Author Topic: Are we losing momentum ??  (Read 13212 times)

HEATSTROKE

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Are we losing momentum ??
« on: January 30, 2013, 03:47:44 AM »
I dont know.. it just feels like there is nothing going on.. no word.. no movement.. I know these things take time.. but I feel like without some kind of action our community will be an afterthought and fondly remembered but just chalked up to the casualty of gaming. The gaming industry needs to recognize that we are real people.. not just numbers on a spread sheet. You invite us into you world but yet you can end it on a whim.. even when it s PROFITABLE and then refuse to sell it or release the IP..

Personally I am very angry that I spend thousands of dollars and i have no idea how many hours designing builds, making background. writing intertwined stories. playing and meeting new people only to have that destroyed.. Its like the customer doesnt even matter.. 8 years of playing and being a customer and it means nothing. And to make matters worse the greatest issue EVER Issue 24 was soon to be released... but thats not even what makes me the most angry..

When my son was born I made a toon in his honor called SonStroke and although he is only two years old he would sit on my lap and I would log in his toon and he would hit the space bar to make him jump and and down and he would laugh and laugh...

you took that away from me NC Soft.... Hate is a very strong word which I almost never use..

But I HATE YOU..



JaguarX

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2013, 04:13:49 AM »
I dont know.. it just feels like there is nothing going on.. no word.. no movement.. I know these things take time.. but I feel like without some kind of action our community will be an afterthought and fondly remembered but just chalked up to the casualty of gaming. The gaming industry needs to recognize that we are real people.. not just numbers on a spread sheet.

I dont think must momentum has lost. The original furor and hell fire and brimstone burn everything to the ground has subsided lately, but over all, the grind to get things rolling is still going strong. The games are being developed, letters are still being sent out, people are still talking, and people are still angry.

When dealing with other corporations, for example, sometimes it takes more than brute force to get stuff done. It take finesse and walking that thin line between coming off as fans with money to spend on anyone that pick up the IP to raging hate mongering people that will try to burn anything or anyone that close down the game that they just so happening to be playing. We dont want to be viewed as the second option as that is bad for business as businesses tend to think ahead in the long term and probably wouldnt want to pick up a game where if they have to close or rather want to close they may have to deal with bad PR campaign against them. If come across as hurting avid fans and we are still here wanting to play, they may listen but still cant be too pushy while at the same time cant act like we are not serious.

Things are getting done, my good person, things are getting done. Our time will come when we can say we have triumph in one way or another. But the bonus would be if either of the games gets up and running and we can show them that a game can be ran by people with the customer in mind for the customer and by the customer.

Yet, in order to change the industry it will take more than a company picking up the IP and or creating games. The mindest has to change also. We as a people have to stop giving or the better term is rewarding these companies for bad behavior. If we want them to appreciate the customer, then support the company that does just that. If the companies with bad records and or just view customers as mere numbers on a spreadsheet continue to rake in millions or for some billions, then they will continue to not give a crap. I think many MMO players are getting fed up and the time is perfect as it may not come again. Money talks. People can rant rave moan groan, hate all they want but when those dollars roll in and subscription numbers show up, and it's looking lovely to them, they wont care. But if one of these games get on, get the word out that there is now an option for players to go for a game and or company with their customers in mind and intentions on treating them right, their words will no longer have to be empty. They can take action with their money and move to the new games. Then when their subscriptions numbers start to fall, and they lose more money, I mean real money, not money they already written off, then they will have no choice but to either reform to stay competitive or cease to exist. They can take games, they can close servers but it's our choice as customers to choose with our wallets. Change will come when as a whole we demand change. Yelling kicking creaming isnt going to do much when we are just a number on the spreadsheet to begin with. We must affect those numbers in a significant manner and that is going to take more than the lot of us here. But, that is how just about every change starts, with a small group that had enough and decided to take a stand. We are that stand. Now we must show them and the people we mean buisness and wont go away. We already have the will, we have the knowledge, we even have people that know the right people, but now we have to show them how it supposed to be done with these new projects. I think there is a lot riding on those projects and in the end, they will be considered more than a game. They are a symbol, that players can build their own and look out for their own and still be successful. Even if success doesn't happen, we learn, and the next attempt will be better and so on until ever company that have an MMO have to take notice and either change or fade with the times of history.


Soon we will be sitting around reminiscing on the days when game companies used to be able to shutdown a game at any moment and move on the next day like nothing even happened and how a few said we are not just going to take it and instead of griping about they did something about it. And I will be somewhere, probably too old to play games, saying, well done.

We already have the power, we have to (well here we are figuring out and or have figured out rather) how to use it against those corporate buggers.

no hero

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2013, 06:27:38 AM »
...you took that away from me NC Soft.... Hate is a very strong word which I almost never use..

But I HATE YOU..

Everyday, little things remind me of City.
A huge wave of delight and an ear-to-ear smile is closely followed by a dark realization and the words,
"I hate you, NCsoft."
Samantha:  "I have to ask you a question. It's a good one so think about it. If a Player and a Game love each other, but they just can't seem to get it together, when do you get to that point of enough is enough?"

Jerry:  "Never."

Captain Electric

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2013, 06:41:02 AM »
I think someone, anyone should start working on a device that will allow them to go back in time and prevent NCSoft from shutting down City of Heroes.

Edit: I guess my suggestion didn't work...

Lightslinger

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2013, 12:47:54 PM »
The OP has a point however in that momentum is something we have to address. Momentum is a short-lived commodity for groups like our's. The thing that binds our group is gone, as the months and years come and go there will be fewer and fewer people here, it just happens.

The hope is that just one of the Titan Network projects outlasts that loss of momentum, even if it just barely does, and we get our game back (or its successor). My personal belief is that the private server is our best chance at ever seeing CoH or something like it again, god speed coders.

