Titan Network
Community => General Discussion => Topic started by: Kriiden on April 15, 2013, 08:15:41 PM
-
The bombing during the Marathon. I felt it appropriate to create a thread in regards to this. I have a cousin who was running in the Marathon, and two more cousins who were watching him. (And uncle and another cousin, whom are all fine) I was also born in Boston, so this hits hard.
I just thought this was necessary. Mod's, feel free to remove it.
My wishes go out to the victims of this tragedy.
-
I'm still looking for confirmation from the authorities that there were actually bombs involved. Not saying there weren't, but so far the only mention I've seen of explosives was speculation on the part of the marathon's organizers.
-
Someone get the Real Life Hero guys on this so we can help the injured.
-
I'm still looking for confirmation from the authorities that there were actually bombs involved. Not saying there weren't, but so far the only mention I've seen of explosives was speculation on the part of the marathon's organizers.
Confirmed that is WAS bombs. Two-Three, at least two confirmed.
-
News reports Boston PD found at least 2 additional unexploded devices....
-
North Korea is celebrating the birth of the Kim dynasty today. Hrm...
-
Possibly unrelated, possibly related: Explosion at the JFK Library.
Confirmed 28 wounded, 2 dead, BPD not currently updating casualty totals. I've seen Tweets showing as many as 39 wounded.
Go to Twitter. GoogleMaps has a people finder now. Cell phone service in Boston shut down as precaution against further detonations.
http://google.org/personfinder/2013-boston-explosions (http://google.org/personfinder/2013-boston-explosions)
-
Confirmed that is WAS bombs. Two-Three, at least two confirmed.
Three, one didn't go off.
%@$#@! Terrorists >:(
-
Yeah I got a lot of family there :-\
-
Possibly unrelated, possibly related: Explosion at the JFK Library.
Police are backing off on their earlier assessment that the JFK Library incident might have been related.
Cell service in the area has been shut down just in case the explosives were being detonated by phone.
Edit:
The number set up to call to locate family is 617-635-4500. Google has set up a person finder at http://google.org/personfinder/2013-boston-explosions where people can enter information for anyone they're looking for or anyone who someone might be searching for.
Anyone with information is encouraged to call 800-494-TIPS.
Edit 2:
It's now been confirmed that cell service was not shut down as originally reported. The networks were simply overwhelmed and are already being upgraded by carriers.
-
Thoughts and Prayers being sent Boston's way.
-
Yeah, I heard as I went into the office to run things off for tomorrow. Definitely sending thoughts and prayers. Hope all with family there are safe and sound. :(
-
I basically had to force myself to ignore this at work today.
Seeing it now though.
Such a goddamn waste...
-
I live quite close to that area. It was a huge shock to come home from work, fire up my PC, and see this at the top of Yahoo News. There were three bombs from what I've seen on TV; one didn't go off-- it was found in a hotel. They've actually been saying on Yahoo news tonight that the Kennedy Library had a bomb go off inside of it too. However, it was originally thought to be an electrical fire, and I don't think anyone was hurt by that one; there's a small blackened area of the library, but otherwise, everyone got out fine, at least from the early reports. So the jury's still out on the library I guess.
Honestly, you can't go anywhere anymore. Kids can't go to school. People can't gather to celebrate....anything. People come from all over the world to run in our marathon. Now I wonder if they'll even have it next year, or again at all.
It all boils down to mental illness, it really does. No one sane would do any of this. People need to be able to talk, to confide, to read about things like bipolar, schizophrenia and the like the way they are currently able to talk, to confide, to read about things like cancer or heart trouble. There are so many ways to deal with mental illness even besides the drugs, like with homeopathic remedies, herbal remedies, and other things from the earth, but those affected need to be able to seek and get help without being shunned or embarrassed. So many times things like blood sugar problems or thyroid problems are really what's behind violent behavior; even the drugs don't address the real problems.
Sorry, plopping down off my soapbox now, but I really wish people in general would think about this more. Adam Lanza's mother was said to have "played it close to the chest" concerning her son's mental health. Maybe if she hadn't had to hold it all inside for fear of what people would think or say, her son's life (and hers, as well as all the others he killed) could have played out so very differently.
-
It all boils down to mental illness, it really does. No one sane would do any of this. People need to be able to talk, to confide, to read about things like bipolar, schizophrenia and the like the way they are currently able to talk, to confide, to read about things like cancer or heart trouble. There are so many ways to deal with mental illness even besides the drugs, like with homeopathic remedies, herbal remedies, and other things from the earth, but those affected need to be able to seek and get help without being shunned or embarrassed. So many times things like blood sugar problems or thyroid problems are really what's behind violent behavior; even the drugs don't address the real problems.
Assuming international politics isn't behind this...
Can people in the U.S. even get mental healthcare for free? I'm guessing the answer is no, though maybe post-Obamacare they can? That would be a pretty big issue if people can't get it free, because the ones who are most likely to snap are the ones who already can't afford anything.
-
On days like this, I used to be able to log in and beat the snot out of some bad guys. Sure, I have (free) accounts in other games and some active time in WoW, but it's just not the sort of catharsis I usually get from it.
-
Assuming international politics isn't behind this...
Like Surelle said. Mental illness. Politicians are just one of the most pathological examples that HAVEN'T been put in their little rubber rooms yet.
And wait until we see new legislation designed to "keep us safe" over this deplorable incident. And yet more of our rights will be stripped from us.
-
Like Surelle said. Mental illness. Politicians are just one of the most pathological examples that HAVEN'T been put in their little rubber rooms yet.
And wait until we see new legislation designed to "keep us safe" over this deplorable incident. And yet more of our rights will be stripped from us.
/agree
:(
-
I think that this feels more like it was the work of our howmgrown bunker-building militia nutjobs - not only do the bombs seem to be more low grade and amatuer than you'd expect from an international group, the significance of the date also seems more likely to have been chosen by an internal enemy, as it'd fit their perverted mindset perfectly - an overseas enemy would be way more likely to target July 4th.
