first Lt or group of 3 minions you have to kill ten million rats (or pay a gold farmer), that is by definition, a grind. I'm looking at you, LotR and WoW.
I require good story. Without good story, it's just another grind.
I am not an accountant, and a game that requires me to spend half or more of my gaming time sorting through equipment, crafting equipment, farming for equipment, and trading equipment is not a game, it's a glorified accounting program. I'm looking at you, LotR and WoW.
I refuse to play a game where you can't be good. Sorry, I got over "edgy anti-hero" a long time ago. I'm looking at you, Secret World (and you also fail on twitch controls).
So far, every single game I have looked at fails on one or more of those.
Question. What's your current opinion of Champions Online?
The writing's a bit...corny and a bit too stuck in "tongue and cheek comic book homage". Frankly, I'm glad Cryptic wasn't able to get the Champions IP when they were originally building CoH, the game and the lore benefited MIGHTILY by a fresh approach.
And yeah, the art style isn't to everyone's taste.
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=www.cox-supergroups.com%2FHyperstrike.MainCostume.png) vs (https://images.weserv.nl/?url=www.cox-supergroups.com%2FHyperstrike-CO.png)
The missions, unfortunately, are fairly hunt-heavy and the phone-number-less structure means you have to either grab multiple missions from a contact simultaneously or you are running back and forth a lot. Also, some of their comic-arc content (Looking at the Whiteout arcs) are buggy as hell (though they're slowly being fixed).
I'm going there because I already had a lifetime sub from way back (vendor comps at conventions are so convenient sometimes) so it's really hard to argue with "free". It was just never enough to actually distract me from City of Heroes.
Still, I'd like to hear others' opinions of the game.
ive posted elsewhere that ive had 0 interest in trying CO, the graphics make my eyes hurt, even with the no lines option and stuff and makes me think they have a 10 year old as their graphic designer
gameplay wise ive also had 0 interest in it, mostly because it would just feel like a cheap cheap knockoff of coh thus making me sad coh was gone, and because i had that style (no easy way to talk with your contacts, a bazillion "go here, hunt *****" type of mishs just isnt fun
Quote from: cmgangrel on October 17, 2012, 04:30:56 PM
I dunno, it still hasn't hit their low from mid-July (so just 3 months ago)... but they are still higher than they were at the start of 2011 (which btw, was not all that long AFTER the Q4 NCsoft financials, which included Going Rogues release... was the lack of overall impact from CoX responsible their share drop?)
Still, the small short-term trends and their relation (if any) to CoH-related news is interesting to look at, particularly AP33's birthday.
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=www.fragglerockforever.com%2FCoX%2Fncstocks.jpg)
The little hop at the end.. They dropped a new release on October 10th for Aion, new gear on Market Place and new content. I'm sure the stockholders loved that.
Quote from: JWBullfrog on October 16, 2012, 06:25:08 PM
Actually, TR93, one of the strongest messages City offers is positive empowerment and equality for women.
Think about it for a moment. If we leave the players aside for a moment, every female character we see in the game is strong (some physically like Doc Delilah), confident (except Flambeaux), competant (some, like Lady Grey, very much so), rarely need rescuing (with one notable exception), and are more than capable of competing with the male characters in the game.
Women in City are not objectified. Yes, they may be somewhat lacking in fashion sense (Silver Mantis) but they are not there solely to be eye candy. They are there because they have goals and ambitions and plots all of their own. And some of those storylines have become absolute favorites (how many times have you replayed 'O Wretched Man'?)
Now lets add the players back into this arguement. Some of the most respected members of our community are women. We do not respect them because of their sex, we respect them because they are skilled players and active members of our community. They post regularly on the forums (quite often more intelligently than the men) offering reasonable advice and holding their own in debates. They are some of our greatest artists, bringing us pictures and videos, stuffed dolls and t-shirts, and stories of their adventures (not to mention rumors of a certain famous author who might be a player ...)
In short, we love the women of our game. Not because of their looks, but because of their character. And if that isn't a positive message for women, I don't know what is.
Oh I know and agree. My concern is that an inarticulate appeal to the feminist movement might look like "look at this blade and soul picture, now grab a pitchfork", which could backfire if you simply
look at many of the City of Heroes icons, including Ghost Widow, Sister Psyche, and Desdemona (as well as Silver Mantis and Praetorian Bobcat). But, sending that exact message, i.e., mourning the loss of a game that held female characters, both npc and pc, in such high regard can go a long way, especially when you then consider the replacement being offered up.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 17, 2012, 09:32:09 AM
Larry loves Borderlands 1 and 2, looked at me and said, sadly, "It will only make you insanely frustrated."
No, I am no good at first person shooters either.
The Mechromancer DLC class would be good for you, then. I'm currently running with a skill that if you miss, each bullet has a 50% chance to head right towards and enemy, and another one that every time you kill or empty a clip, your accuracy goes down, but your damage goes up. Until you manually reload.
I'm about halfway through the game and even though my weapon of choice (a shotgun) has it's potential spread being about 3/4th of the screen, the ricochet effect plus the huge damage means that if I miss, half my pellets are still going to hit something.