Constant updates, maybe doing some marketing, hosting contests, fundraisers, anything to keep people active would be a good idea at this point in time.

Ironwolf

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2013, 02:15:22 PM »
I for one am reaching out still and may even take a trip down to the offices of Stardock a local game developer in the Detroit area.

I sent a letter off to them bringing up the idea of them trying to use the Michigan development grant to try and buy the IP for City of Heroes. I have not heard back from them but it has only been a week. I didn't expect a letter back the next day saying wow, what a great idea come on in we are filling out the paperwork today!

IF, big if as well, they consider my proposal there is still the paperwork required to get Michigan to give them the money. However if I don't get an answer from them - I have another idea in mind - in fact I may try and see if the University of Michigan could use that grant and buy the game to run for their game development degree class.

Ironwolf

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2013, 03:45:22 PM »
I know some professors have used CoH to teach classes with and I wonder if it is something we could sell to the U of M on how the class was taught and the benefits to the students - also buying the IP would allow the students to run the game and learn in a real life situation with the servers, programming and networking to administer.

This would allow a University to harness the marketing, advertising and other degrees in an active manner and to do so while having a game like this established and actually PAYING BACK the investment is another line of thought I have been debating. I think this could be sold to a college if packaged to the right place and honestly I think Michigan State or the U of M might just be the place.

The other thought is that the IP MIGHT just be sold for LESS if they approached NCSoft from the angle of using one of their games as a learning platform. It would be great customer relations for them and our game back for us.

General Idiot

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2013, 04:00:28 PM »
I think someone, anyone should start working on a device that will allow them to go back in time and prevent NCSoft from shutting down City of Heroes.

Edit: I guess my suggestion didn't work...

Depending on the exact mechanics of how time travel works in this universe, it's possible that it did actually work. If you subscribe to the theory that making changes in the past doesn't alter the future you came from but instead creates a second alternate timeline where the different future plays out (Essentially making the idea of an alternate timeline and an alternate dimension one and the same), your suggestion may in fact have worked. Just not in this timeline.

Logically, that's about the only way such an action wouldn't cause a massive paradox and blow a hole in the universe. Alternately, you simply made the attempt (Or will make the attempt) and failed. Which is more likely, given that the creation of an alternate universe takes enormous amounts of energy and the universe as a whole hates expending energy when it doesn't have to. Forcing a failure on any prospective time traveller is a much easier option.

Ironwolf

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2013, 04:04:05 PM »
This is the link to the U of M gaming program:

http://www.wolverinesoft.org/game

SARobb

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2013, 04:58:12 PM »
[brainmelt]
Depending on the exact mechanics of how time travel works in this universe, it's possible that it did actually work. If you subscribe to the theory that making changes in the past doesn't alter the future you came from but instead creates a second alternate timeline where the different future plays out (Essentially making the idea of an alternate timeline and an alternate dimension one and the same), your suggestion may in fact have worked. Just not in this timeline.

Logically, that's about the only way such an action wouldn't cause a massive paradox and blow a hole in the universe. Alternately, you simply made the attempt (Or will make the attempt) and failed. Which is more likely, given that the creation of an alternate universe takes enormous amounts of energy and the universe as a whole hates expending energy when it doesn't have to. Forcing a failure on any prospective time traveller is a much easier option.
[/brainmelt]

In all seriousness though, it took Asheron's call ...what... 10 years to be brought back to life? I honestly think that as long as we are all still here hoping and working for the same thing we'll get there eventually. There's going to be gains and losses in momentum no matter what we do.  This is a good community and I really believe we'll be able to push through momentary losses in momentum that we will suffer from time to time.
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dwturducken

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2013, 06:21:54 PM »
You should've seen the look on my eleven year old's face when he spontaneously described the Grandfather Paradox to me, and I countered with the alternate universe theory. It me be the closest I will ever come to actually seeing a brainmelt in action. :)
I wouldn't use the word "replace," but there's no word for "take over for you and make everything better almost immediately," so we just say "replace."

Twisted Toon

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2013, 06:58:29 PM »
Depending on the exact mechanics of how time travel works in this universe, it's possible that it did actually work. If you subscribe to the theory that making changes in the past doesn't alter the future you came from but instead creates a second alternate timeline where the different future plays out (Essentially making the idea of an alternate timeline and an alternate dimension one and the same), your suggestion may in fact have worked. Just not in this timeline.

Logically, that's about the only way such an action wouldn't cause a massive paradox and blow a hole in the universe. Alternately, you simply made the attempt (Or will make the attempt) and failed. Which is more likely, given that the creation of an alternate universe takes enormous amounts of energy and the universe as a whole hates expending energy when it doesn't have to. Forcing a failure on any prospective time traveller is a much easier option.
What if the alternate universe was already there, but the divergence hadn't happened yet? The two universes would look the exact same up until the choice had been made and then they diverged and it just looked like the second universe spontaneously popped into existence. No massive energy expenditure needed.

Just a thought... :)
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dwturducken

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2013, 07:24:54 PM »
Or, what if that universe still had City of Heroes, but donuts had never been invented?

To address the OP, I don't think real momentum is the issue, but that doesn't mean I think your concerns are invalid. If you look back through old threads, though, I think you'll find at least one other similar post right before Team Wildcard revealed themselves to us. I seem to recall another one sometime during the holidays. Ours is not a cause that has a set course, nor does it have a predictable timeline. If you're still here, that's enough, for now.
I wouldn't use the word "replace," but there's no word for "take over for you and make everything better almost immediately," so we just say "replace."

SARobb

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2013, 07:32:16 PM »
Or, what if that universe still had City of Heroes, but donuts had never been invented?
2 things:
  • when is the next transport to that universe?
  • What would that do for the doughnut shop in Faultline? what would it be?