-
I think that this feels more like it was the work of our howmgrown bunker-building militia nutjobs - not only do the bombs seem to be more low grade and amatuer than you'd expect from an international group, the significance of the date also seems more likely to have been chosen by an internal enemy, as it'd fit their perverted mindset perfectly - an overseas enemy would be way more likely to target July 4th.
Foreign terrorist bombs can be just as amateur. Everything depends on the knowledge of the person who's making them, and the materials they have on hand.
-
I think that this feels more like it was the work of our howmgrown bunker-building militia nutjobs - not only do the bombs seem to be more low grade and amatuer than you'd expect from an international group,
According to various news reports, pressure cookers have been used overseas as well.
the significance of the date also seems more likely to have been chosen by an internal enemy, as it'd fit their perverted mindset perfectly - an overseas enemy would be way more likely to target July 4th.
This would be an inaccurate assumption. International terrorists groups spend time & money studying the US, to get to know us and our history better than we even know it ourselves
Foreign terrorist bombs can be just as amateur. Everything depends on the knowledge of the person who's making them, and the materials they have on hand.
Pretty much this...
But, basically, until something's said to the definitive contrary, I'm going along the lines of some sick youknowwhat.
After the fire/shooting in western NY, can't rule anything out.
-
Foreign terrorist bombs can be just as amateur. Everything depends on the knowledge of the person who's making them, and the materials they have on hand.
Yep... improvised weapons are typically the way to go for international terrorists, and have been even before we started ramping up security (e.g. using a jumbo jet as a missile). First they have to get into the country, and it's a lot easier to evade detection if they A. Don't have to cross the border with any of the necessary materials, and B. Can get the materials without having to purchase anything that is regulated. This is why devices made from common household items are so popular amongst rioters. Everything needed to make them can be purchased without raising any eyebrows.
an overseas enemy would be way more likely to target July 4th.
Uhh... why? We always up security around national holidays. Why would someone risk their plans getting foiled by attacking when we're expecting it?
-
foreign or domestic or mixture of both or neither, they are still a terrorist in my book, who ever did that bombing.
There is no particular source or look of a terrorist. It;s that act that make a terrorist a terrorist all the way from that Rudolph guy of Atlanta 1996 to Bin Laden to the local gangsters shooting up innocent kids in their neighborhood . Scum.
-
foreign or domestic or mixture of both or neither, they are still a terrorist in my book, who ever did that bombing.
There is no particular source or look of a terrorist. It;s that act that make a terrorist a terrorist all the way from that Rudolph guy of Atlanta 1996 to Bin Laden to the local gangsters shooting up innocent kids in their neighborhood . Scum.
This ... pretty much this..
-
What really worries me about the pattern we've been seeing in the past few months, is that if ANY of these attacks are influenced by the current state of the nation, then we're going to be seeing more and more attacks by very intelligent people.
This has been my theory about the recent spike in 'well-calculated' massacres anyhow.
Extreme mental cases aside, most of our happiness is rooted in a couple of key things, namely companionship, and security. And in terms of security (I don't just mean life threats), we're in a very bad spot now with the economic troubles. Traditionally, people who were well educated didn't have much to worry about when it came to financial security. Now that we're entering a time when you can end up jobless, poor, and homeless, no matter how educated you are, that means we have a lot of VERY smart people who are experiencing far more stress than anyone ever could have imagined. So now all those VERY smart people are teetering on the edge of insanity.
So, I guess you could say we're turning into a nation of Super-villains waiting to happen. But I'm use that term loosely. I don't want to insult any of the red-siders. :P
-
What really worries me about the pattern we've been seeing in the past few months, is that if ANY of these attacks are influenced by the current state of the nation, then we're going to be seeing more and more attacks by very intelligent people.
This has been my theory about the recent spike in 'well-calculated' massacres anyhow.
Extreme mental cases aside, most of our happiness is rooted in a couple of key things, namely companionship, and security. And in terms of security (I don't just mean life threats), we're in a very bad spot now with the economic troubles. Traditionally, people who were well educated didn't have much to worry about when it came to financial security. Now that we're entering a time when you can end up jobless, poor, and homeless, no matter how educated you are, that means we have a lot of VERY smart people who are experiencing far more stress than anyone ever could have imagined. So now all those VERY smart people are teetering on the edge of insanity.
So, I guess you could say we're turning into a nation of Super-villains waiting to happen. But I'm use that term loosely. I don't want to insult any of the red-siders. :P
True villany has more class than this.
-
You want a tin foil hat theory. It's a lure. It's to get a bunch of politicians in one place and then do something very unexpected but very bad.
Yea, it sounds like a bad movie/tv plot. What can I say, I saw both the GI Joe movie and Olympus has Fallen in the last two weeks.
-
I wish the 24 Hour News Networks would stop cycling through Pundits that have no information and just shut up about the attacks until there's something to actually report rather then speculate on.
CBS This Morning had on the "Mayor of 9/11" Rudy Giuliani (Seriously, how a man can turn a tragedy into a career is kinda sickening) for 10 minutes and for 10 minutes he talked about nothing of relevance. Just mentioned 9/11 and then how he was there for the London Bombings.
I'd pay good money for all of them to shut up for awhile.
-
I wish the 24 Hour News Networks would stop cycling through Pundits that have no information and just shut up about the attacks until there's something to actually report rather then speculate on.
Remember the Kennedy plane crash? 24/7 broadcasts of blurry boat silhouettes in dense fog at maximum zoom.
-
Eh, I think Balloon Boy was the greatest fiasco of 24 Hour News...mostly because if it weren't for the youngest boy outing the family on Wolf Blitzer, they would have got away with it (for a little while longer, anyway).
-
Remember the Kennedy plane crash? 24/7 broadcasts of blurry boat silhouettes in dense fog at maximum zoom.