Frequently I will aim and fire at a cluster of two or three guys, exactly one of which I'd hit under normal circumstances, and end up with two of them dead and the third one at half health.
And you get to summon a big, enemy-destroying robot every so often.
I say again, at least for social networking, Mabinogi can genuinely step in CoH's shoes. It's a very different game of course, but it has that unique touch, excellent socializing options, it's really a great game. Suddenly I'm remembering all the reasons I played it, and why I hadn't been leaving it for good when I tried CoH...yeah. Really worth looking at. Don't let the graphics stop you. Especially you VV - you want story telling? Frankly, Mabinogi kicks CoH's butt at it, and I acknowledge that CoH did it well. But Mabinogi tops every attempt I have ever seen elsewhere by so much, it's mind boggling.
Examples of the social thing: some mounts can carry TWO players - the one who bought it, and a hitchhiker. You can give other players rides, whether flying or riding. And there's this new (well it was when I left) newbie thing, where they could put in a request for help, and a senior player somewhere - picked at random - will get a scroll saying someone wants your help, and it will teleport you to the player if you want/can do it. When you're done helping him/her, you can get teleported back to where you were. Sounds more like it? Unfortunately they don't have an equivalent for that wonderful side-kicking system, but still, it does encourage players to look kindly on each other. There are PvP settings designed so you can compete without actually dying - you set the damage percentage way down and see who does better. And lots of great outside of combat stuff. It's a great place.
Well we have Borderlands 1 and 2 already, I suppose I can try Mechromancer. I'll put Larry on to Mabinogi and see what he says. Poppa is looking for a game too, and so far as I know hasn't found one.
CO is ugly, and I could put up with that although it would just bring back painful memories of how pretty our game is...but I just cannot take the "kill 10 rats" mishes ad infinitum. And no "cell phone..." ugh.
Quote from: The White Rager on October 17, 2012, 10:19:47 PM
I say again, at least for social networking, Mabinogi can genuinely step in CoH's shoes. I... -ultracut!-
going at the page: http://mabinogi.nexoneu.com/
say that the game was closed :-(
Quote from: angelo.pampalone on October 17, 2012, 10:53:43 PM
going at the page: http://mabinogi.nexoneu.com/
say that the game was closed :-(
:-\
Figures.
Quote from: angelo.pampalone on October 17, 2012, 10:53:43 PM
going at the page: http://mabinogi.nexoneu.com/
say that the game was closed :-(
Only the European version:
http://mabinogi.nexon.net/
Quote from: downix on October 17, 2012, 10:56:38 PM
Only the European version:
http://mabinogi.nexon.net/
Ty I'll try to download it tomorrow :-)
Quote from: downix on October 17, 2012, 10:56:38 PM
Only the European version:
http://mabinogi.nexon.net/
Passed it on to Larry. Doesn't look like the sort of thing that would appeal to Poppa, but you never know.
About the whole stripper dance thing, yup I used to be a stripper and yup that was pretty much how I used to dance. (BTW now they'd pay me to GTFO the stage! so don't go there) when watching that I was fully expecting a male toon to lay under her while she removed a looney (Our dollar coin) from his mouth with her breasts. :o
Ok, I clicked the links and, much like a video someone linked a while back, I think these are going to give me nightmares. And this coming from a guy whose hormones have been exceedingly slow to calm down since his teenage years (hooray self control and the wisdom of age!). Seriously, just... just... so much anatomy fail...
I also used to be a stripper, and I can tell you - for every one guy who wants the whole babydoll Lolita look, there were TWENTY who wanted a more mature girl with confidence, style, and grace. If I'd done the routine that chick in the dance video did, I'd have made a lot less.
What *THAT* game is doing is utterly revolting on so many levels.
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
Yeah, as someone who has donated hundreds to the Exotic Entertainers' College Fund, I can say that this looks more like a Hollywood executive's idea of a stripper dance. :)
Now this has me wondering if this is another cultural issue. Though to be fair (if NC is reading into the same thing I've been) the stereotype I've always seen is guys all fantasizing about ditzy cheerleaders who are 1 day over 18. For the stereotype's explanation for "mature girl with confidence, style, and grace", it shifts into dominatrix territory.
But... that's probably not it. Pedophilia art seems to be a non-issue in the East (or there's some kind of clever loophole that the entertainment industry there keeps using), that they're assuming that it's equally popular here.
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 17, 2012, 10:52:04 PM
Well we have Borderlands 1 and 2 already, I suppose I can try Mechromancer. I'll put Larry on to Mabinogi and see what he says. Poppa is looking for a game too, and so far as I know hasn't found one.
CO is ugly, and I could put up with that although it would just bring back painful memories of how pretty our game is...but I just cannot take the "kill 10 rats" mishes ad infinitum. And no "cell phone..." ugh.
Yeah. The SOCRATES interface is a lousy excuse for a cell phone.
It's like Cryptic went out of their way to obfuscate every helpful thing in the game...