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Ironwolf

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2013, 07:47:11 PM »
Trust me with so many people trying to find a way and to do so by often thinking completely out of the box, I still feel confident.

johnrobey

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2013, 08:55:17 PM »
I admit my own momentum has waned - but then with my somewhat erratic health and disabilities that is not news.  I loved CoH and still do, keep abreast of things here, take part in consumer actions and fan initiatives etc as best I can, relay info to my CoH buddies and pals via guildportal sg web pages (still active with discussion) etc.

Some of my time forcefully "liberated" by the closure of CoH has resulted in my resuming writing and blogging (on non-gaming stuff, mostly sociological and political) as well as involving myself further with online activities such as supporting worthy causes as best I may via internet.  Due to this however I read this, and include a link in hopes some of all of the CoH community will lend voice and weight to this petition:  http://www.cohtitan.com/forum/index.php/topic,7847.0.html  Yup, Halo 2 is scheduled for shut down on Feb 15th.  Keeping the faith.  /em holdtorch
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Segev

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2013, 08:59:03 PM »
Or, what if that universe still had City of Heroes, but donuts had never been invented?
I'd suggest playing at least until it rained.

johnrobey

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2013, 09:27:29 PM »
Or, what if that universe still had City of Heroes, but donuts had never been invented?

To address the OP, I don't think real momentum is the issue, but that doesn't mean I think your concerns are invalid. If you look back through old threads, though, I think you'll find at least one other similar post right before Team Wildcard revealed themselves to us. I seem to recall another one sometime during the holidays. Ours is not a cause that has a set course, nor does it have a predictable timeline. If you're still here, that's enough, for now.
I agree with what you say here, dwtruducken.  Also if IIRC from a certain CoH genius video, Fusionette would have something to say had donuts not been invented!  ;)
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Ironwolf

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2013, 09:43:19 PM »
Then we would have had to jump through this if no donuts were invented:
http://www.uniroyaltires.com/about/gianttire.html

Wyrm

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2013, 10:18:55 PM »
Today I got so nostalgic for CoH, I went and had a meaningless argument on some other forum.

Because I can't argue with y'all; you're family.  It's just not the same.

~Wyrm

p.s.  The other argument?  Also "not the same."

Taceus Jiwede

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2013, 10:55:14 PM »
Depending on the exact mechanics of how time travel works in this universe, it's possible that it did actually work. If you subscribe to the theory that making changes in the past doesn't alter the future you came from but instead creates a second alternate timeline where the different future plays out (Essentially making the idea of an alternate timeline and an alternate dimension one and the same), your suggestion may in fact have worked. Just not in this timeline.

Logically, that's about the only way such an action wouldn't cause a massive paradox and blow a hole in the universe. Alternately, you simply made the attempt (Or will make the attempt) and failed. Which is more likely, given that the creation of an alternate universe takes enormous amounts of energy and the universe as a whole hates expending energy when it doesn't have to. Forcing a failure on any prospective time traveller is a much easier option.

Unless of course who ever invented the time machine already went back in time to prevent NCSoft from closing but somehow made it happen on accident, in which case now they have to go back in time in the future and make sure NCSoft in fact does close CoH or we face a huge paradox,  Mender Silos would be so proud.

It reminds of the quote from Professor Farnsworth:
Quote
You mustn't interfere with the past! Don't do anything that affects anything, unless it turns out you were supposed to do it, in which case for the love of God, don't not do it!"

Sarge Morris

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #21 on: February 01, 2013, 12:51:36 PM »
I'd say yes.  However, I'll only say that here.  If asked anywhere else about the Save CoX Movement, however, I direct 'em here.  Kind of like when the media asks me for my take on the whole inclusion of women in combat.  I tell them, "Well, gee, I think you'd better talk to my commander about that." And I smile, nod, and point up higher.

But, again, yes, I think you're losing momentum.  This is the first time I've checked these boards in well over a month.  You've certainly lost me.  There's an incoherent scramble on multiple fronts in the software department, people are running around trying last-ditch efforts only to be shouted down by other people for not going along with their last-ditch efforts, as if they're in charge or something... 

Its been two months, folks.  I'm gonna call it, if no one else is.  CoX is, despite all attempts at resuscitation, dead. 

I'd love to eat those words.  But I don't think that's going to happen.  The Commies are going to hold onto the IP for this even if they go belly-up over it, specifically to save face.  All this overly-politically correct shenanigans about it being racist or whatever for pointing out the cultural differences is unrealistic.  The fact of the matter is, they're Korean, they made a decision, and they're going to ride it 'till the wheels fall off because they made that decision and its final.  Its what they do.  Its just how they are.  No amount of politically correct protest against stereotype is going to change that, it is what it is.  There are usually stereotypes for a reason. 

Also, to be frank, even if NCSoft does bring back CoX, I don't think I'd play it anymore.  I've got a funny feeling that if it does come back, its not going to be the same City that I knew and loved.  I sure as hell miss it, and I wish I was in touch with more of my friends from it, but its gone, folks.  If it does come back, its going to be a pale, Frankenstein-ed together mess trying to fill the shoes of its successor.  That's just what happens in the natural course of events.  Look at Star Trek.  First, it was a very story-driven science fiction tale, and it was good.  Then they tried again, and it was almost as good as the original.  Deep Space 9 rolled around, and it ended up being more about blinky-flashy firefights in space than story and by the time Enterprise rolled around, it was a bunch of goobers bleating, "Hey, remember when Star Trek did this?  We're doing it now, too!  Can we be cool?  Please?  Please like us?"  And when they handed it off to J.J. Abrams, everything became a bloated caricature of itself complete with overdone, poorly written plot contrivances and characters handled as if the director had only ever seen Family Guy's caricature of classic Star Trek and never a real episode. 

Paragon Studios has been scattered to the four winds, there's basically nobody left to turn the lights back on.  And just as Star Trek began to die a slow, lingering death after Gene Roddenberry passed away, CoX died when Paragon did.  I don't think anyone but the original team could make CoX viable again, and how many will come back? 

