New efforts! -- metadiscussion

[Minotaur]

Not THeM!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2PLls02gOU

Nor Them https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Wah7MqEHFg

[Rae]

And if the whole thing fizzles, we're no worse off, and we do appreciate the incredible amount of time and effort they've already put in (even Rae, who is now in what, her second team and set of proposals at least, besides doing P.R. for CoT?).

Thanks for the kind thought, but aside from talking to Ironwolf about how the original TFHM tackled the pitch, I've not been involved with the current efforts. (Although I am still PR for COT).

I wish Ironwolf and the current THFM all the luck in the world, but I just couldn't put myself through that again

[Scendera]

None of that is something any old GM could fix; it would take senior developer-level surgery on the character data. I really doubt anyone is going to want to open the door to tickets like that coming from every single player.

Like I said before, Sentinel+ exports were "best effort" and never intended to be used with a commercial relaunch. We considered that the least likely scenario in which they would be needed. The best you can hope for with that is probably extracting the costume and maybe a mids build in order to know what to slot.

Going back to EQ emulation for a second...there's a suite of tools for that sort of repairs. A typical, single character repair of what looks like a small sort takes ~15 minutes and ran the cpu on the coolest machine I've ever owned so hot I was giving seriously thought to aborting the process, even knowing it would destroy the whole database most likely. I was in genuine fear of the machine being damaged it thrashed it so hard and spiked temps so high.

That's one character, one small adjustment...

Now let's talk about a database the size of a full MMO, rather than 2 players messing around on a private server. You obviously couldn't batch adjust this, because of so many different factors. You'd have to set it up for each one, and then run it.

Even figuring real server hardware being loads faster AND better cooled than a private pc, no matter how well behaved....it's absolutely prohibitive. Absolutely, completely, beyond a shadow of a doubt impossible.

As you've pointed out in other posts, it's likely not the same...but I at least get why it's simply not going to happen.

Should there ever be private servers, I'm fairly certainly someone will devise a tool that may or may not be that touchy to allow the admins to fix things. Almost certainly it would end up closer to the old D2 trainers that would let you set your quest progress, rather than something that has to change several thousand faction interactions for a single character. But that's simply not going to happen in a corporate environment, IMO.

[Safehouse]

Wow, people are hitting the boiling point everywhere this weekend.  The timing of any kind of "official" announcement on Monday, falling as it does right on the tale of the anniversary of the game-closure announcement, apparently has much of the devoted COX community increasingly at one another's throats, instead of coming together in support of one another.  It feels like the X-Files episode "Syzygy ", where a rare cosmic alignment drives everyone temporarily crazy...

It really saddens me to see so much anger here and on FB directed at each other, when we should be hopeful.  God willing, tomorrow people will calm down.  As for me, I'm stepping away until the announcement, whatever it is, is actually finally made.

^^This.

One of the things that I have been proud of this community for is the fact that everyone's kindness and respect for one another sets itself apart from a lot of other MMO communities out there. But, more and more, I have seen so much unpleasantness here in recent days. Let's not forget that we're all part of the same community. We all want the same thing. We need to be here for each other rather than turning on one another. Working together has gotten us to this point. Tomorrow, whether we have a game back, or we don't, or we just learn the name of THeM, we will have gotten to this point together, and we will continue to move past this point together.

So chill, take some deep breaths, relax, and wait. We can do this!

[Surelle]

Am I the only one who'd be a bit disappointed if it turned out the current THeM team turned out to be Missing Worlds Media?

Not because I don't think they'd do a good job if they got COX, but because I really want to see City of Titans come out?

That is so sweet.  Maybe it isn't them, and maybe it is.  But on the chance that it *is* MWM, in a sense you still will be getting CoT.  The same people will be using the same engine with the same ideas....just some tweaks to the lore perhaps.     And who says there can't be new villain groups and a somewhat modified art style?  Whomever was responsible for the Unreal 3 world design and art was doing a terrific job over there; that CoT U3 trailer displayed it.  Those people are serious about what they're doing, really put the time in from ground zero around lives and "real jobs" and families, and it shows.  And best of all, CoT came about so that "our world" would never get shut down again.  So in a way...who better to take over CoH and CoH2?

I just hope whoever Team Hail Mary is, they don't get hammered into the ground by criticisms, complaints and demands even if the deal goes through.  Let's hope this current hurdle of acquiring the game is the biggest hurdle they ever get hit with.   And if it all does go south, we're no worse off, and it was nice to dream for a little while.