I remember. Still like to know the Romani family that laid the curse on the Kennedys cause you can't argue with the results.
-
I'm more inclined to go with GG on this one. The techniques that are coming to light are similar to ones used by insurgents in Afghanistan, but that could be as much because the person(s) who built them saw it while over there. The timing (the same week as the anniversaries of Waco and OK City, not to mention the recent rash of attacks on law enforcement) also seems to point to a domestic source. I'm completely arm chair quarter backing, but it reminds me more of an IRA bombing than anything we've seen from al Qaeda.
-
I think people are overlooking the most obvious cause of the timing in the search for a reason to blame some ideology or group, rather than waiting to see what depraved monster did this and see justice done to them.
That most obvious bit of timing is: they chose to target the Boston Marathon. It was on Monday, April 15, this year. Thus, they did it that day, this week. If there were more message to it, somebody would have released a statement by now claiming credit and trying to terrorize us into complying with their motive.
-
I think people are overlooking the most obvious cause of the timing in the search for a reason to blame some ideology or group, rather than waiting to see what depraved monster did this and see justice done to them.
That most obvious bit of timing is: they chose to target the Boston Marathon. It was on Monday, April 15, this year. Thus, they did it that day, this week. If there were more message to it, somebody would have released a statement by now claiming credit and trying to terrorize us into complying with their motive.
mcVeigh did not release a statement, and he chose the ATF office in Oklahoma City on this day for a reason.
Statements are by organized groups. This is smelling more like a lone wolf.
-
Certainly, nothing that we are idly speculating here is as bad as the things that are pointedly not being said on the 24 hour news stations. Honestly, if it weren't for the gravity of events, I would think seriously about taking a shot every time Wolf Blitzer says that they "don't want to speculate." It's probably bad enough that I'm even bordering on joking about it.
-
AP and CNN are both reporting that a suspect has been placed under arrest.
-
I had really been starting to wonder, "Are there no security cameras in that area?"
-
Now CNN's saying they're getting conflicting info about whether or not an arrest has been made. The chaos continues.
-
Now CNN's saying they're getting conflicting info about whether or not an arrest has been made. The chaos continues.
Maybe someone said cardiac arrest and the vultures jumped the gun.
Dear CNN: My use of the word "gun" does not mean you should assume that guns were involved.
Edit: OK, now it appears that the FBI has custody, not the police. Why that would mean no arrest has been made, I don't know. Some kind of technicality with federal law-enforcement vs. local?
-
The lack of any claim of responsibility is also suspicisous - international groups are rarely successful, so when they do finally manage to pull something off, there are usually competing claims of responsibility. Silence suggests that whoever did it thought that the significance of the location and the date would be enough to get their "message" accross.
-
I don't think there was a 'message' here. If there is, it probably only makes sense to in the mind of the nutjob who planned it.
If someone was trying to make a political statement, why hit the marathon? Isn't the BAA who sanctions the race a freaking charity? They're not out to hurt anyone.
-
I don't think there was a 'message' here. If there is, it probably only makes sense to in the mind of the nutjob who planned it.
If someone was trying to make a political statement, why hit the marathon? Isn't the BAA who sanctions the race a freaking charity? They're not out to hurt anyone.
It may just have had the bad luck to be the largest and most high profile event on the right day and at the right location.
-
They have a suspect, but no one is under arrest. Security cameras from a nearby building caught a guy in sunglasses and a black jacket talking on a cell phone while dropping off the second black duffle bag. He then ran off. He didn't have two bags, only one, so they think there was perhaps another guy in on it with him, too. I guess whoever dropped off the first bag was out of range of that camera.
-
Lord and Taylor's is across the street from the 2nd site. The first site is a block and a half further up the street.
Streetview
1st Site
http://maps.google.com/?ll=42.349689,-71.078867&spn=0.000463,0.000555&t=h&z=21&layer=c&cbll=42.349689,-71.078867&panoid=5YI5tP2jMq3wc6kdEr_oVQ&cbp=12,352.65,,0,0
2nd Site
http://maps.google.com/?ll=42.349137,-71.08089&spn=0.00046,0.000555&t=h°=180&z=21&layer=c&cbll=42.349137,-71.08089&panoid=WsVWTMrc6eWAgx3iDEhlVg&cbp=12,336.04,,0,0
Turn the camera around at the 2nd site to see the L&T at the corner.
-
This is about more then just Boston but these sad events, compelled me to write.
Rain
In this time of sorrow
We remember those who fall
The new angels, among runners
And those who respond, first of all
When actual villians appear
We remember why we fight
Not for a game, but for the symbol
Of knowing what is right
The spirit of helping others
Of stopping, for those in need
Opposing a world of evil
And resisting one of greed
Tears fall from eyes
And from the clouds above
Wash blood from the pavement
Mourn a slaughtered dove
We stand beside you
Raising a banner, in your name
A world holding onto hope
Even in the rain
QuantumHero
AP33
The Phoenix Project
-
I suspect what caused the confusion (CNN has now recanted) is the multiple definitions of the words "capture" and "catch" as it pertains to the technology in question. Those are the exact words that I use, interchangeably, no less, when talking about trying to take a good picture. Given the number of good, competent people currently working on this, we have no idea how directly the so called "sources" had gotten their information.
Also, I've seen Homeland Security consultants on each of the 24 hour news channels say several times that, essentially, "Risin is the most common false positive received from these initial tests. In fact, they get numerous false positives every day." (I'm trying to quote the guy on CNN, but it's probably more like paraphrasing, and it's essentially the same thing from each of the others.) It's terrible, if it's not a false positive, but far more likely is the possibility that it is, and, because someone slipped up and mentioned it to a Globe reporter.
-
And of course, the crackpots on Facebook are taking these conflicting reports to indicate evidence of a False Flag Operation designed to take away our freedoms.
Nevermind the Patriot Act already did that years ago.
-
By "false flag," you mean Alex Jones?