Perhaps its better this way.  As a Trek fan, I've had to sit through the new garbage, hoping that someone will get it right, and being painfully disappointed at every attempt.  As a CoX fan, I got to enjoy an awesome game played by awesome people made by an awesome development staff.  Unfortunately, everything died at once, but I think I'm actually okay with that now.  Once I got over the grieving stage, anyway.  Do I like the way it ended?  Did I like the way Captain Kirk had a bridge dropped on him?  Hell, no.  Absolutely not.  One of the worst ways to go in both instances.  But did the main body of work give me countless hours of fun and joy?  Yeah.  Yeah, it did, and man....  What a ride!

Lightslinger

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #22 on: February 01, 2013, 01:12:57 PM »
Well, that's great and all but I for one am a Trekkie who liked the new Trek and appreciated the fact that a new generation of fans has been brought into that universe.

And also, I still have hope in our coders working behind the scenes on top secret stuff, I do believe we will, in a much smaller fashion, be back in CoH at some point in the future.

Triplash

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #23 on: February 01, 2013, 02:56:48 PM »
Its been two months, folks.  I'm gonna call it, if no one else is.

Here's the problem I think most people are having. Two months is a lot of days, which feels like a long time to us, because we operate in terms of days. But businesses don't. Small businesses operate in terms of weeks, and large businesses - the kind capable of spending millions on a single project - operate in terms of months. It's only been two months, barely enough time for a large company to notice the situation and decide whether or not to look closer.

If they do decide to look closer, they'll notice the potential price range and assign number crunchers to determine the likelihood and the time frame required to recover their investment and begin to see profits. They will also assign lawyers to determine possible delays and roadblocks. With this much time and money invested into just looking at something, they want to be sure they've covered all the details, so the people assigned to these tasks will not be rushing.

Plus it's not like those number crunchers and lawyers just sit on their heels waiting for things to do; they've got full schedules already, and new projects don't just begin immediately. No matter how attractive a prospect CoH might be, it won't be enough to drop all their other responsibilities and make it a priority. It's just something to look into, which means they get to it when its turn comes up.

Once they do start looking, they won't be finished immediately either. Any company outside of Korea would have a lot of research to do into international laws and taxes, and the area of intellectual property is unclear at best. Who knows, there may even be some obscure bylaw in one party's specific physical region that makes the sale illegal between those two particular parties, while it wouldn't be for someone else. Sometimes weird things like that pop up, and there's just no telling until you've done the research. Large businesses do realize this, it's par for the course for most of them, but that doesn't make slow things happen faster.

Long story short: two months is not enough time to call this one. Don't give up hope, Sarge. We ain't done yet. Not by far.

Omega Mark V

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #24 on: February 01, 2013, 03:33:00 PM »
Not to mention out Google Call to Action has not started yet, due to this explanation with our Disney proposal:

It's only been two months, barely enough time for a large company to notice the situation and decide whether or not to look closer.

Once they do start looking, they won't be finished immediately either.

Long story short: two months is not enough time to call this one.

I'm confident we'll have CoH back sometime. A good game like that doesn't die out, just as we haven't.
- Omega Mk. V

Lightslinger

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #25 on: February 01, 2013, 03:58:55 PM »
I felt like a more reasonable time table is in months or years from the outset (or sunset, rather).

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-Convince NCsoft to sell and find a buyer - Potentially anyday, more likely months or years if ever.
-Reverse engineer private/community server - 1 year (being optimistic with that, here's hoping though)
-Plan Z - 5-10 years


TonyV

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #26 on: February 01, 2013, 04:08:11 PM »
Here's the problem I think most people are having. Two months is a lot of days, which feels like a long time to us, because we operate in terms of days. But businesses don't. Small businesses operate in terms of weeks, and large businesses - the kind capable of spending millions on a single project - operate in terms of months. It's only been two months, barely enough time for a large company to notice the situation and decide whether or not to look closer.

Triplash is precisely correct.  When we started out on this quest, I was really, REALLY hoping that NCsoft would understand quickly that letting go of the IP was in their best interest.  There was a fairly decent chance that all of this could have been wrapped up within a few weeks after the announcement or by the announced shutdown date.

However, I also knew that when we started out on this quest that there was a non-zero chance that it will turn into a long-haul slog in waiting months, maybe even years, for NCsoft to budge.  I've been up front about that the whole time, that at some point, we'd have to be VERY patient as periods of time pass.  It doesn't mean that there's not activity; it just means that for this series of events, there's not going to be a lot of day-to-day reporting on what's going on.

That doesn't mean that there's still not stuff to do.  One thing that is always helpful is to keep the pressure on NCsoft.  Continue sending them letters.  Continue participating in Task Force Hail Mary.  Keep posting messages and keep in touch here.  Be sure to stay plugged in to what's going on with The Phoenix Project and Heroes and Villains projects.  Volunteer if you have some skills either can use.  Just because we're not posting messages every day repeating that doesn't mean that we still don't need it, or that we've given up on having them happen.  We're just trying not to spam everyone with messages that say the same thing.

It's a valid point, though, and I'll try to post stuff once in a while on the ongoing effort to get NCsoft to release the IP and about the new projects.

johnrobey

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #27 on: February 01, 2013, 04:13:09 PM »
Agreed, two months is not nearly enough time for this process.  I and others in Colorado Civil Service used to joke that both government and glaciers start with the letter "G" and often seemed to move at about the same pace - of course that was long before we knew about global warming and climate change....    ;)
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"Where They Have Burned Books They Will End In Burning Human Beings" -- Heinrich Heine

Ironwolf

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #28 on: February 01, 2013, 04:16:00 PM »
I will repeat a timeline given I work for a large company and how they do things:

1. Idea submitted to a company - filtered by secretaries or lower management - 2 weeks before it ever sees a main dudes desk.