[Illusionss]

Wow, people are hitting the boiling point everywhere this weekend.  The timing of any kind of "official" announcement on Monday, falling as it does right on the tale of the anniversary of the game-closure announcement, apparently has much of the devoted COX community increasingly at one another's throats, instead of coming together in support of one another.  It feels like the X-Files episode "Syzygy ", where a rare cosmic alignment drives everyone temporarily crazy...

It really saddens me to see so much anger here and on FB directed at each other, when we should be hopeful.  God willing, tomorrow people will calm down.  As for me, I'm stepping away until the announcement, whatever it is, is actually finally made.

I have long thought that FB literally makes people crazy. I really think it does.

People cant wait literally one more day...?

[Cobra Man]

You're not alone, Robert kinda pissed me off too.

"Like, dude. Shut the hell up until things are finalized. You can only do harm."

+1

I don't care if he was technically correct or not.

The announcement was self serving only and wasn't helpful whatsoever.

[Shifter]

Am I the only one who'd be a bit disappointed if it turned out the current THeM team turned out to be Missing Worlds Media?

Not because I don't think they'd do a good job if they got COX, but because I really want to see City of Titans come out?

Although highly improbable, I would LOVE to see MWM get this, they get CoH back up and running as is, and then slowly add in everything they promised in kickstarted piecemeal into the game.

Wow, people are hitting the boiling point everywhere this weekend.

My suggestion is to get off this forum and go do your chores, housework, or anything else you have been putting off as you are going to be thoroughly distracted this Monday ; )

[HEATSTROKE]

Although highly improbable, I would LOVE to see MWM get this, they get CoH back up and running as is, and then slowly add in everything they promised in kickstarted piecemeal into the game.

My suggestion is to get off this forum and go do your chores, housework, or anything else you have been putting off as you are going to be thoroughly distracted this Monday ; )

MwM has always said that is CoH came back they would continue to develop CoT.. they also have other future non CoT projects planned..

[TonyV]

MwM has always said that is CoH came back they would continue to develop CoT.. they also have other future non CoT projects planned..

I just want to reiterate this.  Although I can't point to a specific post right now, I know they're out there, in which MWM has confirmed that a potential CoH return would not alter their plans to proceed with development on City of Titans.

You're not alone, Robert kinda pissed me off too.

I just want to say again that I don't hate Robert or anything.  Did he piss me off?  Yeah, when he deleted my post trying to tamp down the "YAY THE GAME IS RELAUNCHING!!!" talk and jumped my case for calling him a liar (which I didn't), it did.  But I do want to reiterate that I don't doubt his good intentions, and I don't really fault him for diligently trying to chase down information about the negotiations.  I don't want people to split into Robert/Tony camps, each piling on the other.  I probably won't send him a Christmas card, but again, I don't hate him or want him ostracized or anything.  I just want everyone to chill out and stop pumping the rumor mill and give the Hail Mary team a little bit more time to do their thing and (finally!) speak for themselves.

Wow, people are hitting the boiling point everywhere this weekend.
...
It really saddens me to see so much anger here and on FB directed at each other, when we should be hopeful.

I'm not sure if this is specifically referring to the post that came right before this one, but perhaps a short explanation is in order for those of you who saw it and/or had responses to it deleted by our moderators.

For a couple of years now, there has been a user who has been repeatedly creating accounts and posting abusive, almost incomprehensible rants.  We ban his accounts as he creates them and moderate his posts, but he's taken to using Tor to avoid the IP bans we've put in place.  (Incidentally, if you are a Tor user and you got cut off from the forums a week or so ago, that's why.)  We've also reported him to his ISP and to various services (Twitter, YouTube, Facebook), and several of them have helped us curb his abuse.

If you see one of these posts, please do not respond, as this only encourages him.  Just report it to the moderator, and we'll delete the post(s) and ban the account and IP address he's posting from.  He apparently doesn't realize that the more he posts, the more information he's giving us to cut off more avenues of his abuse.  If you see his posts on other social media sites (they're easy to spot; you'll recognize them from their abusive language, attacks on people within the CoH community, and almost incomprehensible spelling and grammar), please report them for abuse on whichever respective service you find them on.

Such is the price we pay for you folks to keep the Titan Network up and running and actively moderated. 