-
By "false flag," you mean Alex Jones?
Who else?
-
Who else?
He and a couple of others. Latest stupidity states the gentleman in the wheel chair in photo 8 found here (http://www.theatlantic.com/infocus/2013/04/photos-of-the-boston-marathon-bombing/100495/) being helped by the cowboy hat guy (warning: picture isn't pretty and other places have cropped it because it's not pretty), is really a legless vet posing as a victim.
Morons. Plain and simple. Raised on black helicopters and NWO. Everyone knows it's really the Gnomes of Zurich using their Orbital Mind Control Lasers. :o
2nd, as for the Patriot Act, notice that when the Democrats are in charge, they really didn't try all to hard to repeal the parts they complained about when they weren't in charge. Who wants to surrender all that power.
-
2nd, as for the Patriot Act, notice that when the Democrats are in charge, they really didn't try all to hard to repeal the parts they complained about when they weren't in charge. Who wants to surrender all that power.
Never confuse laziness, political expediency, and megalomania. ;)
(Or, as my old boss used to say, when you hear hoof beats, don't go looking for zebras.)
-
Eh. The only boon to living in our Police State is the Police are at least polite about it. And thus far those in charge understand not to bring the boot heel down on the neck too hard.
Anywho - back to Boston, and the fact CNN has pretty much destroyed whatever credibility they had left by running with the "Arrest" angle that turned out false. Blitzer's lame attempt at a recovery was wince inducing. "You run with what you have..."
Isn't the whole point of being a giant News operation that you sit on News until you can confirm it's valid?
-
Isn't the whole point of being a giant News operation that you sit on News until you can confirm it's valid?
It used to be. Now it's about the journalistic equivalent of posting "FIRST!"
-
Eh. The only boon to living in our Police State is the Police are at least polite about it. And thus far those in charge understand not to bring the boot heel down on the neck too hard.
Anywho - back to Boston, and the fact CNN has pretty much destroyed whatever credibility they had left by running with the "Arrest" angle that turned out false. Blitzer's lame attempt at a recovery was wince inducing. "You run with what you have..."
Isn't the whole point of being a giant News operation that you sit on News until you can confirm it's valid?
Heh, maybe people will start screaming for "news reform."
-
Heh, maybe people will start screaming for "news reform."
Oh, that happens periodically.
On the Left, they call out for the "Fairness Doctrine" and the like.
On the Right, they look for conservative media to counterbalance the mainstream media.
-
Two problems with 24 hour news channels.
1) They need to be a profit center. Which means ratings and ratings means eyeballs. Goes back to the old newspaper adage, "if it bleeds it leads". It also means they jump the gun reporting anything that they have vague confirmation on and rarely apologetic when they get it wrong (see Columbine, Olympic Park Bombing, Oklahoma City Bombing).
2) Because it's 24 hours, that's a lot of time to fill so we now have the same kind of meaningless filler that we first seen during election nights.
-
And of course, the crackpots on Facebook are taking these conflicting reports to indicate evidence of a False Flag Operation designed to take away our freedoms.
Nevermind the Patriot Act already did that years ago.
CISPA just passed the House, and the bombing was used as a reason it's needed.
And by the way, when was the last time the news media focused on THAT?
-
...
If anyone needs me, I'll be in the Angry Dome.
-
CISPA just passed the House, and the bombing was used as a reason it's needed.
wat
How do those two even connect? The unknown perpetrator may or may not have used the internet to gather information?
My head asplode.
When do we launch the ship for all the politicians, marketing analysts, and telephone sanitizers again? Gotta get the important people off before the asteroid hits.
-
wat
How do those two even connect? The unknown perpetrator may or may not have used the internet to gather information?
My head asplode.
When do we launch the ship for all the politicians, marketing analysts, and telephone sanitizers again? Gotta get the important people off before the asteroid hits.
Big O has said he was going to veto it if it ever got to his desk but that was before Boston.
After all you got to feed "The Machine" (yes PoI reference).
-
Good news is it isn't actually Veto Proof (288 does not equal 290 that is), and the Senate have basically said they refuse to even talk about it, so this is as far as it goes.
-
Hopefully I didn't cause confusion. I meant the House of Reps, not the White House.
I don't 'think' Obama has officially changed his perspective on it. Hopefully the same is true for unofficially.
We've already had a slaughter of kiddies used this year in an effort to push gun control. If the Boston bombing has altered perception of CISPA, I may start giving conspiracy theories a bit more consideration.
Still doesn't mean these attacks are inside jobs though. It just means that stuff blowing up is a convenient opportunity to use fear-mongering and convince citizens that trading privacy and/or rights for security is a good idea. And since no legislation will ever put an end to foreign or domestic terrorist acts, they can perpetually push for more security measures.
If CISPA gets shot down again, maybe the next draft will require everyone to install wireless transmitters on all electronic communication devices; transmitters that run directly into FBI HQ. And they'll call it PAIBA: The "Protection Against Insane Bombers Act."
-
As terrible as this sounds, I'm shocked something like Boston hasn't happened sooner.
The media venerates killers - look at how much attention Aurora and Sandy Hook received. Add in a pressure cooker "Us vs Them" mindset among the political discourse (Be it Elected officials or Talking Head blowhards)...and it's a wonder something like this isn't a daily occurrence.
While I am a self professed Nethead and love having the Oracle of Delphi/Library of Alexandria at my finger tips, I also wonder if being exposed to so much information - so much noise - is honestly all that healthy. News Channels are now 24/7 non-stop, and it seems like everyone has a conspiracy to fit your particular taste buds (I have a few myself - I just don't share them. Because if I had any actual proof, it wouldn't be a "Theory").
As my father so famously put it not that long ago:
"It's all noise...and the Devil loves noise."
-
Oh rust... you just had to sneak in a 'pressure cooker' reference, didn't you. :P
I think society has hit a major wall with regard to trust too. If we see a photo or a video of anything, we have no way of knowing if it's legit or not. When a bomb goes off, our first thought with looking for suspects is, "Who has something to gain?"
