Author Topic: NCsoft Earning report is out  (Read 6524 times)

Mister Bison

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #20 on: November 07, 2012, 08:54:56 PM »
Have seen the disclaimer on every quarterly report (makes 2 for me :P), but can we order a third-party audit for ourselves ? for how much ? I would like to see how long exactly their numbers hold up, and if we can get a real price tag on City of Heroes assets.
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Guardia

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2012, 10:10:49 PM »
I would point out that even though Paragon was shut down, due to California laws the employees were still on the NCSoft payroll until the end of October.



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Turjan

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #22 on: November 07, 2012, 11:29:02 PM »
Arenanet throw a spanner in the works here though... Because for a whole year (2011) they registered *nothing* in loss/gain for any quarter, even though Guild Wars made roughly $7million throughout the year. For 2012, they made $13million ($12million in Q3), whilst they have so far registered a loss off just over $2million (essentially all in Q3).

I must concur, the ArenaNet line of zeroes also had me scratching my head. Obviously ArenaNet did indeed exist, so why the zero figures? If it means they're only measuring certain elements of performance and/or income-expenditure, then it makes a mockery of the entire report, rendering it all but useless when it comes to drawing any worthwhile conclusions from it.

Really in my opinion, and u can take it or leave it, they could have left CoH and it would still look like an increase. They could have laid off some of the non key employees and merged servers to save money and showed the same "progress". Looks like they did the shut down this quarter on purpose so it looks like CoH was the problem.

It would be difficult to make CoH appear to be the villain when they steadfastly avoid any direct mention of it anywhere in the report...yet another piece of illogical behaviour on their part. A franchise that had an active history of over 8 years and was apparently "like a family member of this company" and its passing isn't even mentioned. Not once.

From the paucity of actual solid information in that report - not to mention that bizarre total omission of the name City of Heroes in it anywhere - I'd guess they simply want CoH to go away into the past. And unless we kidnapped TJKim and strapped him to a chair in a basement under a bare 40watt lightbulb and asked him some questions directly, I don't think we're ever going to know the truth behind the closure decision.

All the material I've researched and read since the end of August suggests to me that keeping CoH ticking over would've made far more sense than closing it. It would've benefitted both NCsoft and Nexon, and also the tens of thousands of loyal paying customers. So therefore my bottom line of thinking now is that the reason for the closure is quite simply not one that was based on 'sense'.

Ichaerus

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #23 on: November 07, 2012, 11:36:15 PM »
I must concur, the ArenaNet line of zeroes also had me scratching my head. Obviously ArenaNet did indeed exist, so why the zero figures? If it means they're only measuring certain elements of performance and/or income-expenditure, then it makes a mockery of the entire report, rendering it all but useless when it comes to drawing any worthwhile conclusions from it.

It would be difficult to make CoH appear to be the villain when they steadfastly avoid any direct mention of it anywhere in the report...yet another piece of illogical behaviour on their part. A franchise that had an active history of over 8 years and was apparently "like a family member of this company" and its passing isn't even mentioned. Not once.

From the paucity of actual solid information in that report - not to mention that bizarre total omission of the name City of Heroes in it anywhere - I'd guess they simply want CoH to go away into the past.

That's because NCSoft is treating CoH/Paragon Studios like that family member that you're not supposed to talk about at family reunions...The "black sheep of the family," so to speak, or the adopted kid, or of the status of Jon Snow in Game of Thrones.  The illegitimate seed.

Kheprera

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #24 on: November 08, 2012, 01:14:26 AM »
The fourth quarter report is what should really tell where the numbers are.  Third quarter ended at the end of September, so this report will not reflect the personnel loss of Paragon Studios or the cost savings of rental space of the offices.


Moonfyire101

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #25 on: November 08, 2012, 04:07:12 AM »


From the paucity of actual solid information in that report - not to mention that bizarre total omission of the name City of Heroes in it anywhere - I'd guess they simply want CoH to go away into the past.

they left out guild wars 1 also, because it did worse than CoH.

downix

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #26 on: November 08, 2012, 04:43:43 AM »
For the claims that they are changing focus to the asian market, their sales in these markets is down, rather dramatically.