[Nyx Nought Nothing]

If you see one of these posts, please do not respond, as this only encourages him.  Just report it to the moderator, and we'll delete the post(s) and ban the account and IP address he's posting from.  He apparently doesn't realize that the more he posts, the more information he's giving us to cut off more avenues of his abuse.  If you see his posts on other social media sites (they're easy to spot; you'll recognize them from their abusive language, attacks on people within the CoH community, and almost incomprehensible spelling and grammar), please report them for abuse on whichever respective service you find them on.

Such is the price we pay for you folks to keep the Titan Network up and running and actively moderated. 

Okay. Interesting. To me that smacks of some sort of mental disability/illness since even most trolls aren't that persistent and occasionally break character when trying to post as semi-literate ranters. i have to say you've done a damn fine job since i wasn't even aware of his existence until earlier today.

Still trying to help talk down people who are getting mislead and overexcited from some of the rumors circulating on Facebook. As are most of the other posters i see there now. Not that i'm catching them all since i don't spend most of my time watching my Facebook feed and rarely look at the groups specifically.

[Illusionss]

+1

I don't care if he was technically correct or not.

The announcement was self serving only and wasn't helpful whatsoever.

I dont know this Robert person and i am not watching his FB page. This is probably for the best. So of course i cannotknow his true motivation. From this point of view what he did looks self serving in the extreme. I am wondering if his little outburst isnt responsible for much of the ire present online this weekend.

I have said it before: this game is near and dear to tens of thousands of hearts. You'd best bring your game-face and your professional calm attitude to the fans when you discuss such a sensitive issue as a possible sale. Because when you present yourself as a mouthpiece you hold the players hearts in the palm of your hand.

I hope for Robert's sake that this deal goes through. If not, he has made himself a mighty handy target for the playerbases' rage and frustration. I am not condoning that behavior. I just know human nature. He'll get blamed for the failure - if it fails - and i frankly would not be him.

Thank you to Tony V for his calm and professional summation of what we know now at the start of the thread.

[duane]

As a moderator for a super group I too have had the experience of a reoccurring rambling incoherent personality showing up on our doorstep on the website or in game on a semi-regular basis.  Weekly, monthly and then absent for months and up to a year.

Each time a different account, but always the same mode: incoherent ramblings coupled with bizarre expectations or very specific personal attacks.  All you can do is recognize the signals of the coming storm and take appropriate actions.  At best the person could contain themselves for 24 hours before hell broke loose.

I always thought it was just us.

[Feycat]

Honestly, I feel like everyone who is NOT directly on the Hail Mary team - especially Robert, and unfortunately Ironwolf - should have kept their mouths completely shut. If they're not active members of the team, it is not their announcements to make.

I feel like Ironwolf was trying in good faith to let the community know what's up, but in the end all it did is divide and upset people when there's no whiff of a guarantee that any hype will pan out.

I feel like Robert was just trying to self-aggrandize and stir up admiration for work he has no hand in. He needs to sit down and zip it.

If Hail Mary DID ask folks to release this information in such a half-assed and uncontrolled manner, I've got very little faith in them running the game well, frankly.

This whole thing has been cruel and divisive, and should never have been brought up at all until the answer was yes.

[Kaos Arcanna]

Honestly, I feel like everyone who is NOT directly on the Hail Mary team - especially Robert, and unfortunately Ironwolf - should have kept their mouths completely shut. If they're not active members of the team, it is not their announcements to make.

I feel like Ironwolf was trying in good faith to let the community know what's up, but in the end all it did is divide and upset people when there's no whiff of a guarantee that any hype will pan out.

I feel like Robert was just trying to self-aggrandize and stir up admiration for work he has no hand in. He needs to sit down and zip it.

If Hail Mary DID ask folks to release this information in such a half-assed and uncontrolled manner, I've got very little faith in them running the game well, frankly.

This whole thing has been cruel and divisive, and should never have been brought up at all until the answer was yes.

If Ironwolf had NOT spoken up at the start, there wouldn't have been another buy attempt in the first place.

That being said, I would probably have gone into silent running myself once the original stink was raised on Facebook. But the buyers were well aware of Ironwolf's comments here and on Facebook. I have enough faith in him that I am sure he would have kept silent if they had asked him too.

[alphajaybo]

Honestly, I feel like everyone who is NOT directly on the Hail Mary team - especially Robert, and unfortunately Ironwolf - should have kept their mouths completely shut. If they're not active members of the team, it is not their announcements to make.