A news company just got slammed for 'erasing' a nasty wound in one of the Boston photos. I've seen radical groups who swear by evolution and in the next breath, say that science has manipulated the truth behind competitive animal behaviors to justify capitalism.
Then take the fiasco with the recent gun control decision. Obama is up there saying that 90% of voters wanted the advanced background checks. And everyone is saying that those polls were faked, or that he's blatantly lying. Which leaves us to believe whatever the heck we want to believe. The Pres could be lying, or all the naysayers could. We have nothing solid to stand on, with practically anything anymore.
The Flat-Earth theory is a perfect example of this. Yeah, it's really REALLY unlikely, but they bring up an interesting point. Unless we all go into space and see it for ourselves, we have no choice but to take someone else's word for it. And people are starting to realize that in a world where everyone has an agenda, anyone can be lying to us. We're reaching a point where I don't even know if we can call ourselves a society. If everyone is just out for him/herself, and nobody cares about the whole, that's not a society. That's not even an anarchy. I don't know what the heck it is.
-
Welcome to the Post-Capitalist World.
As for the Pressure Cooker reference...totally unintentional.
-
I think with this being an act of terror and all, the eventual trial should be held at Gitmo. No TV, no news coverage, no publicity, and no platform for whatever agenda the bomber had.
-
The biggest problem really is finding a non-biased jury. The Aurora Shooter had much the same issue before finally going to trial and I know McVey was the same way. To say nothing of how O.J. Simpson got away with a double homicide.
Another reason the Media needs to shut up and just deliver the straight facts on the case.
-
Another reason the Media needs to shut up and just deliver the straight facts on the case.
On that note... http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-april-17-2013/the-most-busted-name-in-news
-
Well the bad guys didn't expect this (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-04-19/boston-bombing-victim-in-iconic-photo-helped-identify-attackers.html).
Not only did Carlos Arredondo, the guy in the cowboy hat, saved Jeff Bauman, turns out he saved the one up close eye witness of one of the scum who did this. Ha! Bet you thought this guy wouldn't have survived the blast.
-
Am I the only one who feels like we could be on the verge of a media-fueled mass hysteria?
http://news.yahoo.com/teen-stunned-portrayal-mass-bombing-suspect-015852323.html
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/gunman-reportedly-shoots-police-officer-mit-boston-034906627.html
-
Am I the only one who feels like we could be on the verge of a media-fueled mass hysteria?
http://news.yahoo.com/teen-stunned-portrayal-mass-bombing-suspect-015852323.html
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/gunman-reportedly-shoots-police-officer-mit-boston-034906627.html
The first is caused by 4chan and Reddit "trying to help" and the NY Daily News picking it up from there.
The second is the universe providing a list of reasons for a young woman I met this weekend who was deciding between MIT and Yale to not go to MIT. I even praised both the areas around MIT and the shopping over on Newbury Street/Copley Square as relatively safe for a major city.
-
LOL, FX.
Looks like they caught someone. For real, this time. I think... at least, it seems likely that this is connected to the bombing. *shifty eyes* Maybe?
Naa, probably not.
-
Having passed out on the couch last night, live coverage of this morning's firefight served as my alarm clock.
Well, 1 down, I guess.
-
Well, now we know who the suspects are - and their response to being tracked down certainly makes them look guilty - so hopefully justice will be thorough, accurate, and swift.
I would prefer we not glorify, justify, or memorialize this, as it only gives fuel to the insane mindset that values this kind of horror.
("This" being the terrorists, not an injunction against holding memorial for the victims. I do hope we don't make the mistake we made with the twin towers site and turn it into a grave marker, though. We can remember the fallen without giving a monument to the monsters.)
-
I would prefer we not glorify, justify, or memorialize this, as it only gives fuel to the insane mindset that values this kind of horror.
Agreed.
-
Their Uncle thinks this was inspired by "hatred to those that were able to settle themselves"
Looks like someone believes this was set off by economic hell.
-
Their uncle also characterizes the younger one as brilliant and a good person, and the older one as "a loser." Which sounds like, at least to the Uncle's mind, the older one created his own problems and dragged the younger one into it. (I question anybody who would involve themselves in even attempted mass murder being a "good person.")
-
A bit of a brief conspiracy rant now.
Maybe this is just attributed to people losing their wits after they realize the whole world is gunning for them (sort of like how shooting sprees tend to end with the shooter committing suicide). But does anyone else find it a bit strange how this police chase ended up happening?
We're talking about people who were smart enough to build, at least from what I can tell, the most technologically advanced IED's ever used on U.S. soil in recent years. They had enough money to accomplish that, to get guns with tons of ammo, and freaking grenades.
But after all of that, they can't be bothered to pay for a couple of hostess cupcakes, and instead hold up the store and risk attracting the attention of every law enforcement official in the whole city?
Something about that doesn't sit right with me.
-
They may have feared recognition anyway, and used the hold-up to keep anybody from calling the police before they could get back out.
Or they could have been power-tripping.
Or maybe they WERE out of money. Or were looking for something other than "a couple of Hostess cupcakes."
-
Their uncle also characterizes the younger one as brilliant and a good person, and the older one as "a loser." Which sounds like, at least to the Uncle's mind, the older one created his own problems and dragged the younger one into it. (I question anybody who would involve themselves in even attempted mass murder being a "good person.")
Probably good person up to that point.
Ever came across that kid that was nice kind to everyone well mannered, good person, then ten years later he is being arrested for turning people's skin into lampshades?
Or opposite that kid always in trouble blowing up mailboxes, never going to amount to anything, a butthole in college, never even go to class and eventually dropped out, considered a loser, then makes his own company and becomes one of the biggest philanthropists in the world.
Or like heros and villains, sometimes a villain started off as a hero or a hero started off as a villain.