2. He likes the idea and wants to explore it - assigns it to a lower manager who then gives it to a team to investigate it - 2-4 weeks

3. Money team investigates it and finds that there is a market for it and the cost could be paid for in 26 months and then it would start making a profit, they also do a cost analysis and find that by advertising X dollars you could gain x dollars back. - 1-2 months

4. Team passes it to legal - legal runs the purchase agreement and looks to see if it infringes or could leave them open to any liabilities - 2-3 months,

5. Report back to CEO or management and give the green light - 1 month

6. Offer tendered to NCSoft for purchase of software IP and account information - NCSoft decides whether to sell or not, says yes and gets their lawyers involved - 1-2 months

7. Game is purchased - server and development team hired game is ported and Alpha is started. 1-2 months

8. Open Beta - 1-2 months.

Game opens about 12-18 months after this all starts.

So no I don't feel there is anything to worry about at this stage. I think after only 60 days we are just fine and we lost 15 of those 60 for the holiday.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2013, 08:07:55 PM by Ironwolf »

johnrobey

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #29 on: February 01, 2013, 10:20:21 PM »
GO, GO GOOD TEAM!!!!!   

Someone had to say it!  :P 
"We must be the change we wish to see in the world." -- Mahatma Gandhi         "In every generation there has to be some fool who will speak the truth as he sees it." -- Boris Pasternak
"Where They Have Burned Books They Will End In Burning Human Beings" -- Heinrich Heine

healix

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #30 on: February 04, 2013, 11:36:59 PM »
rickety-rackety ree.......kick em in the knee!!!!!

rickety-rackety rass......kick em in the..................other knee!!!!

Listen to the 'mustn'ts'. Listen to the 'don'ts'. Listen to the 'shouldn'ts', the 'impossibles', the 'won'ts'. Listen to the 'you'll never haves', then listen close to me... Anything can happen . Anything can be.

FatherXmas

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #31 on: February 05, 2013, 12:23:44 AM »
Emulsify them! Emulsify them! Turn them into a thin film over the playing surface!

We had very geeky cheers in college.
Tempus unum hominem manet

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houtex

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #32 on: February 05, 2013, 02:09:16 AM »
My favorite was at the bottom:

"SAVE THIS SHEET!  LEARN THESE CHEERS!"

Victoria Victrix

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #33 on: February 05, 2013, 02:13:57 AM »
Emulsify them! Emulsify them! Turn them into a thin film over the playing surface!

We had very geeky cheers in college.

Demosthenes!  Thucydides!  Peloponnesian War!  X-squared!  Y-squared! H2SO4!
I will go down with this ship.  I won't put my hands up in surrender.  There will be no white flag above my door.  I'm in love, and always will be.  Dido

johnrobey

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #34 on: February 05, 2013, 07:25:05 AM »
Aeschylus! Sappho ("With his venom irresistible and bittersweet, Love that loosener of limbs strikes me down!"), Socrates!  one small smidge of Plato, Pythagoras, and Aphrodite.  1 of Hydrogen 2 of Oxygen, and all of Norton Justin's The Phantom Tollbooth http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Phantom_Tollbooth especially the Princesses Rhyme and Reason and the kings AZAZ and the Mathemagician.  Add a touch of Half Magic by Edward Eager, and maybe some of Magic by the Lake and all of Seslyle Joslin's What Do You Say, Dear? and What Do You Do, Dear? as well as Sylvia Louise Engdahl, Patricia McKillip, Ursula K. LeGuin, and Roger Zelazny!

May the spirit of the Bards be with each and everyone one of us.  Best Wishes to all Titans, even those who don't read or post here.  Namaste

*Editing to note I (LOL) said 1 Hydrogen and 2 Oxygen, when I was thinking H2O water, but I shall let the error stand since I'm rather fond of atmospheres with breathable air as well as water.   :D
« Last Edit: February 05, 2013, 11:18:06 PM by johnrobey »
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johnrobey

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #35 on: February 05, 2013, 07:34:27 AM »
rickety-rackety ree.......kick em in the knee!!!!!

rickety-rackety rass......kick em in the..................other knee!!!!


Dear Healix,
That was my knee you know, dear, for I slipped on the Minnesota ice just yesterday.  Nope, no serious injury, just an unexpected, unintended pratfall (i think we can all agree that at times I am something of a prat).  LMAO!!!!  Hugs, Healix, good seeing you here.  TTYL, dearhearts.  Ciao!
P.S. hmmm, after looking at current dictionary definitions for prat, I think I would prefer to use the term "fool" as in there is no fool like an old fool.  Add here notions about foolishness, the role of fools, and even the symbolism of The Fool in a deck of tarot cards.  Peace out!
"We must be the change we wish to see in the world." -- Mahatma Gandhi         "In every generation there has to be some fool who will speak the truth as he sees it." -- Boris Pasternak
"Where They Have Burned Books They Will End In Burning Human Beings" -- Heinrich Heine

srmalloy

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #36 on: February 05, 2013, 07:57:21 PM »
Emulsify them! Emulsify them! Turn them into a thin film over the playing surface!

We had very geeky cheers in college.

Shift to the left! Shift to the right! Pop up, push down, byte, byte, byte!

Although MIT's has to be the geekiest:

I'm a Beaver!
Yu're a Beaver!
We are Beavers all!
And when we get together
We do the Beaver call!
e^u  du/dx!
e^x dx!
Cosine, secant, tangent, sine!
3.14159!
Integral, radical, mu dv!
Slipstick, slide rule, MIT!
Goooo TECH!

Perfidus

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #37 on: February 05, 2013, 11:23:06 PM »
I respect you Sarge, but I'm going to have to agree with the others who've said that two months simply isn't long enough. Especially when you consider those two months were smack dab in the middle of the holiday season, where very little happens in the corporate world anyway.