Heh, I recently went back and played Diablo 2. My goodness a game with 800x600 graphics. However, now I recall why I liked that game, you just go out and blow stuff away and generally feel pretty powerful doing so. Teamwise, get a few paladins and a curse necromancer and watch mobs die. Feels like I was on an all buff/debuff (Defender, Controller, Corruptor and Mastermind team) :o
The good news is, this game is already bought and costs me nothing to switch to and friends with ancient computers can't complain about the game requiring the latest and greatest hardware.
VV you should go play this classic. Take a Barbarian and just hit stuff.
Quote from: Mistress Urd on October 18, 2012, 08:28:07 AM
Heh, I recently went back and played Diablo 2. My goodness a game with 800x600 graphics. However, now I recall why I liked that game, you just go out and blow stuff away and generally feel pretty powerful doing so. Teamwise, get a few paladins and a curse necromancer and watch mobs die. Feels like I was on an all buff/debuff (Defender, Controller, Corruptor and Mastermind team) :o
The good news is, this game is already bought and costs me nothing to switch to and friends with ancient computers can't complain about the game requiring the latest and greatest hardware.
VV you should go play this classic. Take a Barbarian and just hit stuff.
Diablo 3 isn't bad either. ;D
Quote from: Victoria Victrix on October 16, 2012, 10:58:18 PM
Oh some feminists (and I do consider myself a feminist) scare me too. But the depiction of women in Boobs and Shame sent my blood pressure up about fifty points, and I am perfectly willing to unleash the Kindly Ones on the perpetrators of that sad excuse for soft core porn.
I've had the same lack of luck finding a substitute MMO, or even a substitute solo game.
I cannot use twitch (console) controls. I've been stuck in the early levels of Portal for that reason ("Here!" said a friend, "Try this, it's relaxing and fun!" Uh, no. Spending three hours trying and failing to get the timing right on a move is neither relaxing nor fun. I do NOT have the hand/eye coordination for it and at 62 said hand/eye coordination is probably no longer possible to acquire.)
I loath grinds. I don't care how pretty they are. When in order to have a decently equipped character that doesn't faceplant on the first Lt or group of 3 minions you have to kill ten million rats (or pay a gold farmer), that is by definition, a grind. I'm looking at you, LotR and WoW.
I require good story. Without good story, it's just another grind.
I am not an accountant, and a game that requires me to spend half or more of my gaming time sorting through equipment, crafting equipment, farming for equipment, and trading equipment is not a game, it's a glorified accounting program. I'm looking at you, LotR and WoW.
I refuse to play a game where you can't be good. Sorry, I got over "edgy anti-hero" a long time ago. I'm looking at you, Secret World (and you also fail on twitch controls).
So far, every single game I have looked at fails on one or more of those.
My wife is 71, loves playing CoH, and these issues are pretty much exactly hers.
If you find a good game please post it. I'm looking, but at 47 there are games I can play that she can't (or won't) like.... and my eyes and twitch settings aren't as high as they used to be either... and my computer can't keep up with hers.
I play Lotro with my old gaming buddies, and it's pretty and there's good story telling, but there's so many annoying... go get me 10 moose steaks... kill a named boss in the area because he's keeping me away from the mooses... then get sent back to kill the (edit: "same") named boss... sigh.... and no super leap... and no auto turn to attack... sigh.
CoH was my first. I'm hoping it hasn't ruined me and my wife for all the rest. There's always Civ5 I suppose, but its not the same as arresting bad guys.
It's the same with me. City of Heroes was my first and only MMO. Of course I try others over the years, but I always come back because this game was different. I had things here I have never seen anywhere else.
After my last crapy try with Guild Wars 2 (Friends play it, good reviews and so on but a boooring gameplay with doing the same things over and over again with absolutly no teamplay) I made the decision: Thats it. There will never be an MMO again like City of Heroes, only MMOs like Warcraft and this is not my type of game. Now I play other games I miss over the years and see what's happening with Matt Positron Miller and the others (My last hope) and the Plan Z project here (My very last hope)...
Quote from: BobMc on November 02, 2012, 05:43:34 PMgo get me 10 moose steaks...
Fetch me ten bears arses, but not every bear bares an arse!
Is it a bare bear's arse, and do some bears bear arses that are not bare?
What if it is a rare bare bear's arse, and some bears bear arses that are bare but are not rare, and some bears bear arses that are rare but not bare and some bears bear arses that are neither bare nor rare? :roll:
Quote from: The Fifth Horseman on November 02, 2012, 08:46:50 PM
What if it is a rare bare bear's arse, and some bears bear arses that are bare but are not rare, and some bears bear arses that are rare but not bare and some bears bear arses that are neither bare nor rare? :roll:
You don't raise up the bar... :D
Quote from: Technerdoc on November 02, 2012, 05:57:20 PM
It's the same with me. City of Heroes was my first and only MMO. Of course I try others over the years, but I always come back because this game was different. I had things here I have never seen anywhere else.
Ya, I've tried out a lot of MMOs, mostly because of other friends playing them for a bit, but CoH has always been the game I've come back to. And even while I was playing other games I usually kept my subscription going. Just because I like the idea of CoH.