It looks as though they lost almost $3 million in value from the CoH shutdown. Although they did claim it as a loss, enabling them to offset the added revenue from GW2. It's a shell game, which if they cannot get GW2 and B&S's sales numbers up, they're toast next Q.

cforciea

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #27 on: November 09, 2012, 10:49:44 PM »
People here keep talking about a short term money boost that could some how be derived from closing a profitable studio, but that doesn't make any sense. If I have a studio bringing in $800,000 a month and spending $700,000 a month, the most you could ever do by immediately killing all funding would be to save $700,000 right this second at the cost of $800,000 a month minus one day from now. Not only that, but billing cycles were by no means synced, so that first $800,000 opportunity costs starts actually being damaging at a rate of about $27,000 a day starting tomorrow. Couple that with the fact that outgoing costs don't actually go to zero, and could reasonably have even spiked before zeroing given things like severance packages, and the idea that CoH was canceled to redirect resources someplace is pretty dubious. Unless there was some substantial non-monthly cost coming up (and the idea it was licensing to Cryptic was thoroughly debunked) it is basically impossible for them to ever have gained any cash pool, even temporary, to spend someplace else, and even if there were such a cost we don't know about, it strains belief that it could have possibly been of the scale to even be noticeable in the scope of their overall financials, either in the form of numbers posted for investors or in terms of what it could be spend on otherwise.

The bottom line is that if the game was actually profitable, and I mean profitable from the perspective of all costs, with nothing hidden away in disjoint billing departments or only partially related managers in other locations, killing it could never have been for any financial motive, long or short term. It wasn't to boost numbers, it wasn't to reinvest elsewhere. I am not sure what their actual motives were, but let's not go making up reasons for them that don't even make sense.

Aggelakis

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #28 on: November 10, 2012, 12:01:37 AM »
Actually, the way businesses state their "losses" is often weird and seems shady to outsiders. Using your numbers because I don't have any of my own (THIS IS JUST AN EXAMPLE):

In one part of their report, closing Paragon Studios means they cut costs by $700k.

In a completely separate part of the report, they report an "opportunity loss" of $100k ($800k sales - $700k costs).

Reports after that will make no mention whatsoever of the potential sales/costs of the closed project, thus a net zero...no loss.
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JWBullfrog

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #29 on: November 10, 2012, 01:02:41 AM »
NCsoft, an online-game maker, headed for the lowest close since May 11, 2010. Nexon, a Japanese online gaming company, plunged 16 percent in Tokyo after it trimmed its forecast and was cut to underperform from buy at CLSA Ltd.

Link for the original:
http://www.ipotnews.com/index.php?jdl=Most_Emerging_Stocks_Fall__Led_by_ONGC_on_Earnings&level2=newsandopinion&id=1705162&img=level1_emergingmarket_1&urlImage=
 
this was posted today. interesting little bit of info there.
 
 
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Atlantea

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #30 on: November 10, 2012, 02:49:10 AM »
Has anyone checked on the Stock values of other game companies like EA, Activision and the like for a comparison?


eabrace

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #31 on: November 10, 2012, 03:02:10 AM »
Has anyone checked on the Stock values of other game companies like EA, Activision and the like for a comparison?
EA: http://www.reuters.com/finance/stocks/chart?symbol=EA.OQ
Activition: http://www.reuters.com/finance/stocks/chart?symbol=ATVI.OQ
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Atlantea

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #32 on: November 10, 2012, 03:18:47 AM »
Hm. At a glance it looks as if EA is going up and down but more or less in a consistent range. Slightly trending down.

Activision is less stable. They're more on a downward glide. But averaging out the ups and downs it still seems consistent.

Overall downward trend, given the elections and such, is not surprising. But neither of them show the extreme "cliff-jumping" that NCSoft's stocks seem to have suffered.

(Of course I should mention - I know next to nothing about how to really interpret all this. Just looking at the general graph lines and seeing if I can see any patterns.)

Aggelakis

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Re: NCsoft Earning report is out
« Reply #33 on: November 10, 2012, 03:40:38 AM »
EA has been in a steady decline for about a year. However, looking over the longterm, it's moderately stable comparison to the average of the last several years. It totally tanked in late 2008, likely to do with the beginning of the recession and everyone scrambling to be able to afford things - video games (especially online) are often the first thing to go (even though they're cheaper BY FAR than the average family's eating out/movie budget).

Activision has been relatively steady for the last few years, within tolerance, with some cyclical ups and downs (new games/expansions/school year starts/ends/christmas season). It exploded upward at the middle of 2008 followed by a tank near the end of the year, again likely to do with the recession.

All the veteran game companies/publishers I've looked at have shown the same. Tanking in 2008 or 2009 is common, along with a "long term" "fairly steady" status, though many have taken some small losses in the last year.
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