I understand if you want to throw in the towel. Many others are following suit. But many more, myself included, aren't yet done fighting. So if you're going to 'call it', call it for you and you alone.

Xieveral

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #38 on: February 06, 2013, 01:04:58 AM »
Not to mention out Google Call to Action has not started yet, due to this explanation with our Disney proposal:

I'm confident we'll have CoH back sometime. A good game like that doesn't die out, just as we haven't.

Originally, the Disney effort (on our part, not their decision-making) was going to last anywhere from two weeks to a month. But I think VV said that back on the official forums, not here.

As for Google, I thought VV's contact was to get back to her mid-January on the proposal. (not a yes or no, but something like "I got it to them, now we wait and see"")

Understandaby, things change but there's so much "what if"

The big one being what if Disney keeps as quiet as NCSoft and don't give a reply whatsoever, not even a "we recieved your letters but have not made a decision at this time" we can't afford to wait on them forever. Interest in picking up the game diminishes with every day, week, month that goes by.

While we wait, wouldn't it be better to start work on the next target? Maybe if there's competition, someone's more likely to jump at the offer instead of dragging their feet.

I don't think anyone's expecting Disney to say "Yes, we'll buy it!" but we would like a "We hear you, we haven't made any decisions yet." rather than worrying that our letters sit in the trash and they're staying quiet (like NCSoft)
« Last Edit: February 06, 2013, 01:14:42 AM by Xieveral »
?RSN = CKN(CRS.ROD)

RSN = GLR(EMP.MCL)

houtex

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #39 on: February 06, 2013, 03:44:19 AM »
Shift to the left! Shift to the right! Pop up, push down, byte, byte, byte!

Although MIT's has to be the geekiest:

I'm a Beaver!
Yu're a Beaver!
We are Beavers all!
And when we get together
We do the Beaver call!
e^u  du/dx!
e^x dx!
Cosine, secant, tangent, sine!
3.14159!
Integral, radical, mu dv!
Slipstick, slide rule, MIT!
Goooo TECH!


I had to find it.. AND I DID:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vV_BrpK4W7g

LOL. :)

FatherXmas

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #40 on: February 06, 2013, 04:30:35 AM »
Shift to the left! Shift to the right! Pop up, push down, byte, byte, byte!

Although MIT's has to be the geekiest:

I'm a Beaver!
Yu're a Beaver!
We are Beavers all!
And when we get together
We do the Beaver call!
e^u  du/dx!
e^x dx!
Cosine, secant, tangent, sine!
3.14159!
Integral, radical, mu dv!
Slipstick, slide rule, MIT!
Goooo TECH!

Yea, we had one that was similar.

e^x dy dx
e^x dx
Cosine, secant, tangent, sine!
3.14159!
Sqrt, Cube root, log of pi
dis-integrate them RPI
Tempus unum hominem manet

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Senkan

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #41 on: February 06, 2013, 11:19:56 AM »
I'm sorry to say..at this point.. we need to put COH behind us.  I can't see NCSoft bringing it back.  And even if they did who would trust them?  We need to put our attention and focus on the new projects.  These projects need momentum.  The COH fan base will come to a new game.  And the new game will bring new players.  Hopefully the new game can have some of what COH had (AE, invention system, sweet costume creator, huge monster events, etc..).  The more customizing the better!




 

Perfidus

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #42 on: February 06, 2013, 11:58:10 AM »
We don't really even want NCSoft to bring it back, because as you say, we don't trust them. That's never been the point of our efforts. We want them to release the IP, and on that end I see no reason at all to give up and 'put it behind me'. This is six years of my life. I'm not giving up after two piddly months.

Lightslinger

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #43 on: February 06, 2013, 12:29:04 PM »
I'm sorry to say..at this point.. we need to put COH behind us.  I can't see NCSoft bringing it back.  And even if they did who would trust them?  We need to put our attention and focus on the new projects.  These projects need momentum.  The COH fan base will come to a new game.  And the new game will bring new players.  Hopefully the new game can have some of what COH had (AE, invention system, sweet costume creator, huge monster events, etc..).  The more customizing the better!

Even if NCsoft never releases the IP AND the Plan Z projects don't take off there's still work being done to get a private server going. We've got multiple options for getting CoH (or something very close to it) back, no reason to throw in the towel on any one of our options yet. Not even close.

Segev

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #44 on: February 06, 2013, 01:21:36 PM »
Hopefully the new game can have some of what COH had (AE, invention system, sweet costume creator, huge monster events, etc..).  The more customizing the better!
Much of this is, indeed, planned in the Phoenix Project. Our first efforts are to get the costume creator put together for release as a stand-alone product, because we can get that done faster than the entire MMO and give the community something to get together over and discuss sooner rather than later. It still will take time, but it will happen! Look for Missing Worlds Media on facebook and visit our web site and forums at missingworldsmedia.com to see some of what we're doing. I know we have a couple of blog-style posts on Facebook and our web page, as well.

I don't want to see momentum diminish for the Save CoH effort, but for those who need something in which to take heart, the Phoenix Project is making continuing strides in its development efforts.

Triplash

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #45 on: February 06, 2013, 01:48:43 PM »
This is six years of my life. I'm not giving up after two piddly months.

You know, I don't think I've ever heard it put better than this.

+1'd

Ironwolf

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #46 on: February 06, 2013, 02:20:11 PM »
I know we are used to instant gratification these days, however you have in here a very dedicated group of people. I don't think any of us could take time away from their work to create or recreate a game like City of Heroes on a full time basis.

We have our best men, BEST MEN working on it but it takes time.

A community or a persons character isn't defined by how you react when things are going poorly - you earn character by how you behave when undergoing hardship.


Copper Cockroach

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #47 on: February 06, 2013, 02:53:42 PM »
"History... is-a made at night! Character... is what-a you are in-a the dark! We must-a work while-a the clock, she's-a ticking!"