I think people are people and at the time, from their actions is what makes them good or bad. Never can tell what is going on inside a person's head or the trouble or even if they are one facebook let down from snapping, building a bomb and blowing up something or offing themselves and taking as many as they can with them. Kind of why I try to treat everyone as a person good or bad. As even the bad ones sometimes just want someone to say, "Hey man, you matter in this world and someone loves you." for once. Alas, I have a feeling my heart for people will be my downfall. But hell, then, I cant think of a better way to go. Better than going out bitter and full of hate. And then becoming a bad person.
-
I think people are people and at the time, from their actions is what makes them good or bad. Never can tell what is going on inside a person's head or the trouble or even if they are one facebook let down from snapping, building a bomb and blowing up something or offing themselves and taking as many as they can with them.
Yeah, given the Uncle's liberal use of the word, "Loser", I have to wonder if it's the first time he's used it to describe the kid.
-
A bit of a brief conspiracy rant now.
Maybe this is just attributed to people losing their wits after they realize the whole world is gunning for them (sort of like how shooting sprees tend to end with the shooter committing suicide). But does anyone else find it a bit strange how this police chase ended up happening?
We're talking about people who were smart enough to build, at least from what I can tell, the most technologically advanced IED's ever used on U.S. soil in recent years. They had enough money to accomplish that, to get guns with tons of ammo, and freaking grenades.
But after all of that, they can't be bothered to pay for a couple of hostess cupcakes, and instead hold up the store and risk attracting the attention of every law enforcement official in the whole city?
Something about that doesn't sit right with me.
The fact that they didn't appear to notice the CCTV in the area of the attack, or possibly thought that any images from them would be too blury to be any use might mean that they freaked out when they saw the images and how sharp they were.
-
NBC is now reporting that suspect 2 is in custody and alive.
Major appreciation for law enforcement in Boston area.
-
A bit of a brief conspiracy rant now.
Maybe this is just attributed to people losing their wits after they realize the whole world is gunning for them (sort of like how shooting sprees tend to end with the shooter committing suicide). But does anyone else find it a bit strange how this police chase ended up happening?
We're talking about people who were smart enough to build, at least from what I can tell, the most technologically advanced IED's ever used on U.S. soil in recent years. They had enough money to accomplish that, to get guns with tons of ammo, and freaking grenades.
But after all of that, they can't be bothered to pay for a couple of hostess cupcakes, and instead hold up the store and risk attracting the attention of every law enforcement official in the whole city?
Something about that doesn't sit right with me.
Pfft. Technologically advanced? Let's see, download plans from internet, buy preasure cookers from Target (using stores as an example only), black powder at Carbela's, nails at Home Depot, model rocket engine igniters and digital RC parts at hobby shop. It's an afternoon project.
Technologically advanced is to build an autonomous drone (https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8785) that drops ricin laced anti-personal caltrops on the marathon course and then flies out to sea until it runs out of fuel.
No this is at least one angry young man who had a beef with the world when his boxing career was derailed because he wasn't nationalized yet and may or may not have dragged his brother ("but he's family") into it.
What bugs me the most is the lack of an exit strategy. They could have just been suicide bombers and got the "job" done but since they weren't you have to assume they wanted to survive so why stick around? Admittedly vanishing right after it happens could draw attention but they had relatives in other parts of the country, it's easy enough to tell people closest to you that your relatives wanted you out of Boston or that you felt like you needed to see them due to the attack as a way to cover your sudden departure.
Maybe they didn't think they would have been identified so quickly. Hopefully they will get some answers out of the younger brother.
-
Pfft. Technologically advanced? Let's see, download plans from internet, buy preasure cookers from Target (using stores as an example only), black powder at Carbela's, nails at Home Depot, model rocket engine igniters and digital RC parts at hobby shop. It's an afternoon project.
I say most technologically-advanced because A. the bombs were given a lot more thought than most of the crazy things people have tried in the U.S. post-9/11 and B. they actually worked. I don't mean advanced in such a way that the military is scratching their heads wondering why they never thought of it.
I've been feeling there's more to this than just loading a pressure cooker with black powder and shapnel though. But maybe I'm giving modern pressure cookers too much credit (cheap low-quality metal vs. old-school cookware?). I've known people who had pressure cookers explode (being used as intended). Every-time they have, it has ended the same, with 90% of the food inside, AND the lid, embedded in the ceiling of the kitchen. To me this makes a pressure cooker seem more practical as a cannon than a bomb, unless they altered the frame somehow.
As for downloading the plans for making them, I would've thought that every downloaded copy of the Anarchist's Cookbook (or whatever the most popular "World Domination Guide" is these days) probably sends your IP straight to everything from the FBI to the NSA nowadays. I recall a lot of wannabe Jihadists in recent years getting caught before they could unleash their plans of doom, just because they visited some "how to incinerate your neighborhood in 5 easy steps" website.
-
Maybe he downloaded them from the free internet PC at the public library, or used the free internet at McDonalds/Starbucks/wherever.
The guide, which from what I read was published in a magazine a few years back, likely lists ways to reinforce the cover and to bypass the pressure cooker fail safes, which may not be that important when talking about the sudden increase in pressure a bomb generates. Supposedly they found the cover of bomb two on the roof of a nearby building.
Here's the thing. I hate it when the media reports something as "technologically sophisticated" when it's something anyone with a little bit of science/engineering knowledge from high school can do. I was following the live stream during the day from a couple of Boston TV stations and honestly these people wouldn't understand how a car engine works in broad strokes even after you walked them thought it with a model. It's like pouring water in a sieve. These people would think a vinegar/baking soda volcano is "technologically sophisticated". Just because the world is a great big mysterious place that you don't understand, don't assume everyone is just as naive as you are. Yes your average smash and grab criminal is as dumb as rocks (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1WjJhFd4uc) but don't assume they all are.