I feel like Ironwolf was trying in good faith to let the community know what's up, but in the end all it did is divide and upset people when there's no whiff of a guarantee that any hype will pan out.

I feel like Robert was just trying to self-aggrandize and stir up admiration for work he has no hand in. He needs to sit down and zip it.

If Hail Mary DID ask folks to release this information in such a half-assed and uncontrolled manner, I've got very little faith in them running the game well, frankly.

This whole thing has been cruel and divisive, and should never have been brought up at all until the answer was yes.

Honestly I Feel IronWolf has done a great job, he hasn't made anything public that they didn't want making public (Atleast I don't think he has) And he has been honest since day one. He has said on Numerous occasions  that this might not pan out. For the whole facebook thing It seemed a little too hyped and, although Not malicious Got alot Of people excited for what maybe good, bad or nothing at all.

[Number9]

Not too many people really care enough about CoH at this point to go through all that effort, not as seriously as it takes.  If people stop to think about it, combined with the Unreal 4/CoH2 and "technical testing from NCSoft" clues, I don't think it's going to be a big shocker finding out who's behind these nonetheless awesome and admirable efforts.

I read this as "all signs point to MWM." Which makes sense, they've raised money, they have CoT in the works, they have the motivation to get the CoH IP, and they are represented at both Dragoncon and PAX this weekend which fits in with the expected announcement Monday.  So MWM is an odds on favorite for THeM.

Personally I've mixed feelings about that.  First, if CoH returns thats a win full stop.  But, for any future project I would hope they would keep the CoH brand and world, call a successor game "City of Heros: Titans" or something.  MWM seems like they have a long way to go yet until they would be ready to develop and manage a MMO - its not just creating the world, learning the game engine, coding, and writing plots but its also customer service, professional and secure website, marketing, on and on.  If they are THeM and they get back CoH then perhaps they can raise capital and rehire some Paragon folks and others and really get the ball rolling; Im sure thats their hope.

I guess this whole time I was just hoping for a Tucker type but with deep pockets to pick up CoH.  Wishful thinking on my part, shows how much comic books have influenced my reality lol.

EDIT:  also, just because MWM has said that they would continue to develop CoT, that does not mean that if they acquire CoH that suddenly the nature of what CoT wont change.  I think CoT would have to change, otherwise whats the purpose of getting the CoH IP? As I said, "City of Heroes: Titans" 2016/17 - Im putting all my imaginary stacks on money on that bet.

[Harpospoke]

It's much more subtle and insidious than that.

The character would be broken, so if you had Incarnate stuff partially unlocked you'd be unable to do it the hard way. You'd have no record of running the unlock arc, so you'd have to run it again, but running it again would likely not fix the situation because you already have the badge, and nothing happens when you finish the arc.

Ouroboros portals are in a similar boat, because Sentinel didn't export temp powers I don't think. But the portal is granted once at the moment you earn the Entrusted with the Secret badge, and you can't earn it again if you already have the badge...

Unlockable contacts you have the badge for but not the requisite internal token are yet another issue.

None of that is something any old GM could fix; it would take senior developer-level surgery on the character data. I really doubt anyone is going to want to open the door to tickets like that coming from every single player.

Like I said before, Sentinel+ exports were "best effort" and never intended to be used with a commercial relaunch. We considered that the least likely scenario in which they would be needed. The best you can hope for with that is probably extracting the costume and maybe a mids build in order to know what to slot.

That's a nice explanation.

The part that piqued my interest was the part about exporting a Mids build...didn't know we could do that.

[Harpospoke]

I knew when I started this it would not be easy.

Nothing that is worth having is easy to achieve.

Ha!   Explain my girlfriend!


Wait...what?

[Illusionss]

I feel like Ironwolf was trying in good faith to let the community know what's up, but in the end all it did is divide and upset people when there's no whiff of a guarantee that any hype will pan out.

This whole thing has been cruel and divisive, and should never have been brought up at all until the answer was yes.

I have no problem with what Ironwolf did. I am grateful to him for giving us all hope. It is a shame that some take that kindness and run the crazy train off the tracks with it. Ironwolf has always been appropriate and realistic in his statements. He kept us in the loop just enough.

Its stuff like "well if they dont make an announcement Monday THEN I WILL!!!!" That kinda raises my hackles. Wow. That takes all kinds of nerve, tbh.