- Dr. Emilio Lizardo

Illusionss

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #48 on: February 06, 2013, 06:20:33 PM »
This is six years of my life. I'm not giving up after two piddly months.

*Holds up hand in horns salute* This.

Are we losing momentum? I think we are doing all we can. I'm impatient, too. I am in fact the very Queen of Impatient. But.... a problem of this magnetude is not quickly fixed.

If we get the IP: I'm there. If we get an emulator server: so much there. If we get a new game built on what we love: also there.

I don't like waiting - who does - but a game like this is worth waiting for. Because I want to fly again.

Victoria Victrix

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #49 on: February 07, 2013, 02:04:45 AM »
OK folks, first, I got derailed for ALL of January (and still am a good bit) by influenza.

I'm 62.  This hit hard.  A solid week of fever, 3 weeks of sleeping 12-16 hours a day, coughing until I thought I had broken a rib, it hurt so much (didn't, just strained muscles). 

My Google contact got back to me yesterday to say that the three contacts he had for OUTSIDE Google did not pan out.  One was at Disney and had gotten fired they day they bought the SW francise, the other two weren't interested for reasons that had nothing to do with the game (he didn't elaborate).

TODAY he gave me the direct contact at Google Play, who told him "Please have her send me the pitch package."  So Rae, Quinch, Ammon and I will be working on the new Google Pitch package.

Once I get done with the book that is now a full month behind schedule and due in 2 weeks....*cries*
I will go down with this ship.  I won't put my hands up in surrender.  There will be no white flag above my door.  I'm in love, and always will be.  Dido

JaguarX

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #50 on: February 07, 2013, 02:10:47 AM »


Once I get done with the book that is now a full month behind schedule and due in 2 weeks....*cries*
Oh man. That cant be good.

Kuriositys Kat

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #51 on: February 07, 2013, 02:36:12 AM »
OK folks, first, I got derailed for ALL of January (and still am a good bit) by influenza.

I'm 62.  This hit hard.  A solid week of fever, 3 weeks of sleeping 12-16 hours a day, coughing until I thought I had broken a rib, it hurt so much (didn't, just strained muscles). 

My Google contact got back to me yesterday to say that the three contacts he had for OUTSIDE Google did not pan out.  One was at Disney and had gotten fired they day they bought the SW francise, the other two weren't interested for reasons that had nothing to do with the game (he didn't elaborate).

TODAY he gave me the direct contact at Google Play, who told him "Please have her send me the pitch package."  So Rae, Quinch, Ammon and I will be working on the new Google Pitch package.

Once I get done with the book that is now a full month behind schedule and due in 2 weeks....*cries*

Dang it, the only time travel option I have access to is traveling counterclockwise over the International Date Line and that would only gain you at most 23 hours and change and even then it would be relative, still wouldn't affect your publisher's clocks and calendars...

*pulls out note pad places one more underline under: Invent time alteration machine ala "The Girl, Gold Watch and Everything" (the book)*
"There are worlds out there where the sky is burning, and the sea's asleep, and the rivers dream; people made of smoke and cities made of song. Somewhere there's danger, somewhere there's injustice, and somewhere else the tea's getting cold. Come on, Ace. We've got work to do!" - The Doctor

houtex

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #52 on: February 07, 2013, 03:16:38 AM »
I'm sorry to say..at this point.. we need to put COH behind us.  I can't see NCSoft bringing it back.  And even if they did who would trust them?  We need to put our attention and focus on the new projects.  These projects need momentum.  The COH fan base will come to a new game.  And the new game will bring new players.  Hopefully the new game can have some of what COH had (AE, invention system, sweet costume creator, huge monster events, etc..).  The more customizing the better!

You go ahead and give.  I'm not.  I've got 7.5 years in it, myself.  And characters I still care about.  Yes, it's all virtual, but not totally.  There are Things(tm) being done.  And there's Hope.  Always.

Give up?  Only if I can't breathe anymore. :)

Perfidus

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #53 on: February 07, 2013, 03:59:43 AM »
Obviously I take it all with trepid optimism, but that does sound mildly promising VV.

Twisted Toon

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #54 on: February 07, 2013, 05:55:25 AM »
You go ahead and give.  I'm not.  I've got 7.5 years in it, myself.  And characters I still care about.  Yes, it's all virtual, but not totally.  There are Things(tm) being done.  And there's Hope.  Always.
I feel the same way.
I also have 8 years in it. Started in September (the 5th) in 2004.

Quote
Give up?  Only if I can't breathe anymore. :)

I see you are following my family motto, "Dum Spiro Spero".
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms

Rotten Luck

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #55 on: February 07, 2013, 01:17:15 PM »
These are our darkest hours.  We knew they were coming we expected NCsoft wasn't going to change their minds.  No reason to give up because we were right.

I spent years in Coh myself started when City of Villains came out.  But for me I was never fighting for a game.  A game is pixels and behind the image computations.  I'm fighting for a franchise that could have pushed Superhero MMOs into the next generation gaming.  With the right advertisement and the time is Ripe now with all the Superhero Movies and such... But no instead of delivering a City of heroes 2 and advertising it to hell.  NCsoft went with more fantasy and sword swinging skimpy clad stuff.

No I was never fighting for a game.  The game I got over long ago.  I'm fighting for this Awesome community!  I'm fighting for Dignity that should have been given to the Paragon Development team that pushed a 8 year old game to it's limits and beyond.  I'm fighting for a Franchise that was and could still overshadow all other Superhero games out there.  I am and always will fight for Truth, Justice, and the thrill of sending a hellion goon into outer-space with a Street Justice powered up Uppercut!

"Courage doesn't always roar.  Sometimes courage is the little voice at the end of the day that says I'll try again tomorrow."  ~Mary Anne Radmacher

"Don't aim for success if you want it; just do what you love and believe in, and it will come naturally."  ~David Frost

And the best Quote for us!