As for government agencies, hiring or listening to "lateral thinkers" isn't their strong suit. In high school in the late 70s my high school library had a book of model rocketry from the 50s on the shelf. Back then you didn't buy your engines at the local hobby shop, you made them. The book contained the recipes and instructions and it was an end cap away from being a pipe bomb. Heck the instructions warned you in no uncertain terms that the fuel mixture you were making could explode while making it if you weren't very careful and even if you succeeded in making it and pouring the mixture into your own engine casing, if the fuel mix doesn't solidify consistently or if the mix wasn't evenly mixed the engine is still likely to explode. So surround the launch pad with 3 feet deep of sandbags and launch it 100ft away in another bunker make with 3 ft sandbag walls. This was in my high school library. Of course that's the last place you would find students but it was there.
And this is my concern. They, the government and media, are going to start questioning the smart and clever people in society. People who subscribe to Make. Popular Mechanics. The Do It Yourself crowd that have no problem assembling Ikea or their child's bicycle at Christmas. Skills that your average hipster population wouldn't have clue one how to do because instructions are just too complicated like paying someone to have their DVR hooked up to their TV (it's one flip'n cable)! Maybe I'm just a throwback to the era of Heathkits and Radio Shack 100 an 1 electronic project kits (http://www.rcgrabbag.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/dsc_2374-edit.jpg). Home chemistry labs and rock polishers. Of jarts, pitch backs and erector sets (http://www.samstoybox.com/toys/ErectorSet.html). Children's toys that only needed a warning about severe burns and still could be sold (http://www.snowcrest.net/fox/str.html).
We punish the curious and discourage self learning. We went from only being able to get buckets of Legos to single item kits you build once and play with or display.
Wow. That derailed.
-
Maybe this is just attributed to people losing their wits after they realize the whole world is gunning for them (sort of like how shooting sprees tend to end with the shooter committing suicide). But does anyone else find it a bit strange how this police chase ended up happening?
I think you were on the money with this part. Generally speaking most people would panic in this situation and would stop thinking clearly. They already showed this by getting in a shoot out and throwing grenades. While I am sure some information is being withheld who's to say there was a enough evidence against these guys to actually have them found guilty. To be fair they were innocent into proven guilty, but that has gone out the window. There most recent actions are an implication of guilt. And if they weren't at the very least they are guilty of evading police, the murder of police officer, and I am sure several serious felonies as well. If they were smart they would of been long gone if they were guilty, and then scared pancake less with a good lawyer if they weren't.
Technologically advanced is to build an autonomous drone that drops ricin laced anti-personal caltrops on the marathon course and then flies out to sea until it runs out of fuel.
I think i'd like to stay on your good side Father Xmas.......
-
Oh, and the exchange of gunfire at the end when the cops first arrived at the boat. What to bet it's the classic one officer accidentally discharged their weapon and EVERYONE open fire.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=796UFHldHM4#!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=irP5JdFpIwU
-
To be perfectly honest, I stopped following this thread as it A: it started to derail, and B: the "manhunt" turned into chasing down a scared kid. However, I did want to point out one thing: Since, the shutdown announcement, I've had a Google news alert set up for all things CoH, and the recent flurry of notifications was pretty uplifting, as the game got a sudden burst of press. This week, though, it changed entirely to posts about Boston, which struck me as a little disjointed.
Just thought I'd share. :)
-
To be fair, that "scared kid" had all of Boston on lockdown to find him, and participated in murdering at least 3 people and seriously, life-alteringly injuring 150 more.
This "scared kid" didn't have any problem leaving his little bomb right next to an 8-year-old boy, who no doubt would also have been a "scared kid" if he'd survived the blast. His slightly older sister was likely very scared, too, when she realized she lacked a leg she'd had only moments before.
I don't like characterizing this as "chasing a scared kid." This was a manhunt for a very dangerous man. A young man, but a man and a murderer. Attempted mass-murderer. Any pity he deserves should not in any way come over his suffering of consequences for his willfully evil actions.
-
Yeah, let's leave the "scared kid" perception out of the picture here.
Has the politically-correct "race to victim-hood" really reached such an extreme point now where people are even feeling sorry for HIM the moment he runs out of bombs and the tables turn? REALLY?
Granted, I guess there's a slight chance this wasn't the guy, and the cops ended up chasing two brothers all over the place who just happened to be armed with not just guns, but also grenades. Innocent until proven guilty, and all that.
I don't know what has turned up since the capture though. I haven't heard a darned thing yet about homes being raided for evidence. All I've heard is "he's still sedated and not talking", and rant-fests from family members.
-
The second-most disturbing thing about this, to me, is that the surviving brother apparently took the oath of citizenship - and thus became an American citizen - on Sept. 11, 2012. And then perpetrated this 7 months later.
These boys grew up here. They were inculcated in the most diverse school in Boston (it apparently boasts having some 83 different nations represented amongst its student body). Dzokar - the surviving brother - was six when he moved here. He should have been as American as any of the rest of us who grew up here. Growing up in Boston, Massachusetts, he should have grown up with the kind of swelling-of-the-chest pride that any child raised to love and respect the miraculous history of freedom and welcome that this nation has for all peoples.
Somehow, our education system failed him. Our education system taught him to hate America and what it stands for. This isn't some under-represented, abused foreigner who got short shrift from America; he had a coveted scholarship to this school, an education that prided itself on its diversity. So he must have learned how rotten, how evil, how undeserving of respect our culture is at least in part at our own schools.
I'm not anti-immigrant. But I am anti-anti-Americanism. And I know my schools, growing up, had this pervasive sense that our history was something of which we, as Americans, should be ashamed. That diversity - respecting others' cultures over and above our own - was all-important, and that we had to atone for our nation's past sins and welcome foreigners not by showing them our unworthy culture, but by showing them that we respected theirs and would not "oppress" it by expecting them to fit in here.