"Once you choose hope, anything's possible."  ~Christopher Reeve.  Can't disagree with a real Superman now can we?  One way or another be it in a relaunch of CoH, or in a new game of our making, or even somehow somewhere a studio is about to launch a superhero MMO that has the magic of City of heroes...

WE WILL FLY AGAIN!

One way or another... Heroes will fly again!

Twisted Toon

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #56 on: February 07, 2013, 08:22:22 PM »
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms

healix

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #57 on: February 12, 2013, 08:50:14 AM »
Listen to the 'mustn'ts'. Listen to the 'don'ts'. Listen to the 'shouldn'ts', the 'impossibles', the 'won'ts'. Listen to the 'you'll never haves', then listen close to me... Anything can happen . Anything can be.

Blackbird71

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #58 on: February 13, 2013, 08:20:22 PM »
To the OP, and the rest of the SaveCoH community, all I can say is have patience.

A few days ago, I did something that I haven't been able to do in over eight years, something which I had little hope of ever being able to do again: I logged into Earth and Beyond, a beloved game that was also shut down before its time.  But a couple of months ago, the emulator moved out of beta and into live mode.  The community is not the size it once was (neither is the server), but the heart and spirit are still there.

Even in its prime, EnB was never a hugely successful game, largely due to the fact that its publisher gave it no support whatsoever, and had no interest in maintaining it beyond lipservice to contractual obligations.  But if a game like this could inspire a community to gather the talent and spend the time and effort necessary to rebuild, and then succeed at doing so, then there is no reason not to believe that CoH will also rise again one day.

So it may take time, some may lose interest along the way, but have patience, and eventually we will have our city back.

Megajoule

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #59 on: February 13, 2013, 09:33:35 PM »
Two months is nothing.  It took twice as long as that for Paragon, working on it full-time as their actual jobs, with all of the code and tools already at hand, to put together, test and launch an Issue.
If that's the kind of timeframe you were expecting results on, then I'm sorry, but you clearly have no idea what's actually involved in a project like this.

I get it.  You want your game back, preferably exactly how it was at 00:00 12/1/12.  Log in to your characters and go.  And you want it to be done yesterday.  By people doing this in their spare time.
It doesn't work like that.
If you aren't prepared to wait literal years for a revival, a spiritual successor, a private server emulator or something else... then I'm sorry, because you will be terribly disappointed.

Twisted Toon

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #60 on: February 14, 2013, 12:42:52 AM »
Two months is nothing.  It took twice as long as that for Paragon, working on it full-time as their actual jobs, with all of the code and tools already at hand, to put together, test and launch an Issue.
If that's the kind of timeframe you were expecting results on, then I'm sorry, but you clearly have no idea what's actually involved in a project like this.

I get it.  You want your game back, preferably exactly how it was at 00:00 12/1/12.  Log in to your characters and go.  And you want it to be done yesterday.  By people doing this in their spare time.
It doesn't work like that.
If you aren't prepared to wait literal years for a revival, a spiritual successor, a private server emulator or something else... then I'm sorry, because you will be terribly disappointed.

I am a patient person. I went to the doctor just a few months ago. :)






*wonders how many heads that little bit of humor will fly over*
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms

Rotten Luck

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #61 on: February 14, 2013, 01:07:29 AM »
I am a patient person. I went to the doctor just a few months ago. :)






*wonders how many heads that little bit of humor will fly over*

*Looks up at the speck in the sky* I know I should be able to get it...  I blame the beer!  What?  It's my Birthday I'm allowed to drink!
One way or another... Heroes will fly again!

Twisted Toon

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #62 on: February 14, 2013, 01:38:03 AM »
*Looks up at the speck in the sky* I know I should be able to get it...  I blame the beer!  What?  It's my Birthday I'm allowed to drink!
I have two words for you.

Patient and Doctor.

Subtle, I know. :)
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms

no hero

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #63 on: February 14, 2013, 05:14:29 AM »
*Looks up at the speck in the sky* I know I should be able to get it...  I blame the beer!  What?  It's my Birthday I'm allowed to drink!

I have two words for you.

Patient and Doctor.

Subtle, I know. :)

Confused.
Samantha:  "I have to ask you a question. It's a good one so think about it. If a Player and a Game love each other, but they just can't seem to get it together, when do you get to that point of enough is enough?"

Jerry:  "Never."

Kemphler

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #64 on: February 14, 2013, 05:32:38 AM »
Well...After playing CoH/V since Sept '04...I'm quite certain that I can wait a few months, even a year or two to get going at it again. Mind you, I'm more than happy to wait on the Plan Zs that are in the works. Looking forward to them! And I know I'm not very vocal about all this, here or elsewhere really...but I still got to the old CoH website and keep giving it page hits every day. Making sure that they know that there are still some who want it back.
"I intend to live forever, or die trying." - Groucho Marx

Twisted Toon

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #65 on: February 14, 2013, 06:27:51 AM »
Confused.
If you go see a Doctor, you are usually called a patient...hence...a patient person...

I've been told that if you have to explain a joke it wasn't a funny one... :(
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms

Triplash

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #66 on: February 14, 2013, 11:44:52 AM »
Ummm... is this the kind of doctor that wears bow ties? ???

Twisted Toon

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Re: Are we losing momentum ??
« Reply #67 on: February 14, 2013, 07:18:55 PM »
Ummm... is this the kind of doctor that wears bow ties? ???
Well, Dr. Mallard, the ME for NCIS, wears a Bow Tie. But, I seriously doubt anyone would want to be a "patient" of his.

No blue box of traveling though.
Hope never abandons you, you abandon it. - George Weinberg

Hope ... is not a feeling; it is something you do. - Katherine Paterson

Nobody really cares if you're miserable, so you might as well be happy. - Cynthia Nelms