Well, we have proof that that not only doesn't work to make people love us around the world, but that it turns people who should have had every reason to be as American and freedom-loving as anybody reading this post into zealots willing to kill 8-year-olds waiting for their father at the finish line just to stick it to this rotten country.
I'm not blaming anybody but Dzokar and Tamarlane for this heinous act (unless and until evidence comes out that - heaven forbid - this was a larger conspiracy of terrorists), but there is no way a six-year-old child had so much hatred for this nation that he would grow up this way unless something in our own system that was educating him taught him to hate us, rather than welcoming him and teaching him to love his new home as a one-day-to-be fellow-citizen.
-
Or it has nothing to do with anti-Americanism and more to do with the modern culture's veneration of murderers and psychotics. When you look at the media attention given to the likes of Charles Manson, Timothy McVey, or the Aurora Shooter (I never cared to learn that one's name)...it's not hard to see why some would try to mimic such things.
A great way to get famous is to get the news to notice you. How else could the Cardassians - who have done nothing of merit in the world outside the enslavement of Bajor - become the subject of news reports and magazine covers the world over?
...wait, sorry. I'm thinking of the Kardashians. Which means they didn't even enslave Bajor.
Why are they famous again?
-
Maybe film crews are secretly Bajoran?
Or it's all a Nemesi--er, Obsidian Order plot.
-
The second-most disturbing thing about this, to me, is that the surviving brother apparently took the oath of citizenship - and thus became an American citizen - on Sept. 11, 2012. And then perpetrated this 7 months later.
<snip>
I'm not blaming anybody but Dzokar and Tamarlane for this heinous act (unless and until evidence comes out that - heaven forbid - this was a larger conspiracy of terrorists), but there is no way a six-year-old child had so much hatred for this nation that he would grow up this way unless something in our own system that was educating him taught him to hate us, rather than welcoming him and teaching him to love his new home as a one-day-to-be fellow-citizen.
Yes, but boys often look up to their big brothers. From what I've heard, big brother got radicalised and may have recruited little brother.
-
That's a distinct possibility, Minotaur. I've not yet found word that Tamarlane was naturalized. If he was, then, um...why'd he go get radicalized after spending his formative years here, in the same environment as his little brother?
If he wasn't...then our immigration system is in need of serious reform, but more to increase enforcement of our laws, because that radicalization took 6 months in a foreign country. That's enough to get you sent to the back of the line or rejected for re-entry into the country by our current laws, and looking at where he spent those six months should have been big red flags.
-
Yes, but boys often look up to their big brothers. From what I've heard, big brother got radicalised and may have recruited little brother.
I'd also point out that in the video, the little brother was holding the second bomb, handed to him by the big brother, until *after* the first bomb went off. He was americanized, worshipped pop culture, the very things a radicalized elder brother may have looked down upon.
it is quite possible the younger brother was set up to be a casualty.
-
Interesting take, downix. It would do my heart some good to hope that the boy is actually innocent, a victim of his brother's atrocity as well. But we will have to see. (He, um, tweeted something about "killing them like they killed my brother" after Tamarlane died, at least according to the news on the local radio, which is admittedly not reliable in heat-of-the-moment situations as they were when I heard it. But by that snippet, I have a heavy heart and heavier doubts about Dzokar's innocence.
In a tragicomic bit of conicidence, "Dzokar" is actually pronounced to sound similar to "Joker.")
-
I love how in modern society, you can be the most wanted man in the country and still have enough time to tweet about it from your smartphone.
-
The second-most disturbing thing about this, to me, is that the surviving brother apparently took the oath of citizenship - and thus became an American citizen - on Sept. 11, 2012. And then perpetrated this 7 months later.
This is the kind of stuff that will get the thread locked, and, worse, I'm going to respond to it.
(https://images.weserv.nl/?url=www.eclectablog.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F04%2Fboston.jpg)
I'm not saying that the kid is blameless, but I have two boys, and I'm also one of two boys. I can personally attest to little brothers doing some really stupid shit to impress their big brothers, and believing just about anything in pursuit of that goal.
-
Cute, but since I didn't say a word about Islam or ethnicity, and everything about how the Chechan President may, disturbingly, have a point that the evil was inculcated in our own country (I, personally, blame our desire to make of our nation a mosaic rather than a melting pot, and hold other cultures above our own, and make our nation out to always be the villain exploiting the rest of the world)...I think your post reflects more your own knee-jerk fears than any racism on my part.
Seriously. These guys committed an act of terrorism, and they grew up here. If we're going to blame "talk radio" after McVeigh, and Sarah Palin for the nutjob that shot Representative Giffords, perhaps we should not have a double-standard and claim there's no possible way to know the motives if it's not a politically correct group to blame.
-
The mosaic strategy seemed to work pretty well for Canada. Not saying we need to copy it, but you'd think that at the very least, our social system 'would' be compatible with that. Political correctness has given minorities no reason to blend though. Why do that when they can perpetually hold it over the head of (Whites, heteros, males, etc) as a tool of dominance? The best way to have an advantage over someone else in this culture is to prove you've been victimized by him/her. And ethnic groups seem to be holding onto that advantage tooth & nail. My family didn't even come to this country until over 100 years after the Civil War, but I'm still being held accountable to compensate for acts of slavery that nobody alive today even remembers. And even after Caucasians become the minority, I doubt that will change.
Interestingly, my wife just stumbled upon an article in the past few days, suggesting that political correctness is a relic of a Nemesis... err... Marxist plot to destroy Western society from the inside out. If you will, a "super-weapon" from a dead war that rose up and ran amok after its masters had been destroyed. Heck knows if it's accurate. Could just be another conspiracy theory, but it's a pretty convincing one even to me. I've been trying to pick apart this phenomenon for years, and this is the first time I've heard mention of an attempt to 'program' people to be on the lookout for excuses to be offended.
Accurate or not, our society is living in an insane paradox. The greatest advantage is to be a victim, even though the very definition of 'victim' implies someone who is disadvantaged.